SGC is now authenticating autographs

[Duluth Eskimo]

Originally Posted by Mr. Zipper

I don't see why so many turn this into an all or nothing scenario. Can't we like both Jim, Richard and the credible TPAs?

I am usually pretty comfortable with authenticating the material I buy myself. But sometimes I want something and don't have the time, energy or desire to study the signature for months to develop a sound level of expertise in it. Maybe I want a Hideki Irabu signed photo and really don't feel like becoming a Hideki Irabu expert in the process... I just want the damn photo to put in my collection and move on. It doesn't make me a bad guy -- it makes me like 99% of collectors. And this is where dealers and TPAs come into play.

Of course I would prefer to patronize a longtime and reputable seller like Richard or Jim first, and if I bought from them I would have a high degree of confidence in their offerings.

But let me ask... when was the last time Richard or Jim had a Derek Jeter bat? What about an Albert Pujols ball? What about that Hideki Irabu SP... Jim can you help?

No dealer -- or small group of dealers -- is the complete solution unless you have a very tight focus.

Despite the claims of some, in my opinion, PSA and JSA are highly accurate in most cases. Certainly there are areas where they could likely improve. But they are a reliable opinion in the vast majority of cases. I would buy a Derek Jeter bat from eBay with a PSA or JSA cert with full confidence. With Mantle, Williams, Maris and DiMaggio, I can't recall ever seeing them cert a clunker. I could go on, but you get the point.

Now, if I hit the lottery and wanted to invest in a Babe Ruth single signed ball, I would not rely on anyone's sole opinion. In all due respect, if I bought one from Jim, I'd ask for a second opinion from Richard and vice-versa. If it had a TPA letter, I'd get second opinions too. This just seems to be common sense with a high value / high risk item.


* In the interest of full disclosure, I am the space consultant for JSA. I have examined hundreds of items for them and give every one my best thinking and effort. I have never been rushed, influenced to opine one way or another and I am never told who the submitter is.

This is well said and hits the nail on the head. Is also support what Shelly was saying. Why do people get so angry? IT'S AN OPINION, not the end all be all.

You have some people that act like people are saying their opinion is not as good as PSA or JSA. That's not the case either. You have others that, who the hell knows what they are talking about. Bottom line is that what Shelly said is exactly right.

As for Mr Stinson and Mr Simon. I think it's pretty much established that you both are experts in your field, but as the previous person mentioned what if I want golf or football or some other sport that you may not carry. One cannot always rely on one dealer. Nor should those people be limited to selling their items back to you if they can get more for it with a PSA letter.

Also, Jim and Richard already had their businesses well established before PSA was was created, try establishishing an autograph business nowadays without third party authentication. It would be very hard to do and I think most people would agree with that.

I read a lot of these threads and WAY too many take peoples opinions WAY too seriously. Including myself at times. Bottom line is people are free to do whatever they want and it doesn't make them a bad person or a stupid collector.

[thecatspajamas]

One thing that I think Shelly was getting at this seems to be misconstrued is that he is not talking about Jim or Richard themselves getting good money for the autographs they handle, but rather the next guy down the line realizing top dollar for that same auto when the collector goes to re-sell it. The Collector re-selling the autograph is most likely not going to have the same loyal customer base that Jim and Richard do, and unless Jim and Richard allow the collector to tap into their mailing list when it comes time to sell, they may have trouble connecting with those same customers they fought with to buy the piece in the first place. So it's really not fair to equate what Joe Collector can get for a given auto with Jim or Richard's blessing with what Jim or Richard could get for the same auto themselves. It may work out that way in some cases, but I would wager that in most, Jim or Richard will be able to get more for the same piece selling it themselves than if Joe Collector sold the same piece with a cert from Jim or Richard.

Shelly, feel free to nix all of that if that's not what you were getting at, but it seemed to me there were some crossed wires there.

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

This is well said and hits the nail on the head. Is also support what Shelly was saying. Why do people get so angry? IT'S AN OPINION, not the end all be all.

You have some people that act like people are saying their opinion is not as good as PSA or JSA. That's not the case either. You have others that, who the hell knows what they are talking about. Bottom line is that what Shelly said is exactly right.

As for Mr Stinson and Mr Simon. I think it's pretty much established that you both are experts in your field, but as the previous person mentioned what if I want golf or football or some other sport that you may not carry. One cannot always rely on one dealer. Nor should those people be limited to selling their items back to you if they can get more for it with a PSA letter.

Also, Jim and Richard already had their businesses well established before PSA was was created, try establishishing an autograph business nowadays without third party authentication. It would be very hard to do and I think most people would agree with that.

I read a lot of these threads and WAY too many take peoples opinions WAY too seriously. Including myself at times. Bottom line is people are free to do whatever they want and it doesn't make them a bad person or a stupid collector.

who is the football expert at psa, jsa? then why do you feel comfortable sending it in to them if you dont know????

why give richard a jim grief for not being experts at everything when you cant tell me who the football expert is at psa or jsa, yet you feel comfortable sending your football stuff in?

please tell me who looks at your football stuff and who authenticates it? is it the guy who signs off on the LOA "on behalf" of the team? who looked at it? YOU DONT KNOW!! Then why do you feel comfortable with them, you don't even know if they have a football expert.

wake up people!

[Duluth Eskimo]

Originally Posted by travrosty

who is the football expert at psa, jsa? then why do you feel comfortable sending it in to them if you dont know????

why give richard a jim grief for not being experts at everything when you cant tell me who the football expert is at psa or jsa, yet you feel comfortable sending your football stuff in?

please tell me who looks at your football stuff and who authenticates it? is it the guy who signs off on the LOA "on behalf" of the team? who looked at it? YOU DONT KNOW!! Then why do you feel comfortable with them, you don't even know if they have a football expert.

wake up people!

Once again you are completely missing the point which seems to be all too common in your comments. You wrongly AGAIN assume that people are using third party authenticators to give their autographs a thumbs up for own collection. As Shelly pointed out earlier and I backed him up, a lot of PSA and JSA's business comes from sellers to help achieve better margins when selling autographs.

Also, please stop the nonsense about how you can sell a rare autograph and still achieve top dollar. I think we'll all agree to give you master of the obvious award. If the mid level product that is assisted the most by third party authentication.

The point to this whole thread was that a seller and a large seller at that was "introducing" another third party authenticator without details even though he already had finished product in his hands from this company. This seems a little fishy and should make people wonder about that companies "relationship" with that seller. Especially with the high level of service that I have heard that company gives the card grading market.

[HRBAKER]

It seems that the point is liquidity and the ability to wash one's hands and move on. It is less important as a seller that the the authenticator be right or qualified to render an "opinion" than it is to get the item into a slab so it can be sold for more with "no questions asked" and "no returns?"

[mighty bombjack]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

It seems that the point is liquidity and the ability to wash one's hands and move on. It is less important as a seller that the the authenticator be right or qualified to render an "opinion" than it is to get the item into a slab so it can be sold for more with "no questions asked" and "no returns?"

It is an interesting question, but your two options need not be mutually exclusive. It so happens that at the time being, the market has determined that JSA and PSA/DNA are right and qualified to render such opinions. I mean, if a seller thinks something is fake, they shouldn't sell it, but how would a second opinion hurt, especially if buyers are asking for it?

[JasonD08]

I find that the true collectors than know their stuff do not care about COAs or even JSA, PSA, BGS, SGC. If you want to maximize profits on mainstream autos on eBay then PSA DNA comes into the picture. As far as SGC I really wish them well, but if they are going to make a dent in this market they:

1. Need to be well prices (Not $15 or even $12 per card)
2. Better website marketing this
3. Better marketing and push for this product.

If SGC would authenticate at $8 per card they would flow with an influx of business. If they try to compete with PSA DNA at this time, they just will not make it in this market. PSA gives specials at times for $10 each, I have seen it and I expect they give a few high volume guys that price or better all the time. SGC MUST undercut that to really make this work. I called the other day offering to submit 1000 cards and pretty much was told $15 was going to be the price. Coming from a guy who would love to see someone take PSA's pie on this, this business model simply will not work. Get the price under $8 each SGC or GOOD LUCK! I would imagine PSA DNA gets about 50% of the subs right anyway. It would not be that difficult for a company to step up and take this market away.

Jason

[travrosty]

when you order a pepperoni pizza, and you get an anchovie pizza, i guess since its not life or death you dont complain and get your order corrected, you just feed it to the dog, and pay the money and whatever will be will be.

[mighty bombjack]

Originally Posted by travrosty

when you order a pepperoni pizza, and you get an anchovie pizza, i guess since its not life or death you dont complain and get your order corrected, you just feed it to the dog, and pay the money and whatever will be will be.

To your earlier point, what's the name of the guy who cooked the last pizza you ordered?

I collect baseball autographs. WELL over 98 percent of the autos I've seen authenticated by JSA or PSA/DNA have been, in my opinion, legit autos. That is better than the overall numbers of autos I've looked at, and it is also better than the record of getting the correct order from pizza delivery places. Your experience has been different in boxing. I have no interest in boxing.

And I dont send autos to TPAs. I have several in my collection with those certs, but they were purchased as such.

[thenavarro]

Originally Posted by mighty bombjack

To your earlier point, what's the name of the guy who cooked the last pizza you ordered?

Ih.

LOL, nice one

Mike

[Deertick]

Originally Posted by mighty bombjack

To your earlier point, what's the name of the guy who cooked the last pizza you ordered?

(pretending i'm Travis)(In una voce morbida aumentando gradualmente di volume)

his name is papa john and he was trained by the best in the world and has. never made a error. unlike the other abc's like dominos, digiornos, and totino's. papa john would never certify pineapple on a pizza. end of discussion. wake up and stop buying pizza.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by travrosty

when you order a pepperoni pizza, and you get an anchovie pizza, i guess since its not life or death you dont complain and get your order corrected, you just feed it to the dog, and pay the money and whatever will be will be.

If they gave me pepperoni 99% of the time, and the other time they accidentally used some other hard sausage that tasted and looked like pepperoni, I'd probably eat it. But there's no way I'm eating the pup-eroni pizza from Coaches Corner Pizza.

[Bosox Blair]

Originally Posted by JasonD08

If SGC would authenticate at $8 per card they would flow with an influx of business. If they try to compete with PSA DNA at this time, they just will not make it in this market. PSA gives specials at times for $10 each, I have seen it and I expect they give a few high volume guys that price or better all the time. SGC MUST undercut that to really make this work.

Jason

SGC's website says standard authentication and slabbing will be $10 (with additional fees for "premium" signers and for oversized items).

Cheers,
Blair

[chaddurbin]

sgc currently have a deal for $8/card. psa/dna have $10 deals all the time. as a matter of fact i'm involved in one right now over at CU.

[Bosox Blair]

Originally Posted by chaddurbin

sgc currently have a deal for $8/card.

Is this somewhere on their website? Don't see it. Thanks.

Cheers,
Blair