George Sisler- Gentleman George - Inducted MLB HOF - 1939

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by scotgreb

An underappreciated all-time great in my opinion . . .

Absolutely right on, Scott. Although when I was in college, we had and played the Strat-O-Matic all-time great HOF'er's cards, together with the best of the modern players, like Mike Schmidt, Hank Aaron, Harmon Killebrew, etc. (they hadn't been inducted into the HOF at that time), he certainly wasn't underappreciated, as his card reflected his 1922 season: .420 batting average, 44 doubles, 16 triples, and 8 homers, together with 51 stolen bases. We had four teams, and all of us either wanted that card of Sisler or Gehrig's 1927 season card (.373, 47 HR's, 117 or 118 extra base hits) for our starting first baseman. We called it the "Forever Summer" league. Unfortunately, a sinus infection permanently affected and damaged his vision shortly thereafter, and although he finished with a lifetime average of .340, he was never really the same hitter after that. Also a tremendous first baseman in the field.

By the way, Pete, Bill James downgraded him in later editions of his historical baseball abstract because he didn't have enough of the seasons he compiled through 1922, but with the peak seasons he had, especially 1920-1922, I would beg to differ. Curiously, in James' first large historical abstract (later '80's?), he referred to George as virtually the only one who could go toe to toe with the Babe and not come away embarassed, giving more credit to Sisler's first three years of the lively ball era and even the fine seasons he had predating 1920 in the dead-ball era.

Best wishes,

Larry

[terjung]

Anybody have a 1927 Middy Bread of Sisler they can post? That card has been eluding me for years.

[jb217676]

Here's one of my favourites, a 1924-28 Real Photo Postcard
of George Sisler raising the flag

[h2oya311]

1914 University of Michigan Photo Card

[triwak]

Here's my Turf.

[triwak]

Originally Posted by h2oya311

1914 University of Michigan Photo Card

Really cool, Derek!!

[h2oya311]

Originally Posted by triwak

Really cool, Derek!!

Thanks bubba!

[scotgreb]

Originally Posted by ls7plus

Absolutely right on, Scott. Although when I was in college, we had and played the Strat-O-Matic all-time great HOF'er's cards, together with the best of the modern players, like Mike Schmidt, Hank Aaron, Harmon Killebrew, etc. (they hadn't been inducted into the HOF at that time), he certainly wasn't underappreciated, as his card reflected his 1922 season: .420 batting average, 44 doubles, 16 triples, and 8 homers, together with 51 stolen bases. We had four teams, and all of us either wanted that card of Sisler or Gehrig's 1927 season card (.373, 47 HR's, 117 or 118 extra base hits) for our starting first baseman. We called it the "Forever Summer" league. Unfortunately, a sinus infection permanently affected and damaged his vision shortly thereafter, and although he finished with a lifetime average of .340, he was never really the same hitter after that. Also a tremendous first baseman in the field.

By the way, Pete, Bill James downgraded him in later editions of his historical baseball abstract because he didn't have enough of the seasons he compiled through 1922, but with the peak seasons he had, especially 1920-1922, I would beg to differ. Curiously, in James' first large historical abstract (later '80's?), he referred to George as virtually the only one who could go toe to toe with the Babe and not come away embarassed, giving more credit to Sisler's first three years of the lively ball era and even the fine seasons he had predating 1920 in the dead-ball era.

Best wishes,

Larry

Thanks for the support Larry

I've not done the legwork to debate Bill James but clearly Sisler was highly respected by contemporaries based on his showing in the first HOF voting (in 1936). While not inducted, he was very well supported (11th overall), finishing ahead of 31 eventual HOFers, including two well-established active first basemen in Lou Gehrig and Jimmie Foxx.

In other news, George led the league in stolen bases four times and was also a pretty good pitcher early in his career.

Scott

[pbspelly]

Originally Posted by ls7plus

By the way, Pete, Bill James downgraded him in later editions of his historical baseball abstract because he didn't have enough of the seasons he compiled through 1922, but with the peak seasons he had, especially 1920-1922, I would beg to differ. Curiously, in James' first large historical abstract (later '80's?), he referred to George as virtually the only one who could go toe to toe with the Babe and not come away embarassed, giving more credit to Sisler's first three years of the lively ball era and even the fine seasons he had predating 1920 in the dead-ball era.

I believe Bill James once called him the most over-rated player in history or something like that, because after 1922, Sisler was essentially a singles hitter (with a few doubles here and there) who didn't walk. Don't know if I agree about him being over-rated, but it is true that while he hit .340 career, his lifetime on base percentage is .379, which isn't bad but is behind guys like Barney McCoskey, Merv Rettenmund, and Elbie Fletcher, who aren't exactly thought of as being in the pantheon of the sport. The sinus problem appears to have really damaged his career. He was a true offensive force before that (even without walking much), but had to sit out the entire 1923 season with sinusitus, and seems to have lost much of his power afterwards.

[Paul S]

.

[Brian Van Horn]

New pickup:

[T206Jim]

Very faint, but still hanging on.

Sisler-ball.jpg

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by pbspelly

I believe Bill James once called him the most over-rated player in history or something like that, because after 1922, Sisler was essentially a singles hitter (with a few doubles here and there) who didn't walk. Don't know if I agree about him being over-rated, but it is true that while he hit .340 career, his lifetime on base percentage is .379, which isn't bad but is behind guys like Barney McCoskey, Merv Rettenmund, and Elbie Fletcher, who aren't exactly thought of as being in the pantheon of the sport. The sinus problem appears to have really damaged his career. He was a true offensive force before that (even without walking much), but had to sit out the entire 1923 season with sinusitus, and seems to have lost much of his power afterwards.

The decline in his hitting was due to the permanent damage done to his vision by the sinus infection. While he continued to have some decent years after that, even George himself said "that wasn't really hitting" when commenting about them. It is interesting to note the change in James' attitude about him from the first edition of his historical baseball abstract (in which he proclaimed him as the only player of the early '20's who could actually go toe to toe with Ruth and not be embarassed) to his later comments. When concerned with the number of peak years he had (several of which were during the dead ball era), he could indeed stand tall. .407 with 19 HR's in 1920, followed by .379 and 12 (?) in 1921, capped by the .420 year in 1923. He was, in addition, quite likely the best fielding first baseman in the game. Even in the early days of the lively ball era, his achievements could seldom be matched. A very worthy HOF'er indeed!

Best wishes,

Larry