Bryce Harper
 

“Baseball’s tired,” he says. “It’s a tired sport, because you can’t express yourself. You can’t do what people in other sports do. I’m not saying baseball is, you know, boring or anything like that, but it’s the excitement of the young guys who are coming into the game now who have flair. If that’s Matt Harvey or Jacob deGrom or Manny Machado or Joc Pederson or Andrew McCutchen or Yasiel Puig — there’s so many guys in the game now who are so much fun."

I think he's pretty spot on. Baseball's history and traditions are awesome, and I love it as much as anybody, but I'm so sick and tired of some stiff smug guy, self-appointed maintainer of decorum of unwritten rules, bitching about how someone threw the wrong pitch up by 7 runs or smiled running around the bases . . . .bla bla bla. I though Bautista's famous bat flip last year was awesome. Let's show some emotion where it's warranted. So much for all these stupid unwritten rules.

Re: Bat Flip

Take a good look at Hosmer's Big Hit in the World Series last year. He had a heck of a bat flip and NO ONE said a word.

i agree with the op...baseball needs an adrenaline shot...maybe bryce or some of these other exciting youngsters are the one(s) to do it!

I take a slightly different view. I love that there are still plenty of old school enforcers and that there are plenty of younger, flashier players. The clash between the two styles makes for compelling viewing.

I won't begin to argue the merits of baseball's unwritten rules. I think they're so often inconsistent and contradictory, but this rift between old and new does a lot to keep the on field tensions high, which I think further fuels in game/season/rivalry competiveness. I like that there's still at least a little anger left in the game... And an occasional "reason" for a pitcher to knock someone down.

Yeah lets turn baseball into the NBA and get some music and lights going between pitches! Maybe even get the Lakers Girls to become Dodgers Girls and work the foul lines. Baseball is fine the way it is.. why does everything need to be recreated? There is plenty of fire and emotion in the game. The NBA stinks, I think the NFL stinks and is boring. Leave baseball alone, why mess with tradition.

The celebrations in other sports especially basketball and football are out of control. Celebrating a damn free throw. Celebrating a layup when your team is down by 25. Or a sack when your team is long since out of the game. Every play, it seems sometimes. I think baseball is the right mix of decorum with the occasional spontaneous demonstration for an appropriately big moment.

I'm a diehard Baseball guy but I am fully for guys being fired up, he's 100% right that the game needs more fire and emotion!

How about just running out your plays, Bryce? That would make me more excited about you. Oh, and baseball is doing better than ever, by the way. If you're bored, please go do something else, it doesn't need you. Really.

+1 to both of these comments

Laker Girls coming to Baseball. I'm IN for more viewing :D

"Baseball is fine the way it is.. why does everything need to be recreated?"

Maybe that's true for 50 year old men. I have two boys who I have to drag to a baseball game . . . .yet they play baseball for hours on end with their xbox . . . .

I agree the celebrating in basketball and football has gone way over the top. But baseball is way too far in the other direction. When a guy hits a home run in a championship game and people bitch about a bat flip . . . c'mon . . . .

The Hispanic players play in the winter leagues and its amazing to see the celebrating on the field, the clowning around, the sheer joy. Maybe we don't need all of that in the major leagues but a dose would be fun. Ditto for the Korean professional leagues.

You know who was the biggest showboat in the history of the game. Babe Ruth of course. He would talk trash to half the infield while he was circling the bases. For some reason no one has ever called him out as the poster boy for bad on field behavior.

The knock on him his first two years was that he continually tried to make plays when nothing was there and would nick himself up. He failed to run one ball out in August of a disappointing season which led to a brawl with one of the biggest knuckleheads in the game. And the reason baseball is on the uptick is because it has the greatest influx of young talent the game has seen since the 1950's. Harper is at the top of the list and arguably one of the three most important players in the game. I'm all for the "un-written rules" debate and personally feel the game could use a little of both sides of the argument, but to slam Harper for a lack of hustle implies you haven't watched him at all.

Babe Ruth talking trash to half the infield? Other than the called shot in 1932 when retaliating for the Mark Koenig snubs I don't think that Ruth did much out-of-line on the field? He did jab at the Cubs as he circled the bases that day.

I just put in a quick call to one of Ruth's best biographers and one of my SABR buddies he said no way.

I think baseball does lack some color but it comes from the business like way many of the guys play the game. In the 1930's and 40's you had guys coming from tough times, baseball was a relief from everyday life where their fathers worked in the fields or the mines.

Now many American players are bred for the game much like tennis kids or golf kids. Parents take them to hitting or pitching coaches everyday or they hit in cages after school each day. The days are gone where a kid just comes from nowhere to the bigs. Harper is is the poster child for this type of player along with Heyward. Their stories have been told over and over on the air and in print.

The latin players today are reflective of the old school American players of the early days of the game save the steroid influence in many of their countries.

I don't mind the occasional celebration of a big moment like the Bautista bat flip, but if hitters made a regular practice of showing up pitchers, or vice versa, I would not care for that. Can you imagine a pitcher running over to high five the shortstop after a key strikeout? Yuck.

Am I the only board member 50 years or older who got a chuckle out of this?

Like ice hockey?
 

Let the pitchers and batters go at when the batter charges the mound?!:eek:

+1

Actually, it was Only One Play...

How about we mention Him Running Through the Wall.
oR
Sliding Head 1st inta 3rd & tearing up his thumb cartilage.

The Guys a Phenomenon in the Making!

What he said has a bit of truth to it.
Maybe he's as tired of the Steroid era as most of us are...
Maybe He's a Kid that just loves the game as much as we do
& just wants ta have some fun!?

I don't really know... But it Sounds Good :)

The unwritten rules of baseball are what help keep it the national pastime. There are some unwritten rules that I don't agree with including: going hard into 2nd to break up a double play. It's the SS / 2B's responsibility to get out of the way as they know it's coming and people complain about the runner trying to help his team out. Another complaint is that a lot of people don't agree with a player bunting to break up a no hitter. Is it the opponents job to give up and be part of history in a negative way just to serve an unwritten rule? If you're not trying to win, why be out there? Just my 2 cents.

This opinion will come as an unpopular one...but as a whole...baseball fandom is very quickly fading away. Both of those leagues mentioned, continue to gain more and more of the share of viewers/supporters/fans. The median age of fans of Major League baseball, continues to increase, and are at an all time high..while the median age of the NFL and NBA fans continue to be stable, and relatively low in comparison.

A lot of us collect, because we love the game of baseball, and the history of the game. But todays generation couldn't care less about baseball. It's actually becoming pretty tough to find many under the age of 20, that even follow the MLB. This isn't an ultimate deciding factor...but, for comparison..25-30 years ago, you could walk into an elementary school and ask a bunch of kids who their favorite MLB player was..and 50 kids would quickly blurt out Mark McGwire, Ken Griffey Jr. Frank Thomas, etc.... But if you were to walk into an elementary school today, and ask the same question..very little, if any of them, could even give you a single name of a MLB player.

MLB, unlike the NBA and NFL has done a horrible job of marketing its individual players, and marquee teams over the past 15+ years. I'm afraid is finally starting to catch up to them, as the popularity of the game, will continue to dwindle. So, I can see why guys like Harper would make comments such as these...as the game needs a MAJOR shot of adrenalin.

As I quickly approach 40, I'm not chuckling anymore:D, as I realize 50, 60, are right around the corner. Man it goes fast!!!

I get the kids argument, but aside from not fully grasping all the various intricacies of the game, I don't think I viewed and appreciated baseball much differently as a kid, as I do an adult. Not to be the "in my day" guy, but I do think with the advent of Sportscenter highlights, smartphones, internet, scrolling tickers on many TV stations, that overall attention spans and patience are dwindling these days... I think it's a bummer. As a young kid who played a lot of baseball, I loved watching the game as it was, without many frills. I loved its history ('86 WS and Curse of the Bambino hooked me forever), or the little tidbits my dad would feed me. As a player circled the bases after a HR, I may ask, "Why aren't they smiling Dad?"... "because they've done it before". I would then take those learned mannerisms (plus Will Clark's crazy facial expressions) back to little league, trying my hardest not to gush after a big hit, or great fielding play... trying my hardest not to smile when pitching to my best friend (usually we'd make it a pitch, and then start grinning.. I'd pull my bill low and try to hide it with my glove). It's all just part of the quirky personality of the game I loved then, and still love today.

That being said, I have no issue with genuine, non choreographed (unlike Prince Fielder dumbass "exploding" at home plate after a walk off vs Giants) celebration. I include Bautista's bat flip given the gravity and emotion of the moment... and I have no issue with all the old school red asses that get all hot and bothered by these antics. The game today has become a great world melting pot, a mix of personality and style, reverence for the past, and cap tipping respect to contemporaries (see Matheny to Bochy post 2014 NLCS). I love it all, and hope these aspect all remain in semi-balance to each other.

I agree in part, but think baseball made a lot of mistakes that go above and beyond the "style" of the game. I think it's poorly marketed itself for years, not fully capitalizing on its star power, and it's historical importance. I think things like interleague, though maybe temporarily raising interest levels for a week or two during the regular season (it barely tips the scale anymore) really undercut the overall interest/novelty/anticipation of the AS game and WS. In the past, these were the ONLY times the two leagues' players faced each other. I think baseball also fell victim to ESPN's every other Sunday Yankees v Red Sox hype machine, which lasted over a decade, and which turned a 3 hour game into a 4 hour game.. with extended commercial breaks, in game interviews, and players milking camera time. This in turn also lessened national interest in anything not NY, or Boston, which was nuts because there were always so many other potentially compelling match ups each year.

I think a shot of adrenalin may come in form of better marketing the game/players (Harper, Trout, Correa) especially those in mid/smaller markets, shortened commercial breaks... and very possibly also a growing interest in gambling related things like fantasy, and daily fantasy (if they survive). The NBA immediately jumped on board with daily fantasy and the NFL, however unpopular/hated the league itself is becoming, seems will be carried for years by growing interest in fantasy football. If baseball can latch onto something like that (sucks in lots of casual fans in office leagues, etc), maybe coupled with fewer parents allowing their kids to play football, perhaps its relevance regrows steadily. Even if not, local cable deals and per game ratings during the regular season are better than ever, and making owners more money than ever. It seems it's just the national audience for the postseason that's been hurting.

I'm old school in very many ways but I thought the Prince Fielder Walk off Celebration was one on the best things I ever saw in baseball. I much preferred that to Kendry Morales jumping wrong on home plate and missing 2 years of his career

Loosen up and have some fun

I hated it in part because it was vs the Giants in the heart of a tough, eventually failed late season playoff push... but I also think many/most pre-rehearsed celebrations come across as lame. IMO, only a select few pull it off with the right style and tone... most just come across a baggy (TO running to the star or pulling out his sharpie, Joe Horn with his hidden cell phone in goal post--- very bad... Angry John Baldwin squatting and crapping the football after his SB TD--- vulgar... Chad Johnson legally changing his name to Ochocinco--- hilarious).

Of course, this is all a matter of personal opinion and no one is "right". I don't really care that people fall on different sides of this argument, nor do I hold varying opinions against anyone (please keep on loving Prince's explosion at home). I am happy to see the game is still relevant enough for this argument, and will say again, I think this style clash makes the game much more fun.

Agreed.

"Flashy" just means "craving attention" and in this era of social media, that's what everybody is all about. Sitting on the bench because you're not good enough to start? No problem, develop a dance routine for when the guys who are playing score, that will get you some attention.

I want to watch a baseball game. I don't care about the shopping mall / amusement park attached to the stadium, I don't care about all the crap about the "marketing" of individuals or of the sport itself, if you don't don't think baseball is "exciting enough", if you think a three hour game is "boring", good, go to a football game, enjoy all the hoopla "squeezed" into the three hours that it takes to play a game a game that has a clock that runs for four 15 minute quarters.

The ridiculous thing about Bautista's comments regarding the bat flip was that he legitimately made it a Latin thing, saying those players play with more flair, so American fans and players should just accept it.

As someone who has covered winter ball the last four years, the Latin players don't accept any showboating like he did. If he did that during a Dominican winter league game, he wouldn't have made it to first base without the benches clearing. Latin players in Mexico, Venezuela and the Dominican clear the benches over a lot less and they do it often. It's a 2-3 times a week occurrence.

So in reality, what he is saying by "accepting it" is I'm going to do it and we are going to fight over it.

Adding flair and fire is fine with this 60-year-old...I just don't want to get to the point were taunting is tolerated...that's garbage!

I have never been one to believe in extended celebrations - at the plate -or anywhere else.

I keep going back to The Bard for advice...'The play is the thing'.

Tim Duncan & Barry Sanders come to mind when I think of professionalism.
.
.
The frequent excuse is 'it's a young man's game'. That's fine, but those instant millionaires need to show respect for those who came before - they would not be making so much if thousands before them had NOT made so much...THOSE guys made the game watchable.

Dwindling? 74,000,000 people went to MLB games last year...

Do you own the team? Then why do you care how many people are there?

A baseball game is a beautiful event meant to be enjoyed as it unfolds, whether there are 60 people in the stands or 60,000.

It's the only major professional team sport where the game isn't over until it's over, no matter how many runs you are getting beaten, it POSSIBLE for you to win. The 2004 Red Sox are a nice place to look.

Every other major professional team sport hits a point at nearly every game, where one team is done, and it is impossible for them to win, yet, the game continues.

Agree with response to comment about "dwindling", I think this is probably overstated. Baseball has never been better attended, has never been more regularly viewed in teams' local markets, and has never made more money. I do still stand by my comments about reasons I think postseason ratings have dropped off, but think baseball is on to something with the single game wild card, and a 5 game LDS series in which 0-2 deficits have been overcome several times. More potential elimination games, better viewing for those folks whose team may no longer be in it.

I consider myself an old school fan, who as others have commented, will love the game regardless... but at the same time, hope baseball continues to draw in more casual & national audiences, without fundamentally changing what makes it great.

No matter what the sport, I say you let the scoreboard do the "talking".

Jose Bautista will fall in line with Robin Ventura.

When his baseball career is over, the only thing he will be remembered for was that bat flip. Just like Ventura is only remembered for the knuckle sandwich Nolan Ryan served him.

I was at Robin Ventura's walk off grand slam single for the Metros. An amazing moment at old Shea.

Seems Gossage is not too fond of the game today...
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/gossage...2369--mlb.html

Goose going off on just about everything

Agree...Goose is a tad bit out of control!!!!

As Earl Weaver said, you can't run a play into the line and kill the clock. You've got to pitch to the other team and give them a chance. And I think he added, that's what's so great about this game.

. . . any minute someone will be quoting the old George Carlin Football and Baseball routine . . . .definitely a classic

Kind of telling that Gossage came up with two Hispanic players.

Maybe Gossage is only offended when people with brown skin celebrate too much.

To me if you win a game you have reason to celebrate. If you hit a homer in the third inning you can round the bases and sit down. I think a big moment deserves celebrating though and don't think there's anything wrong with it. When a closer wins the game I don't have a problem with some fist pumping.

I must have watched him a lot more than you, or you would have seen what I have. The Papelbon incident was one of many like that, at bat and in the field. He hustles like crazy when he feels like it, but will also fail to run out a ground ball or fly ball, or fail to come in quickly to field a hit in the outfield, and some of them have cost the team bases in close games. This attitude started spreading among the Nationals, and I saw both Escobar and Ramos either fail to run out fly balls or go into a home run trot on balls that hit the wall and stayed in play. He won the MVP on stats, but he actually might have been the least valuable player in terms of team unity and cohesion. Harper's an enormous talent, but he seems to consider himself above the game. Most Nats fans are thrilled to have such an exciting young talent on their team, but I'd rather win.

That's a 3% drop from 10 years ago even though the US population has increased 8% during that time.

Actually, it's been many plays he hasn't run out, or hasn't hustled to field, and it's cost the Nats bases in close games. Then this attitude started to spread to other players. An enormously talented team had a dysfunctional, poisonous season last year, and the most talented of them all just might be part of the reason.

Hank,

We'll have to agree to disagree. Happy collecting.


“We're used to it,” said Ryan Zimmerman to Amanda Comak of the Washington Times following Monday's game. “I would rather him not go all-out into the wall, ever. But that's the way Bryce plays. That's the way he's always played, and I think some people look at it as a bad thing, maybe, and that's why people boo or don't like him. As a player and as someone who plays the game, if you play that hard every day, there's something to be said about that. And that's what Bryce does.”

It's certainly funny how 2 Folks can Differ...
But I will certainly Bow ta Your expertise...
Seein how You & Bryce are both Phenom's :)
I've had a lot of fun watchin about 70% of Washington's games
& Trackin Harper's Day ta Day Performance
fir the Last 3 years. I somehow miss'd what You've mention'd :cool:

No Worries Aye... Just a Game ;)

Yes, the overall interest of the game is dying. That's great that 74,000,000 people went games last year. The season ticket managers, and sports marketing teams, are doing a great job of getting local butts in the seats. But outside of the local markets that these teams play, there isn't much fanfare. You couldn't get kids these days to sit down and watch a game of baseball on TV...unless of course, you tempted them, with the newest Iphone or offered them money.

I don't care how many fans are in the seats whether its sold out....or just a handful of people....... good or bad, its not a true reflection of the current trend in lack of interest to the game. It's about National as well as and Global interest, TV/ratings, Revenues, and marketing. And yes..you mentioned, that the mlb, leagues, and individual teams are making record amounts of money....but so is every other one of the Big 3 sports.

That's awesome that you have this great emotional attachment to baseball being a "beautiful event." It sounds like you truly have an understanding of the game, and appreciate the intricacy's and strategies that really does make it a great game. But I'm confident in saying, that because its not fun and interesting to the younger generation, that less and less people are watching, year after year. Its been a slow transition, but its picking up momentum. So, since less and less people are watching......there are that many less people who don't ever have the opportunity to "fall in love" with the game as you have over the years. So people like yourself who love the game, for the game itself will always say that its still a great game, and that's its relevant, and that it will always be "Americas past time." Unfortunately, You and those like you that are proabably40+ 50+ years of age, and/or people living in a local MLB market where there is some emotional attachment to a team, and to MLB baseball are the only ones still saying that. The rest of the Country no longer cares.

And I think its sad.

With my job I'm surrounded by young kids, and I can say with certainty across the board that baseball is absolutely in decline in terms of winning the attention of young people. Of course this is only my experience, but I feel confident in saying this observation is analogous to most of the country's youth.

That said, baseball is making so much money, I'm really not worried about it falling off the map anytime soon. But down the road is another story...

And with regards to what Harper said, I definitely agree that the sport needs to modernize, to ignite some more sparks. Speed up, even. But I don't think that acting like a douche like Harper does is the right way to do it. The dude doesn't even know how to pronounce "meme" correctly, how's he going to win over the youth?

this is good stuff, and the hobby needs the younger people to care. you might've read the "hobby is dying" mantra in the 1930s, 1950s, 1970s, 1980s publications etc...but that was different the actual game was thriving. watchers' demographics keep going up...i see more erectyle dysfunction and bph ads within half an hour of a baseball game than an nba game's worth. instead of glorifying their stars baseball actively try to take them down with ped accusations and the like. too many unwritten rules started by white guys in the old day that want the game to still be played the white way.

i do have hope for manfred tho...i think he's a progressive commisioner.

One thing about the 74 million is those people are coming for the games for not only the games but also for the whole atmosphere of being at the game. There is so much going on now at a ballpark that the game is just part of the whole experience.

And if you look at the attendance figures back in the day when there was very little "flair" you will see most of these teams barely made 1 million fans.

I remember the Joe Horn cell phone game on ESPN and through it was hilarious. Look, the NFL has the nickname of the "No Fun League".

I know many of you hate to hear this -- and as someone who is old school in many ways -- there is trepidation in writing this -- but we need to accept the train has passed and these sports need to get more modern and with the times. And if you want baseball to get back in popular young culture to where it was, then accept the modern era. That's the way we'll get the kids back.

Regards
Rich

Baseball is trying to get more modern every year. I recently heard that players can send instagram pictures of themselves while playing aka on deck while taking swings. It's sad that to keep up with the changing times baseball has to force its players to lose focus on the game itself and cater to the 8 year olds who already have 3 ipads and 5 cell phones

I also wanted to point out the difference in MMA vs. Boxing

I love Boxing but that was yesterday; MMA is today. Note the difference in the fan base and the ages. Again, look at all the flair in MMA.

Regards
Rich

As for declining interest I see a change in the positive direction. I have served on the board of our Boys & Girls Club for 20 years, we are the local baseball program.

Our numbers dipped a decade ago and now they are soaring again. We started a Fall baseball league about 5 years ago and we have to force them to end it at the end of October so the fields can rest.

We hear over and over again from parents that they want to keep them in baseball to stay away from football. I have heard for all of those 20 years that soccer is coming on and it will replace baseball. Baseball numbers here in the south are a multiple of soccer. I attended a high school soccer game last year and their were 30 people in the stands and all of the moms were on their phones or reading a magazine.

Youth baseball including the travel teams, or as I like to call them "buy your kid a position teams" are growing each year.

Baseball is alive and well.