Net54baseball.com Forums

Net54baseball.com Forums (http://www.net54baseball.com/index.php)

- Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions (http://www.net54baseball.com/forumdisplay.php?f=2)

- - 1/2 GRADES (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=88611)

Posted By: Eric BrehmI was curious to know how frequently SGC has been assigning their 1/2 grades, so I looked it up. For the issues I sampled, the rate of 1/2 grade assignments (as a fraction of the total cards graded with or without the 1/2 grade bump at each whole grade level) varies between about 15% and 30% for grades 7/7.5 and 8/8.5. Here is the data for all of the half grades: For T206: * of 99 total cards graded 8 (SGC 88) or 8.5 (SGC 92), 20 were given 8.5 (20.2%) * of 713 total cards graded 7 (SGC 84) or 7.5 (SGC 86), 139 were given 7.5 (19.5%) * of 6709 total cards graded 5 (SGC 60) or 5.5 (SGC 70), 1520 were given 5.5 (22.7%) * of 6163 total cards graded 1 (SGC 10) or 1.5 (SGC 20), 3405 were given 1.5 (55.2%) For 1933 Goudey: * of 217 total cards graded 8 (SGC 88) or 8.5 (SGC 92), 31 were given 8.5 (14.3%) * of 695 total cards graded 7 (SGC 84) or 7.5 (SGC 86), 185 were given 7.5 (26.7%) * of 2569 total cards graded 5 (SGC 60) or 5.5 (SGC 70), 620 were given 5.5 (24.1%) * of 904 total cards graded 1 (SGC 10) or 1.5 (SGC 20), 527 were given 1.5 (58.3%) For 1952 Topps: * of 510 total cards graded 8 (SGC 88) or 8.5 (SGC 92), 92 were given 8.5 (18.0%) * of 1470 total cards graded 7 (SGC 84) or 7.5 (SGC 86), 444 were given 7.5 (30.2%) * of 2197 total cards graded 5 (SGC 60) or 5.5 (SGC 70), 825 were given 5.5 (37.6%) * of 141 total cards graded 1 (SGC 10) or 1.5 (SGC 20), 92 were given 1.5 (65.2%) As would be expected, there is a higher percentage of EX+, NM+ and NM/MT+ graded cards associated with the more recently produced issues, with the exception of the 8/8.5 grades for T206, which could be an anomaly of some sort, or just small sample variation. Perhaps similar half-grade upgrade rates can be expected from PSA when they begin using their new grading system. By the way, SGC's 10-100 grading scale does not include grades that are equivalent to 2.5, 3.5, 4.5, 6.5, or 9.5 on the traditional 1 to 10 scale; they currently use only 1.5 (Fair), 5.5 (EX+), 7.5 (NM+), and 8.5 (NM/MT+). Here is the SGC grade distribution for the three issues: <img src="http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r143/ebrehm1/sgc_gdist_t206.jpg"> <img src="http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r143/ebrehm1/sgc_gdist_33G.jpg"> <img src="http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r143/ebrehm1/sgc_gdist_52T.jpg">

Posted By: Jeff LichtmanEric, I'm still trying to digest your work but in the meantime, some conclusions: 1) I hope you're an accountant, actuary or math professor -- otherwise I suspect you're experiencing an unfulfilling life; 2) You clearly have too much time on your hands (would you like to help out on a federal narcotics trial in Manhattan next week?); and 3) We need to find you a hobby, one that takes up some of your free time. Do you collect coins? Or stamps?

Posted By: Eric BrehmJeff, you guessed it, I am a semi-retired mathematician. Just can't keep my hands off the data. Numbers speak better than words, anyhow. Not sure how much I could contribute to a narcotics trial, is there some analysis of some sort that is needed? And baseball card collecting is enough (probably too much) of a hobby for me at the moment, thanks.

Posted By: JimBEric, Thanks for the data. That is great. JimB

Posted By: Stevemath aside, another submission popped and of 50 hi grade cards exactly 1 was given an in between grade. These cards wre all 7, 8, and 9 caliber. Methinks the half grads are going to be for the cards that have large spreads between grades. Steve

Posted By: Jeff LichtmanPSA is hilarious! They are making everyone spend all this money for resubmissions -- and then in order to make more money on the deal, PSA only spends the time and resources to break out one card out of every 50 submitted! Never get cheated, Joe!

Posted By: Bob"I don't know - it's hard for me to see that there is such distinction within these higher grades that they could create such a subtle "fade" within a grade as you approach the next grade. It would make more sense in the lower grades where the condition can fall off dramatically within a grade (the great 2's versus the borderline beater 2's). But for the higher grades, I guess I'm surprised that such a detailed level of discrmination is possible." Well said, Joann. I was thinking the same thing but you said it very eloquently.

Posted By: Eric BrehmEven with the existing PSA system, I often have a hard time distinguishing between say, a '7' and an '8', or between an '8' and a '9'. And I have often scratched my head over some of the grades that PSA assigns, in all grades. But, SGC, GAI, and Beckett have been using half grades for a long time, so there must be some method to the madness. We'll see what PSA comes up with. I think they are in it to make money, yes, but I'm not so cynical as to think that they are just trying to rip everybody off.

Posted By: SteveJeff The two examples I have posted about were from raw submissions not resubs. I thought I made that clear. Steve edited to add I see that the 2nd post i failed to mention that. I have yet to see a resub pop. Steve

Posted By: Jeff LichtmanBut Steve -- if only one of 50 cards merits the new half point grade, doesn't that suggest that PSA will rarely give it out whether on a raw submission or resubmission?

Posted By: SteveJeff I have no idea, all I can do at this time is report what i have heard and seen. At this time I have heard of at least 10 RAW subs popped (around 1000 cards) and the .5 grade has been issued less then 7% (more like 5%) of the time. IMO the bumps are going to be issued to cards where a substantial spread in price between grades exists. The best pct thus far was to someone who had 2 cards out of 14 grade out with a .5 grade. Both those cards IMO have substantial spreads between grades too. One was a 68 Bench rookie the other a 53 or 54 Satchel Paige. I think both were 7.5's but am not sure. Could be 8.5's. If I was to resubmit any cards for this 'bump' Id make sure that they had substantial spreads in price. I wouldn't do it for commons just to raise my registry ranking. Steve