NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-16-2017, 05:06 PM
Rookiemonster's Avatar
Rookiemonster Rookiemonster is offline
Dustin
Dustin Mar.ino
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Nj
Posts: 1,451
Default Why does roger clemens cards still out price Greg maddux?

What's the reason here? Greg maddux was obviously clean, a champion, hofer,great stats and likable. Not that I didn't like Clemens but with all the speculation around him you would think his cards would be cheaper then maddux.
__________________
Just a collector that likes to talk and read about the Hobby. 🤓👍🏼
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-16-2017, 05:13 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
D3nn!s B@!!ou
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 1,903
Default

Clemens was a badass is why.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-16-2017, 05:20 PM
bnorth's Avatar
bnorth bnorth is online now
Ben North
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: South Dakota
Posts: 10,226
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Econteachert205 View Post
Clemens was a badass is why.
^^+1^^ Clemens was awesome beyond belief and in my biased opinion the best to ever throw the ball.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-16-2017, 05:53 PM
BearBailey BearBailey is online now
Brandon Bailey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 382
Default

Clemens played for Red Sox and Yankees. Even though it shouldn't matter it always does. Maddux was not only better but clean but many people like strikeouts. It makes no sense but Clemens cards go for more.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-16-2017, 05:58 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 32,057
Default

Most people would much prefer to watch the ultimate power pitcher, with a borderline personality at that, than a great artist.

85-05 was an incredible two decades for pitchers. Clemens, Maddux, Randy Johnson, Pedro, Glavine.

PS Leaving aside the PED issue, I would dispute that Maddux was better than Clemens. The numbers do not bear that out.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at
https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/

He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt.

Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 06-16-2017 at 06:10 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-16-2017, 07:12 PM
Aquarian Sports Cards Aquarian Sports Cards is online now
Scott Russell
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 6,697
Default

same reason a wax box of 1985 Donruss sells for several times more than a 1987 Donruss.
__________________
Check out https://www.thecollectorconnection.com Always looking for consignments 717.327.8915 We sell your less expensive pre-war cards individually instead of in bulk lots to make YOU the most money possible!

and Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thecollectorconnectionauctions
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-16-2017, 08:36 PM
Neal's Avatar
Neal Neal is offline
Ne@l K
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: US
Posts: 1,623
Default

Maddux is boring? Just a guess ....
__________________
Neal

Successful transactions with Peter Spaeth, raulus, ghostmarcelle, Phil Garry, Don Hontz, JStottlemire, maj78, bcbgcbrcb, secondhandwatches, esehobmbre, Leon, Jetsfan, Brian Van Horn, Brian Dwyer, MGHPro, DeanH, canofcorn, Zigger Zagger, conor912, RayBShotz, Jay Wolt, AConte, Halbig Vintage and many others
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-16-2017, 09:26 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 32,057
Default

Clemens and Maddux only went head to head twice, I believe.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at
https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/

He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-17-2017, 10:20 AM
Rookiemonster's Avatar
Rookiemonster Rookiemonster is offline
Dustin
Dustin Mar.ino
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Nj
Posts: 1,451
Default

Agreed Clemens was awesome I would have expected him to be the same or less the maddux. As far as your maddux being boring idk if anyone here has seen the kris Brant prank with Mad dog. https://www.google.com/amp/mlb.nbcsp...is-bryant/amp/
__________________
Just a collector that likes to talk and read about the Hobby. 🤓👍🏼
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-18-2017, 02:13 PM
Sierra79's Avatar
Sierra79 Sierra79 is offline
Scott Silvers
member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 106
Default

If you're looking at their main brand RC and XRC cards Clemens has the 85 Topps Tiffany and the 84 Fleer Update cards, which are relatively rarer than what maddux has - the more produced 87 Topps Tiffany, 87 Fleer glossy, and no main brand XRC.

Beyond that, if you look at realized prices of their 90's inserts/parallels then most often Maddux is out pricing Clemens. For example, take a look at the sold listing for the 93 Finest Refractors for both players. Most Maddux refractors are selling for more.

Either way, had Clemens not been shrouded with the pedal controversy I think his cards would be through the roof. Both pitchers dominated for different reasons - clemens tossed k's left and right and yes Maddux didn't throw as many k's, as he was a ground ball artist. I completely agree that Clemens time with Boston and the Yanks also gives him a more dedicated fan base although the Braves and Cubs aren't too shabby.


It's kind of crazy to think that three pitchers, Clemens, Johnson, and Maddux combined for 16 CY Awards.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-20-2017, 07:21 AM
JustinD's Avatar
JustinD JustinD is offline
Ju$tin D@v3n.por+
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Birmingham, Mi
Posts: 2,884
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bnorth View Post
^^+1^^ Clemens was awesome beyond belief and in my biased opinion the best to ever throw the ball.
this.
__________________
- Justin D.


Player collecting - Lance Parrish, Jim Davenport, John Norlander.

Successful B/S/T with - Highstep74, Northviewcats, pencil1974, T2069bk, tjenkins, wilkiebaby11, baez578, Bocabirdman, maddux31, Leon, Just-Collect, bigfish, quinnsryche...and a whole bunch more, I stopped keeping track, lol.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-22-2017, 01:39 AM
Jim65's Avatar
Jim65 Jim65 is offline
Jam.es Braci.liano
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 2,277
Default

Why do Nolan Ryan's cards outsell Tom Seaver, when Seaver was a far superior pitcher?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-28-2017, 10:58 PM
AGuinness's Avatar
AGuinness AGuinness is offline
Garth Guibord
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 977
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim65 View Post
Why do Nolan Ryan's cards outsell Tom Seaver, when Seaver was a far superior pitcher?
I was thinking the same thing as I was reading the earlier posts. Beat me to the punch!
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-28-2017, 11:05 PM
AGuinness's Avatar
AGuinness AGuinness is offline
Garth Guibord
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 977
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierra79 View Post
If you're looking at their main brand RC and XRC cards Clemens has the 85 Topps Tiffany and the 84 Fleer Update cards, which are relatively rarer than what maddux has - the more produced 87 Topps Tiffany, 87 Fleer glossy, and no main brand XRC.
Looks like recent sales on eBay have the PSA 10s of the 1984 Fleer Update going for about $600 each, while the BGS 9.5s of the same card are going for $400.

I was under the impression that BGS was more desirable for modern cards while PSA for vintage, although something like this makes me wonder where the line of demarcation is for when that preference changes.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-08-2017, 01:31 PM
Davino Davino is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 68
Default

Clemens was a more dramatic pitcher, and he has 7 Cy Youngs, struck out 20 in a game, he was at the very tops of the greatest ever.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 08-08-2017, 03:51 PM
Sierra79's Avatar
Sierra79 Sierra79 is offline
Scott Silvers
member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 106
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim65 View Post
Why do Nolan Ryan's cards outsell Tom Seaver, when Seaver was a far superior pitcher?
Two numbers 7 and 5000.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 08-08-2017, 03:57 PM
Sierra79's Avatar
Sierra79 Sierra79 is offline
Scott Silvers
member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 106
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davino View Post
Clemens was a more dramatic pitcher, and he has 7 Cy Youngs, struck out 20 in a game, he was at the very tops of the greatest ever.
100% agree. Both are amongst the best with completely different styles, but Clemens was far more dramatic and had a longer period of 'dramatic' dominance. It also doesn't hurt that he played for the Red Sox and Yankees. PEDS or not, his 7 Cy young awards says a lot.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 08-10-2017, 10:40 AM
darwinbulldog's Avatar
darwinbulldog darwinbulldog is offline
Glenn
Glen.n Sch.ey-d
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Florida
Posts: 3,329
Default

If you're comparing rookie cards, most of it is accounted for by Clemens's cards being from less overproduced sets. Pretty clear to me though that Clemens was the better pitcher anyway. Statistically (sabermetrically anyway) he's the best since Walter Johnson.

The way I've run the stats, I come up with the following rankings for these guys.

Among all MLB players
Clemens: 5
Seaver: 16
Johnson: 22
Maddux: 26
Martinez: 28
Ryan: 101


Among MLB pitchers
Clemens: 3
Seaver: 6
Johnson: 8
Maddux: 9
Martinez: 11
Ryan: 38
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 08-10-2017, 05:07 PM
Davino Davino is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 68
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by darwinbulldog View Post
If you're comparing rookie cards, most of it is accounted for by Clemens's cards being from less overproduced sets. Pretty clear to me though that Clemens was the better pitcher anyway. Statistically (sabermetrically anyway) he's the best since Walter Johnson.

The way I've run the stats, I come up with the following rankings for these guys.

Among all MLB players
Clemens: 5
Seaver: 16
Johnson: 22
Maddux: 26
Martinez: 28
Ryan: 101


Among MLB pitchers
Clemens: 3
Seaver: 6
Johnson: 8
Maddux: 9
Martinez: 11
Ryan: 38
Wow, that is very interesting, look how much better Seaver was than Ryan!!
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 08-11-2017, 07:41 PM
Sierra79's Avatar
Sierra79 Sierra79 is offline
Scott Silvers
member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 106
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by darwinbulldog View Post
If you're comparing rookie cards, most of it is accounted for by Clemens's cards being from less overproduced sets. Pretty clear to me though that Clemens was the better pitcher anyway. Statistically (sabermetrically anyway) he's the best since Walter Johnson.

The way I've run the stats, I come up with the following rankings for these guys.

Among all MLB players
Clemens: 5
Seaver: 16
Johnson: 22
Maddux: 26
Martinez: 28
Ryan: 101


Among MLB pitchers
Clemens: 3
Seaver: 6
Johnson: 8
Maddux: 9
Martinez: 11
Ryan: 38
I am a huge Maddux fan, but there isn't any denying, regardless of the PED shadow, that Clemens is in a league of his own. Statistics aside, Clemens also too pitched in the steroid era against athletes who, whether or not used PEDs, were far more physically developed than players from earlier eras whom he is measured against. When he gets inducted, and he will, high grade examples of his 84 Fleer Update and 85 Topps Tiffany should see a nice bump. I think as the dust settles from the PED scandal people will take a look at him and what he acomplished with a greater sense of appreciation.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
WTB: Rare/high end Greg Maddux cards 1987-09 Sierra79 1980 & Newer Sports Cards B/S/T 3 08-02-2015 09:53 AM
Greg Maddux, David Ortiz and Albert Pujols signed cards Luke Autographs & Game Used B/S/T 3 07-13-2015 12:12 PM
Greg Maddux 3X RC PSA 9 Haybag 1980 & Newer Sports Cards B/S/T 4 09-17-2014 01:58 PM
Tom Glavine,Greg Maddux,Frank Thomas 2014 Hall Of Famers All-Star Badge Cards GALYSPORTS 1980 & Newer Sports Cards B/S/T 2 04-09-2014 05:08 PM
FS: 15-Card Greg Maddux/Chipper Jones Insert Lot PRICE REDUCTION PM770 1980 & Newer Sports Cards B/S/T 1 02-09-2014 11:44 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:23 PM.


ebay GSB