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Posted By: <b>petecld </b><p>I hate to think I'm lossing my objectivity because I have NO sympathy for this fool but look at:<BR><BR><a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1826548598" target=_new>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1826548598</a><BR><BR>I LOVE IT!!!!!!! Every now and then sweet justice is served. This greedy (bleep) is so pathetic on so many levels it is scary. <BR><BR>Quite honestly, going by the picture in the original auction, it didn't look all that oversized to me to begin with. <BR><BR>If there is a sucker born every minute then this guy represents a very full, robust, 60 seconds of time.
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Posted By: <b>john</b><p>the original seller gave this guy the idea i guess,saying to cut this card down and it would be mint.... plus the seller lied and said he paid 95 cents more than he really did!
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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>I love how he interposed the photo of the cut down card over the SGC holder (at least it looked like that to me).
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Posted By: <b>MW</b><p>Warshawlaw --<BR><BR>You are correct.<BR><BR>Here's the <a href="http://www.bmwcards.com/chatboard/w514jackson.jpg">original card </a><BR><BR>Note the identical serial numbers. If the card was removed from the holder and "trimmed" by mazman9, then wouldn't SGC assign a new serial number to the card when it was resubmitted?<BR><BR>My perception is that mazman9 not only made a mess of the card, but he's now trying to mislead potential bidders.
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Posted By: <b>runscott</b><p>...he simply cracked the case and re-inserted the card, then re-scanned - look carefully at the edges and you can see a few stress marks. Looks like it's fooled at least two people already! Back to my original point of how nicely SGC holders crack.
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Posted By: <b>MW</b><p>Scott --<BR><BR>You are correct about the card being reinserted but you are not correct about it being difficult to identify a resealed SGC holder. The difference is quite obvious; I simply didn't look at the holder. If glue was added and the seller attempted to reseal the holder, it would be even more apparent; you can tell from the "whiteness" around the edges.<BR><BR>Nice try, however.
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Posted By: <b>runscott</b><p><img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>
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Posted By: <b>MW</b><p>The question is not whether I looked at an image on eBay. The question is whether you could fool me in person with a resealed SGC holder.<BR><BR>Anyone can alter images on the Internet -- there's really no need to reseal holders if you are trying to fool someone on eBay. A card can simply be cut and pasted from one holder to another using any of a number of graphics editing programs. The most important question is whether it can be done in person and it should be clear to anyone, including you, that it can't.
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Posted By: <b>Julie Vognar</b><p>for--God knows how much over $1000. Following the ridiculous suggestion of seller, he took it out of the sgc holder and tried to trim it with an exacto knife. He made a mess. Posted in his auction are 1) the messed-up card and 2) the SGC holder he removed it from. <BR><BR>WHAT ARE YOU GUYS TALKING ABOUT?
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Posted By: <b>MW</b><p>Scott and I were discussing the third image.
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Posted By: <b>runscott</b><p>Michael - I hesitated to mention this, because it might just mean that I have poor eye-sight, but I DID get an SGC-graded card about three months ago that I couldn't crack out without shattering the heck out of the case. After finally getting the card out, I was convinced that someone had busted the case and then glued it together - bonding the plastic together much better than SGC's original entombment process. If that's true, then I must not have looked at the case very closely to begin with, or maybe it just wasn't obvious. I figured it was probably an early SGC job from a "time" when they had tighter-fitting cases, but who knows?
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Posted By: <b>MW</b><p>there's a rumor that SGC seals <b><i>YOUR</i></b> holders just a bit tighter than everyone else's.
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Posted By: <b>runscott</b><p>Looked more like a very good "crack and re-seal" job to me, which wouldn't be near as difficult with SGC holders as it is for PSA.
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Posted By: <b>Julie Vognar</b><p>what third image? Do you mean the original card, in the original auction, before messing-up, in the sgc holder, sgc 80? Otherwise, i don't see any third image. There is a new configuration in the present auction: the messed=up jackson is huge, and right next to it, there is an empty sgc holder, also huge.
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Posted By: <b>runscott</b><p>We were talking about the bottom image that shows the "butchered" version of Jackson placed back in the cracked-open holder that it was in originally.
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Posted By: <b>MW</b><p>Scott --<BR><BR>SGC "elephant seals" about one out of every 150 holders. I'm sure that's what happened to you.
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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>Thanks for posting the scan. That was a damn nice card. You've got to be pretty dumb to crack out a card like that and try to trim it.
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Posted By: <b>Brueso</b><p>the trimming was a crazy (and greedy) thing to do, but on top of it- he did such a BAD JOB- looks like he used a butter knife! You'd think he'd either get really sharp surgeon's scissors or at least use a paper cutter.
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Posted By: <b>Brueso</b><p>...besides which, the card BEFORE cutting looked pretty decent. I've seen some caramel cards that I might've been tempted to cut if I owned them- not to boost value, but just because you have one of those odd corners jutting out that is like a collick- but ultimately you think, this card has been this way with this collick for nearly 100 years- I think they should stay together.
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Posted By: <b>vorthian</b><p><< Thanks for posting the scan. That was a damn nice card. You've got to be pretty dumb to crack out a card like that and try to trim it. >><BR><BR>You'd be surprised to see what dealers (and collectors) will do for an extra buck.
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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>NOTHING surprises me any more about the stupidity and greed of people.
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Posted By: <b>TBob</b><p>I am too and I agree completely.
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Posted By: <b>runscott</b><p>I just located another one of these "elaphant sealed" SGC's. It's a little smaller than the new ones, there is almost no groove along the side, and the label is slightly different (banner with 'SG' on it). Probably the same type I tried to crack before that I thought had been cracked and re-glued.
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Posted By: <b>vorthian</b><p><< It's a little smaller than the new ones, there is almost no groove along the side, and the label is slightly different >><BR><BR>Interesting. The new SGC holders are easier to crack than the previous holder and PSA is the reverse. As for cracking, they are still quite easy - just use a cudgel.
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Posted By: <b>Jeff</b><p>ditto, ditto, and ditto.<BR><BR>(I'm not a lawyer, but I do help people prepare for the LSAT!)
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Posted By: <b>jay behrens</b><p>or I am gonna assume you have been brain washed by that idiot Rush Dimbulb.<BR><BR>Jay
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Posted By: <b>BcD</b><p>or I am gonna slap and paste you to your computer screen!
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Posted By: <b>jay behrens</b><p>>or I am gonna slap and paste you to your computer >screen!<BR><BR>Hehe, I'd like to see you try <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/PoetAsylum/devil.gif"><BR><BR>Jay
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Posted By: <b>BcDaniels</b><p>Lucas or " Vorthian" <BR><BR>you are not Mr. Cut and paste Jay!
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Posted By: <b>jay behrens</b><p>aw, come on. I wanna fight <img src="/images/tongue.gif" height=14 width=14><BR><BR>Jay
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Posted By: <b>John</b><p>....but i wanted to say im glad that this card didnt sell,this guy has one of the worst feedbacks and he has lame excuses for all of his responses to his negatives,im sure when you get that many in that few transactions none were his fault.....hes poison!(check the feedbacks).....ok jay,now go back to your fighting,so far i have jay winning round one 10-9
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