Goodwin is up

[murcerfan]

got rare?

http://www.goodwinandco.com/LotDetai...100&category=1

[Rob D.]

Originally Posted by murcerfan

got rare?

http://www.goodwinandco.com/LotDetai...100&category=1

lol

[wonkaticket]

Ok now I’m really confused apparently the OM in question belongs to the Levy’s? Was this card also turned down by REA recently Scott and why?

Scott you and your pop have seen enough of these what leads you think this one is brown curious to know?

Perhaps it is brown and I’m making a mistake?

For the record I can’t imagine these two passing off a card in a mislabel. If any two collectors know the pain of getting a bogus card in a graded holder these guys would.

Sorry if I made a mistake it just looks so black Scott….

John

[slidekellyslide]

How do you know that it belongs to Scott, Wonka?

[wonkaticket]

I got sent an email from Jim R from Jerry T asking our thoughts on the card this was after I posted the images last night. He asked if this was the example the Levy's owned. Jim also remmbers the Levy's talking about a factory cut Dolly Stark brown OM, but Jim never saw an image.

I assume this is Scott's but I could be wrong? That's why I asked above, also Rob Lifson mentioned in passing on a Stark brown OM from the Levy's as he thought it didn't quite muster up to being a true brown card. Rob saw this post and thought it may be the same card...once again though I could be wrong.

I'm going to call Scott Levy in the AM.

Another reason I think this can't be brown is the southern league brown Hindu players are not found on Texas league players hence no brown Hindu no brown OM.

All the confirmed brown OM's are also found with Brown Hindu.

Cheers,

John

[scottglevy]

Is right at least about the ownership of the card. And while I generally tend to remain anonymous about the cards that I own ... given that the card is being questioned, I'm not ashamed to admit that this is ours or that we consider it to at least possibly be a legitimate variation.

Dad and I purchased this card years ago because we happened to compare it against several black examples and saw a difference in ink color.

While I admit the color at first blush appears so dark that it must be black, when compared directly against a black OM back there are notable visual differences.

You and I both know that there are many trimmed Old Mill cards that have much lighter tones of browns --- these have traditionally been the ones we all have seen (and the one that you have pictured). However, I think that it is at least possible that a darker shade of brown (not black) exists with Old Mill. Somewhat similarly, I have personally viewed Brown Lenox cards that significantly vary with the darkness of brown - although admittedly to a lesser degree.

In all, given the uncertainty, my dad has agreed with Bill and with SGC to have a second review determine the card's final fate. If SGC deems it upon further review to be a variation I will stick with that finding. If SGC wants to take it out of circulation ... that will probably be OK too. But it's not as simple a case as it appears.

Regards,
Scott

[wonkaticket]

Scott,

Thanks for the reply, I understand what you are saying in reagards to diff color varations on OM. In fact I can lay dozens of standard OM's next to each other and some will appear off perhaps even brown...

A lot of that has to do with the strike on the card, the tone of the paper etc. However IMO brown Old Mill and even Lenox are night and day to next to the black.

I also understand the dark chocolate Lenox you're talking about but IMO it seems even more brown...images below

I hope I'm wrong and the card is brown I still need one!

[wonkaticket]

These are the real tough color combos..Jim R sold me these for 50k.

[danmckee]

Sincerely,

Dan Mckee