|
|
View Poll Results: Thoughts on Kaepernick & the national anthem | |||
If I was owner of the team id cut him - he should move out of usa | 41 | 32.28% | |
Dont like what hes doing but hes got the right to do it | 66 | 51.97% | |
I like what hes protesting and id do it too | 9 | 7.09% | |
Dont care at all | 11 | 8.66% | |
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#101
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Do you think the Innocence Project has all the time and resources in the world? Your posts are really borderline now and I'm growing concerned. I have made every effort to show you that the people arrested and the people convicted and the people exonerated are disproportionately African American. That makes all your supposed crime stats moot. In Minnesota, where Philando Castile was shot dead for no reason, 47 percent of all arrests were African Americans. Do you know how much of the population African Americans make up? 7 percent. Are you seriously suggesting 7 percent of the population are in fact committing nearly 50 percent of all crime? Or is it possible that the 7 percent of the population are held to a different standard than the other 93 percent? |
#102
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Let's just agree to disagree and move on. |
#103
|
|||
|
|||
You haven't made any effort to do anything but dismiss racism.
|
#104
|
|||
|
|||
"Are you seriously suggesting 7 percent of the population are in fact committing nearly 50 percent of all crime? Or is it possible that the 7 percent of the population are held to a different standard than the other 93 percent?"
Of course not. It would have to be lower than that, unless there aren't any repeat offenders. Personal actions and attitude over the course of time don't come into play at all, right? And you haven't made any effort to do anything but have all admit it is ONLY due to racism. |
#105
|
||||
|
||||
and you are apparently ignorant of black culture in inner cities and poor communities. crime is celebrated, education dismissed as 'for nerds and white people" heroes are Scarface, drug dealers, rappers who celebrate criminal activity and pro athletes. Those who fail to become the latter have grown up in a culture that tells them that to fit in and be part of the group they should embrace crime, selling drugs, stealing...etc Parents are more likely to be separated with no father interaction than any other group, black parents are also the least likely to take a direct interest in their child's education, more likely to overspend on vanity objects over groceries and spend the highest % of income on a vehicle than any other demographic. that's not good.
when you make up under 15% of the population at large but comprise 37% of the prison population, either you think we live in 1970's South Africa, or there is a cultural problem at work in the black community. My friend LP and I were talking last night about this and he said it's sad how the culture of the black community has fallen over the last 20 years to where it is now. I,personally, think it's what happens when govt tells an entire group of people that they don't have to perform, they will save them a certain number of slots just because of their race. (not to mention the impact of generational welfare. nobody taught these families how to fish, they just kept giving them fish) but go ahead, call us all racists from your lily white ivory tower because of what some sheltered academic sociologist told you. (hint, it isn't science no matter how hard they try to pretend it is)
__________________
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away."- Tom Waits |
#106
|
|||
|
|||
You guys are unbelievable. What do you have against admitting we have a racism problem in this country we've never overcome? Do you think there is something shameful about recognizing a failure? Because I happen to think the opposite. It is shameful to ignore a problem like systemic racism. Do you disregard the Civil Rights movement as some big to do? Or can you at least admit there was a problem then, even if you won't admit it now?
Last edited by packs; 09-06-2016 at 03:19 PM. |
#107
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
You're entitled to your opinion, just as we are. Here's the difference. Your opinion is based on your feelings. Our opinion is based on facts. Last edited by vintagetoppsguy; 09-06-2016 at 03:14 PM. |
#108
|
|||
|
|||
Paint with a broader brush why don't you? I've been discussing police and their attitudes towards minorities because that is precisely what Kaepernick is protesting. What you're talking about is plain old geriatric racism and I would prefer not to hear anymore of it so I'll simply ignore you now.
|
#109
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#110
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
And in one quick google search I found stats that disagree with yours. This site has crime stats for Minnesota broken down by race. Go to page 63. https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/bca/bca...Crime-Book.pdf It lists the crimes by race. Whites outnumber Afr. Americans by more than 2 to 1. Also, according to the Innocence Project the number 1 reason for wrongful convictions is false identification, not racism! In fact, false identification was the cause in over 75% of the cases. Betting you don't respond directly to what's stated above. But maybe you're different than others on the far left. Let's see. |
#111
|
|||
|
|||
Two things for you:
1. I was talking about the area in which Castile was stopped and murdered, not the state as a whole. 2. The issue with identification is simple: it was the black guy, officer. Except, surprise, it wasn't. Or, alternately, it was a black guy, officer. Probably that black guy that you happen to put in front of me, but maybe not. Last edited by packs; 09-06-2016 at 03:32 PM. |
#112
|
|||
|
|||
So you're saying that of the 212, 159 (75%) were in there because a white person committed the crime instead?
|
#113
|
|||
|
|||
I would never suggest that because that's insane to suggest. What I am suggesting is that there are plenty of people out there who see one black guy as all black guys. It wouldn't matter who you put in front of them, if they're black that was probably the guy.
|
#114
|
|||
|
|||
Yes, there are still problems.
The civil rights movement in the 60's was right to try to correct what they could. And there are some things today that need fixing. But....I find it also racist to say as many liberals do something along the lines of " These poor people can't fend for themselves in any way unless we give them our help." Guess what? Nearly every group in this country has been oppressed and fairly seriously at different times. Nearly all of them eventually prospered by becoming part of the system and embracing stuff like laws and education. Have I had advantages because of who I am? Probably, but it's hard to separate the ones from being from a really solid family and ones I might have had naturally. I know a few people who have started with more and done worse, and some who have started with less and done better. I do know that pretty much all my failings have been because of me. Kapernick was as far as I can find an excellent student, and gifted athlete. Both of which got him advantages and opportunities that wouldn't have been open to me. (Passable student and moderately athletic) Steve B |
#115
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
So let me ask. What is the breakdown for how many of the 159 wrongly identified were identified by a black witness and how many were identified by a white (or maybe, non-black) witness? |
#116
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
And the question I asked was valid. Why is the dropout rate nearly double for black males than it is for white males? It's very relevant to the topic of discussion. My contention is that the dropout rate directly relates to the poverty rate, which directly relates to the crime rate (those arrests and convictions you speak of). Why are they dropping out? Is someone making them? Do the educators have an attitude towards minorities like you say the police do? Again, it's a fair question. |
#117
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
2. Well, even if the witness misidentified the proper black guy, it is very likely the criminal probably was still a black guy. You're certainly not implying that a witness who saw a white guy commit a crime told the police that it was actually a black guy. That's an argument a 12-year old would make. |
#118
|
||||
|
||||
Is affermative action rasism? Is it fair that a company has to hire a minority over a white person even if the white person is better qualified?
2 people vying for same job both lets say are in the low income bracket and lets say the white guy has more qualifications for that job dosnt get it cause of his skin color. Sounds rasist, no? Agian, from my piont of view i hire who can make me money, but i just always thought that affirmative action wasnt right and never made sense.
__________________
Successful transactions with: Drumback, Mart8081, Obcmac, Tonyo, markf31, gnaz01, rainier2004, EASE, Bobsbats, Craig M, TistaT202, Seiklis, Kenny Cole, T's please, Vic, marcdelpercio, poorlydrawncat, brianp-beme, mybuddyinc, Glchen, chernieto , old-baseball , Donscards, Centauri, AddieJoss, T2069bk,206fix, joe v, smokelessjoe, eggoman, botn, canjond Looking for T205's or anything Babe Ruth...email or PM me if you have any to sell. |
#119
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
I picked that statistic because I was talking about a specific incident that happened in a specific place. What does the rest of Minnesota have to do with Philando Castile's murder? He was murdered where he was murdered. The point is, maybe there was no black guy at all. Maybe the black guy was a police invention in the first place. Maybe a witness didn't see anything. Have you ever heard of Louis Scarcella? Why don't you look him up. Edited to add: I bring up the statistics I bring up in an effort to demonstrate that police bias and judicial prejudice are real things and not made up things that don't exist. That is my sole purpose in my posting, to say that these concerns are real concerns. They aren't opinions and they can't be brushed aside. It is a daily reality for many African Americans across the country. Last edited by packs; 09-06-2016 at 06:03 PM. |
#120
|
||||
|
||||
Maybe the NFL needs to implement "safe spaces" similar to some universities these days so as to protect some sensitive feelings from the open expression of Kaepernick's free speech.
|
#121
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
And to your point on the statistics you bring, since you brought it up, let me ask again. What is the breakdown for how many of the 159 wrongly identified were identified by a black witness and how many were identified by a white (or maybe, non-black) witness? |
#122
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
For the life of me I dont know why Leon continues to let you post without your full name. |
#123
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#124
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#125
|
|||
|
|||
Nessa Diab....no, that's not packs , but she may have a role in this
|
#126
|
|||
|
|||
Wow! Talk about your stereotyping?
Last edited by vintagetoppsguy; 09-06-2016 at 06:48 PM. |
#127
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
I would highly recommend not parroting everything you hear just because it's what you want to believe and do some critical thinking on your own. Again, correlation, not causation. Look it up. Or maybe reading comprehension is the root cause here? Again, no one is saying it doesn't exist. However your claim is that institutionalized racism is the reason. Bar none other, from what I can tell, since you are the only one arguing against all other possible causes. I can just imagine your solution to this. More government involvement in a problem they have institutionalized (according to you). Makes perfect sense. |
#128
|
|||
|
|||
Yeah, you got me. Clearly I'm the racist here.
Of all your attempts to deflect the conversation away from the real issue this post is by far the most laughable. |
#129
|
||||
|
||||
I have a question for dgo71 and packs. We all know about Philando Castille, Trayvon Martin, Freddie Gray, Michael Brown, Alton Sterling, Eric Garner, Walter Scott, Tamir Rice, and Laquan McDonald because you can't turn on a TV, computer, or radio without being bombarded about them. How many black men that were murdered by other black men in the last few years can the two of you name? I did all of those out of memory, so no cheating and researching names.
|
#130
|
|||
|
|||
I haven't deflected anything. The only deflection is my question going unanswered. Packs is not intellectually equiped to answer it, so here's your shot. Why do black male high school students have a dropout rate that is twice the rate for white male high school students? You (at least I think it was you, it was someone) mentioned earlier in the thread about blacks not having the same opportunities as whites. Seems like they're not taking advantage of their greatest opportunity - an education.
Last edited by vintagetoppsguy; 09-06-2016 at 07:24 PM. |
#131
|
|||
|
|||
If you read these texts and still can't understand why Kaepernick did what he did then there's nothing that will allow you to see that a real problem exists. Is this just one example? Yes. Is this the only case of this happening? Certainly not. Is even one instance such as this unacceptable? Absolutely. Tell me minorities in this area had the same opportunities as white people under this clown's watch.
http://www.vox.com/2015/5/8/8573497/...-police-racism |
#132
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
|
#133
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Boston area Busing program potluck dinner late 70's Hosted in the suburban town. Guy from Roxbury brings...........Yep fried chicken and watermelon. When the PTA ladies get all flustered and he hears "how could you?!" He simply says "What? I like this stuff!" He would be very unlikely to get a Klan membership. People are just people, and sometimes normal for them matches someone elses stereotype. Steve B PS. Awesome fried chicken, he made it himself. Fantastic cook. |
#134
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
But yeah, like i said black victims matter too. There are a lot people in jail who did crimes against black people. Trayvon Martin i really dont think should be classified like the group of black victims that are named that died in the hands of police. He was not killed by a police offer for one. Its a shame taxpayer money was spent on the trial that had no chance for a conviction. The guy that killed Travyon is not a saint and appears to have a lot of issues as well. |
#135
|
|||
|
|||
Who was killed by the police while surrendering? I can list several people who were killed by the police for FTC - failure to comply. Do you really believe your own BS?
|
#136
|
||||
|
||||
Institutional racism undoubtably exists in police departments around the world.
When american citizens tried to protest this egregious bias against African Americans they were met with, "why can't they protest peacefully?" or "riots only make things worse, they should protest without causing damage." Well, Colin Kaepernick found a way to protest peacefully. I welcome the effort. |
#137
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
BTW, I asked two questions that went unanswered, and was willing to let it go, but since you're such a proponent of addressing questions that are asked directly, here's your chance to enlighten us all. The first question from Page 2 was: You're saying there's absolutely no difference in the way police (or anyone for that matter) treat white people and black? Second, also on Page 2: If Brock Turner was black to do you think there's any chance he'd be a free man right now? The second question was mostly rhetorical and any answer would be purely speculative, but I bet anyone who asks it honestly would arrive at the same answer. Let's hear about your thoughts on #1. Tell me more about how minorities bring it on themselves. Break out some stats, because we all know there's absolutely no way numbers can be manipulated to prove any point you want them to. With a straight face, look us in the eye and tell us everyone has the same freedom to walk down a street at night without being treated differently based on their appearance. |
#138
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Name me some white people who were shot for FTC, or for any damn reason. Since apparently not complying is cause enough to be shot, let's hear those names. Plenty of black men's names seem to come right to mind, so surely, in this land of complete and total equality, there are just as many white names that met the same fate. Go. |
#139
|
||||
|
||||
Failing to comply isn't punishable by death.
|
#140
|
|||
|
|||
No, but reaching for a gun is sufficient reason to kill them.
|
#141
|
||||
|
||||
38 unarmed African American men and women were killed in 2015 alone.
|
#142
|
|||
|
|||
how many police officers were killed by people that were unarmed..i know of a courtroom officer that was killed by a prisoner who took the officers gun a few months ago that was in the news
|
#143
|
||||
|
||||
Less than 3.
|
#144
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Quote:
Again.....this disproves racial inequality HOW??? You guys seem to have a hell of a hard time staying on topic. Last edited by dgo71; 09-06-2016 at 08:09 PM. |
#145
|
|||
|
|||
So what? Thats only about half of the white men that were killed by cops. Where is your outrage there? Keep spouting your leftist loon agenda.
|
#146
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
Black: 38 White: 32 Hispanic: 18 Since there are roughly five times as many white Americans as black Americans, you would expect around 190 unarmed white deaths for it to be proportional. |
#147
|
||||
|
||||
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ut-minority-d/
Adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown of the U.S. population, he said black men are 3.5 times more likely to be killed by police than white men. But also adjusted to take into account the racial breakdown in violent crime, the data actually show that police are less likely to kill black suspects than white ones. “If one adjusts for the racial disparity in the homicide rate or the rate at which police are feloniously killed, whites are actually more likely to be killed by police than blacks,” said Mr. Moskos, a former Baltimore cop and author of the book “Cop in the Hood.” “Adjusted for the homicide rate, whites are 1.7 times more likely than blacks die at the hands of police,” he said. “Adjusted for the racial disparity at which police are feloniously killed, whites are 1.3 times more likely than blacks to die at the hands of police.”
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 09-06-2016 at 08:21 PM. |
#148
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.dcd700fd14f6 |
#149
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#150
|
|||
|
|||
The Washington Post data I read said 50% of the victims of fatal police shootings were white, 26% were black.
|
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
My thoughts for the National | iowadoc77 | Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions | 24 | 04-22-2015 07:46 PM |
Thoughts on the National... | GKreindler | Net54baseball Sports (Primarily) Vintage Memorabilia Forum incl. Game Used | 64 | 08-06-2014 04:05 PM |
2011 Topps Inception Kaepernick Auto #d 500 $95 OBO | brian29575 | 1980 & Newer Sports Cards B/S/T | 0 | 01-06-2014 04:56 PM |
Some National Thoughts | Rich Klein | Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions | 144 | 08-10-2009 11:12 AM |
Thoughts of the National... | Archive | Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions | 1 | 07-22-2004 10:54 AM |