Quote:
Originally Posted by Robextend
If you are talking offensive stats only and discounting the fact he was DH for a few years, Frank Thomas is better than Bagwell. I don't even think there is an argument there. But obviously if you include defense then a good argument can be made.
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Yes, defense is included which is why I put Bagwell over Thomas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobsbats
Bagwell and Frank Thomas ? Besides the fact that Frank Thomas was a DH for a long time.....both are good players, but don't belong in the same sentence as Pujols,Foxx and Gehrig.
How about names like Greenberg, Sisler, McCovey.
Maybe:
Gehrig
Foxx
Greenberg
Pujols
Sisler
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Thomas played 47% of his games at first, so we can't consider him a sole DH like we could do with Edgar or Big Papi.
I expected to get some flack (and probably more) since we are on a vintage board, but Bags and Thomas surpass both Sisler and Greenberg.
After Sisler's battle with sinusitis during the 1923 season his play had noticeably declined. In fact, after that season, he had a 97 OPS+ for the rest of his career, making him slightly below average. His prime only lasted 6 years, where as Bagwell had a prime that lasted 12-13 years and Thomas had a prime of 8 years, with a few fantastic seasons spattered in after that. Sisler ranks in the 14-16 range.
Greenberg missed a significant portion of his prime due to the war, when he was playing he was right on par with Thomas and Bagwell. Had he gotten those 3+ seasons back, he would rank right with them and I wouldn't argue if you placed Greenberg at 3, 4, or 5. The missed time bumps him down to the 5-8 range with Mize, Thome, and Murray.
The case that I always find most intriguing is Dick Allen. If he wasn't a complete head-case and avoided injuries (some of which stemming from said head-caseness), he could easily be number 3 on this list.