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-   -   1956 Ted Williams #5 - Line variations over name (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=243208)

56Horsehide 08-05-2017 10:22 AM

1956 Ted Williams #5 - Line variations over name
 
I would like to learn more about the different line color variations over the name on the '56 Ted Williams card. My questions: How did this happen or what might have caused it? Is one variation more common than another? Is there any difference in card values due to a certain color line? I "Googel'd" his but found nothing very specific about it. Thanks for the help.

Jim

ALR-bishop 08-05-2017 12:03 PM

Jim---the line "variants" in the 56 set happen in many of the cards. They have been pointed out for some time, but not aware of any premiums to date. I think they are just print offsets

Dick Gilkeson I think listed it in his variations publications from the late 80s and early 90s and Richard, who posts here as brightair lists it in his lists

https://sites.google.com/site/richar...riations-lists

http://www.oldbaseball.com/refs/Vari...ifferences.pdf

56Horsehide 08-06-2017 04:24 PM

"Thank You!", Al. I appreciate your reply and the links you provided. Will be looking at my cards in more detail now that I know what I am looking for.

Jim

JollyElm 08-06-2017 05:40 PM

3 Attachment(s)
These were graphics I created a few years ago for a thread somewhere on this site, but I'm not sure which one it was, so I'll load them up here. They show a couple of different things to look for and has three different versions of the upper line color variation…

Attachment 282970

Attachment 282971

Attachment 282972

Harford20 08-07-2017 03:14 PM

Using the line-over variations
 
For my Ted collection,
So far, I just use the line over variations with the card-stock color.

Topps (Gray Back)--Green Line Over Name
Topps (Gray Back)--Yellow Line Over Name
Topps (Gray Back)--Lt Blue Line Over Name
Topps (White Back)--Yellow Line Over Name
Topps (White Back)--Green Line Over Name

While, I acknowledge the variances that Jolly posted, most all are based on card-stock variances. Finding each variation above is not difficult, although finding a PSA/SGC 7 or higher grade card is MUCH easier for the Gray back/Lt Blue Line and the White back/Yellow line variations than the others. There are no premiums for any variation over the other.

Dave

steve B 08-07-2017 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harford20 (Post 1688207)

While, I acknowledge the variances that Jolly posted, most all are based on card-stock variances. Dave

????????????????

Cardstock can't create cropping differences, and the cropping differences are always matched with the color.

Steve B

56Horsehide 08-07-2017 07:34 PM

All good stuff, everyone - Thanks. For what it is worth, I have a PSA 7, Gray Back, Yellow line. Need to dig it out and verify it against JollyElm's examples. Jolly, what color backs are on the two "yellow" lines you show?

Jim

vintagetoppsguy 08-07-2017 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harford20 (Post 1688207)
For my Ted collection,
So far, I just use the line over variations with the card-stock color.

Topps (Gray Back)--Green Line Over Name
Topps (Gray Back)--Yellow Line Over Name
Topps (Gray Back)--Lt Blue Line Over Name
Topps (White Back)--Yellow Line Over Name
Topps (White Back)--Green Line Over Name

While, I acknowledge the variances that Jolly posted, most all are based on card-stock variances. Finding each variation above is not difficult, although finding a PSA/SGC 7 or higher grade card is MUCH easier for the Gray back/Lt Blue Line and the White back/Yellow line variations than the others. There are no premiums for any variation over the other.

Dave

There is also a red line variation and a no line variation.

I disagree on the premium. Price guides may not reflect it, but I believe there is.

ALR-bishop 08-08-2017 07:14 AM

If someone is trying to complete a full list of the possible Williams variants, such as the one listed by Hartsfords ( or one expanded as you suggest David), I would assume there would be some scarcer versions that would draw a higher price among collectors competing for a full "set"

My guess would be that those seeking one example for a set or player collection would not care much which version they picked up if the card otherwise met their condition parameters

The line differences are not limited to Williams, and in general I have not noticed premiums for such cards. Williams may be an exception ...as he usually is :)

I wonder if one spent the effort it would turn out all cards in the set have atleast one line variant.

JollyElm 08-08-2017 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 56Horsehide (Post 1688300)
All good stuff, everyone - Thanks. For what it is worth, I have a PSA 7, Gray Back, Yellow line. Need to dig it out and verify it against JollyElm's examples. Jolly, what color backs are on the two "yellow" lines you show?

Jim

Hey Jim.
When I made those graphics, it was through ebay screen captures, so I have no info on the backs.

--elm

Harford20 08-08-2017 03:13 PM

Steve,
The color of the ink on the card was different (one brighter/deeper than the other) between the gray and the white card-stocks. When I first read about the cropping variations, the cards I looked at with a given crop (either the hat or the shirt lines) seemed to correspond to the ink color and the corresponding card-stock color. I'll admit, the sample size I looked at was not large (and maybe I assumed it was ONLY the card stock difference a bit early). If there are cropping variances within the same color card-stock/same color line Ted cards, I have not seen enough cards to catch that.

David,
As I have not seen the red line and the no-line variations, are these available with both card stocks? Are these the versions that seems to have a premium cost attached?

Dave

steve B 08-09-2017 12:51 PM

AH, ok that makes sense.

I read it as you saying the differences were caused by the cardstock, rather than being consistently on one stock or another.

I can see the lines being consistent within a print run. These were all laid out by hand, and I don't think much care was taken to make them identical.
That's a bit odd, there should have only been one piece of original art, they must have been using a picture and assembling the team names onto the picture when they assembled the mask. It's probably a bit easier to make the names and position/team boxes all at once, but it leaves room for a LOT of mistakes and sloppiness.

I checked my two, and I've got the green line (like the top card ) with a white back, and one with a very thin blue line with a gray back.



Steve B



Quote:

Originally Posted by Harford20 (Post 1688607)
Steve,
The color of the ink on the card was different (one brighter/deeper than the other) between the gray and the white card-stocks. When I first read about the cropping variations, the cards I looked at with a given crop (either the hat or the shirt lines) seemed to correspond to the ink color and the corresponding card-stock color. I'll admit, the sample size I looked at was not large (and maybe I assumed it was ONLY the card stock difference a bit early). If there are cropping variances within the same color card-stock/same color line Ted cards, I have not seen enough cards to catch that.

David,
As I have not seen the red line and the no-line variations, are these available with both card stocks? Are these the versions that seems to have a premium cost attached?

Dave


bnorth 08-09-2017 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JollyElm (Post 1687883)
These were graphics I created a few years ago for a thread somewhere on this site, but I'm not sure which one it was, so I'll load them up here. They show a couple of different things to look for and has three different versions of the upper line color variation…

Attachment 282970

Attachment 282971

Attachment 282972

I checked mine and it is like the middle one. Yellow line, Teds Jersey has the dark line cut off and the small shadow, and a white back.

Now to bring the slab into it. I have the very old SGC slab that just has the SG on the flip. I know that has to add to how rare it is.;)

JollyElm 08-09-2017 03:12 PM

Hey, I found the original thread I referred to earlier. It was from 2014…

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=185244


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