Ripped off by a James Spence lifetime guarantee

[Duluth Eskimo]

So the bottom line is that the person did the right thing and honored his lifetime guarantee even after being thrown under the bus in a public forum. I would suggest in the future to possibly ask the person privately before being going public, but that wouldn't allow you to post on your web site.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

So the bottom line is that the person did the right thing and honored his lifetime guarantee even after being thrown under the bus in a public forum. I would suggest in the future to possibly ask the person privately before being going public, but that wouldn't allow you to post on your web site.

It's in the original link - you must have missed it.

[Exhibitman]

Strange that it took a public flogging to get a just outcome? I think not. Sometimes you need to shine a light into the corners to get the roaches to scurry.

"Publicity is justly commended as a remedy for social and industrial diseases. Sunlight is said to be the best of disinfectants; electric light the most efficient policeman."--Louis Brandeis

[Duluth Eskimo]

Originally Posted by Runscott

It's in the original link - you must have missed it.

Well, I did read the original link and I would encourage you to read it closer. It says he contacted JSA not James Spence. Yes he is part owner, but he could have just spoken with an employee. Obviously when Spence sold the ball, he was his own entity. Speak with the person Spence and don't expect some employee that has nothing to do with a former business to discuss something they had nothing to do with.

Don't get me wrong, I am not an apologist for the TPA system. I think they make mistakes, but common sense dictates that if you have a problem with a person, speak to that person first. The OP did not do business with JSA, he did business with Spence. I get tired of the stupidity that is TPA bashing. It's an opinion, if you don't like it don't use it. If you are relying solely on their letter, pull your head out of your ass and use some common sense.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

Well, I did read the original link and I would encourage you to read it closer. It says he contacted JSA not James Spence. Yes he is part owner, but he could have just spoken with an employee. Obviously when Spence sold the ball, he was his own entity. Speak with the person Spence and don't expect some employee that has nothing to do with a former business to discuss something they had nothing to do with.

Don't get me wrong, I am not an apologist for the TPA system. I think they make mistakes, but common sense dictates that if you have a problem with a person, speak to that person first. The OP did not do business with JSA, he did business with Spence. I get tired of the stupidity that is TPA bashing. It's an opinion, if you don't like it don't use it. If you are relying solely on their letter, pull your head out of your ass and use some common sense.

Common sense would also say that if an employee of a company named 'James Spence Authentication' said that a lifetime guarantee on a ball authenticated by 'James Spence' was not going to be honored, then that employee was given that line as part of the company's policy;i.e-by James Spence. If not, that employee should be fired.

But I agree that the OP should have found a way to speak with James Spence prior to posting a thread about this - at least until he reached the conclusion that James Spence was avoiding him.

I think we are in agreement that "If you are relying solely on their letter, pull your head out of your ass and use some common sense."

[khw]

it would be assumtion that when the submitter sent to jsa he included the spence letter from 1993 , and if he did then hats off to whoever failed it even with the letter , just too many facts left off , but that is a important one , still i dont care what anybody says james spence show off collectibles is not tied to jsa. when spence joined psa/dna he sold them his retail inventory i believe and stopped doing sales business anyway

[EricS]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

So the bottom line is that the person did the right thing and honored his lifetime guarantee even after being thrown under the bus in a public forum. I would suggest in the future to possibly ask the person privately before being going public, but that wouldn't allow you to post on your web site.

I did try to ask Spence privately. Not sure where you are getting this from. Did you read the original article? I had reached out to Spence to give him the chance to make this right. JSA had said they won't speak to me. They also said that the letter was written by Spence and not JSA so they had nothing to do with it.

[Duluth Eskimo]

Originally Posted by EricS

I did try to ask Spence privately. Not sure where you are getting this from. Did you read the original article? I had reached out to Spence to give him the chance to make this right. JSA had said they won't speak to me. They also said that the letter was written by Spence and not JSA so they had nothing to do with it.

You said you called JSA, not James Spence. JSA is a company with more than James Spence as an owner. If you had called, asked to speak to James Spence Jr and / or specifically sent James Spence Jr (the person) emails without response I would be inclined to agree with you more. JSA the company owes you nothing. Deal with the person you have an issue with

[shelly]

This all bull. Bottom line when Spence was Spence he authenticated a ball that has his life time guarantee on it. He is alive and well and worth a lot more now than then. If he did not know what he was doing in 1993 he should pay for his mistake. By not doing so it just proves what his word means. NOTHING

[Duluth Eskimo]

Well, he did pay for it. Maybe you should read a little closer too. You guys just don't get it. You guys are always right and never make mistakes, yet are always first to point out everyone else's mistakes. It's an opinion. If you don't like their opinion, don't use it.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

Well, he did pay for it. Maybe you should read a little closer too. You guys just don't get it. You guys are always right and never make mistakes, yet are always first to point out everyone else's mistakes. It's an opinion. If you don't like their opinion, don't use it.

Jason, that is beautifully written - your insight and logic in the above post is something that should be a model for anyone defending a TPA, or any other business with current or potential customers who question their product.

[cubsfan-budman]

He called JSA to get in touch with Spence (the JS in JSA). I mean, if you wanted to get in touch with James Spence, wouldn't you call JSA???

They wouldn't put him in touch with JS, so he caused a ruckus on the forums. Then suddenly JS is ready to talk? Sounds like Eric did the right thing.

And then JS did the right thing.

[khw]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

Well, he did pay for it. Maybe you should read a little closer too. You guys just don't get it. You guys are always right and never make mistakes, yet are always first to point out everyone else's mistakes. It's an opinion. If you don't like their opinion, don't use it.

bingo , it is what drives 50% of the discussion on these boards , crusaders . spence could have done no right , it was a losing deal, and on top of it who knows what this guy is making up or telling the truth about , life with tpa is what it is , but what would life be like without tpa? well for one the guy who bought the stengel ball would be the proud owner still of the ball. people talk about all that is bad on ebay ? what if there was nobody to send it to ? not even to send it to, but be a option that will keep some people from listing? it would be the wild west , there is also a option for anybody here or any place else to get a office , print business cards and authenticate , but the difference will be their rears would be on the line and on hauls of shame and all that nonsense , vs chiming in on a message board on how they agree something is bad. oh yeah they goof a ton but i believe the percent is pretty low vs volume done . and it is a business and it is what people want . when psa/dna certs like 20000 pieces at the national i would think some folks are on board, well my soapbox is over , but going back to like line one the whole thing boils down to do not take any cert as gospel

[djson1]

Originally Posted by khw

bingo , it is what drives 50% of the discussion on these boards , crusaders . spence could have done no right , it was a losing deal, and on top of it who knows what this guy is making up or telling the truth about , life with tpa is what it is , but what would life be like without tpa? .... , but going back to like line one the whole thing boils down to do not take any cert as gospel

You may be right about some of the things you said. But there's nothing wrong with the "crusaders" that drive many of the discussions on here. At least there are folks out there that try to help the less-knowledgeable and give their opinions without collecting a dime. I agree that many of the TPAs and the authenticators are moving targets on here, but let's face it...they make a lot of money doing something that is questionable and many of the certs out there are VERY questionable on many items. So, I don't feel sorry for them. This hobby is full of the worst POS's there can be, and so many of the crusaders' methods can be pretty viscous when they attack somebody, but I think that's because many of us collectors have been burned at least several times in our past and everyone is guilty until proven innocent.

By the way, I think I have bought items from you before (mostly FDCs)...you have a great inventory!

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by khw

...the whole thing boils down to do not take any cert as gospel

Wow! What a rant. "Imagine the hobby w/o TPAs! What would we do? OMG, who would we send things to? Who would protect us? Who would save us? And, besides, they do a fine job.

But, remember... no matter what they say, you can't really believe it."

LOL

[EricS]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

Well, he did pay for it. Maybe you should read a little closer too. You guys just don't get it. You guys are always right and never make mistakes, yet are always first to point out everyone else's mistakes. It's an opinion. If you don't like their opinion, don't use it.

No, I'm just not an "expert." He didn't have to put a lifetime guarantee on it originally. He believed in his opinion enough to do so.

And I did contact the place where James Spence works to talk to him about this ball and was told that since I did not submit the ball when it got rejected, they would not talk to me.

[shelly]

Originally Posted by Duluth Eskimo

Well, he did pay for it. Maybe you should read a little closer too. You guys just don't get it. You guys are always right and never make mistakes, yet are always first to point out everyone else's mistakes. It's an opinion. If you don't like their opinion, don't use it.

Yes, after he was forced into doing it. Twiter, Espn, other blogs and on here. There are times when you just have to do the right thing at the right time. He did not do that. Trust me there is not a person on this site that hasn't made mistakes when it comes to authenticateing. We at least admit it.

[khw]

Originally Posted by shelly

Yes, after he was forced into doing it. Twiter, Espn, other blogs and on here. There are times when you just have to do the right thing at the right time. He did not do that. Trust me there is not a person on this site that hasn't made mistakes when it comes to authenticateing. We at least admit it.

heck i have so much crap i bought a auction lot of postcards and sent a bench to psa/dna looked fine to me , came back in a holder and next day get a email it is a preprinted job , just happened i hope nobody here thinks i was out to get them , just didnt pay attention and neither did psa/dna , ended it and move on and add that to the watch list