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#1
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Eric Show committed suicide?
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#2
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Eric Show died of drug overdose (abuse). He had taken a speedball (cocaine and heroin) and had a massive heart attack, FWIW.
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#3
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That's true, but it was mostly believed he took an overdose on purpose. Again, much like the Don Wilson saga, we'll probably never know for sure. He was troubled and was a bit of a flake but anything could have happened.
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#4
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Several people have brought up OJ, and I agree completely. I had two of his autographs from the early 80's and ended up giving them both to a friend because I didn't want them in my collection.
As for players that are known for a famous blunder or only known for one famous event, I look at it like this; I'm not collecting the player because of the blunder, I'm collecting the event because it's a part of baseball history. Whether it's Branca giving up the homerun to Thompson, or Buckner and the groundball, or Torrez giving up the homerun to Dent, or Gionfriddo taking away a homerun from Dimaggio, etc etc, it's all part of baseball history...and for the most part, all of these things are in just about every baseball documentary so I feel it's worthy of collecting. |
#5
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__________________
Steve Zarelli Space Authentication Zarelli Space Authentication on Facebook Follow me on Twitter My blog: The Collecting Obsession |
#6
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Wouldn't want autographs of OJ Simpson, Chris Benoit, Saddam Hussein, Osama Bin Laden (Don't actually know if his autos exist on the market), Adolf Hitler, Charles Manson, Fidel Castro.
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#7
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I have a Wilson/Buckner signed picture, but then again, I'm a Mets fan...
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#8
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I used to say that I would never collect Cobb, due to his racist views and general a-holeness. However, after much more reading and learning about him, I must say I admire his drive and ability. I wouldn't say no to a Cobb check.
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#9
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I agree. I'm actually waiting to find one of his checks that was signed on my birthday. So far, no luck, but I continue to look...
Last edited by Scott Garner; 04-20-2012 at 04:25 AM. |
#10
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Just my own perspective, I completely understand those that do |
#11
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Kinda sorry I sold it now that I'm a little older and appreciate the history more than the few dollars profit.
__________________
"If you ever discover the sneakers for far more shoes in your everyday individual, and also have a wool, will not disregard the going connected with sneakers by Isabel Marant a person." =AcellaGet |
#12
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I'm not fond of nightmares, so wouldn't want any serial killer personal artifacts in my home. Thought the famed Jack the Ripper 'From Hell' letter would be fascinating item to own. I didn't say I'd buy it.
Trivia question of the day: Sent to the home of the head of a volunteer anti-crime group, what was included with the From Hell letter? Answer: A woman's kidney. Last edited by drc; 04-19-2012 at 11:21 PM. |
#13
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Barry Bonds, Mark McGwire, Sammy Sosa, Jose Canseco, Alex Rodriguez, Rafael Palmeiro, Roger Clemens, Jason Giambi, Manny Ramirez, David Ortiz,...
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#14
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byce harper ooops sorry guys
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#15
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If steroids do players like Bonds no good, then why do the take them? Why do they still take them today? And if the players believe there is nothing wrong or cheating about steroids, then why do they always deny taking them, even back when they weren't banned? Roger Clemens apparently would prefer to go to prison than admit to any one he took PEDS. Bonds apparently would prefer to be convicted of a felony than admit he knowingly took PEDS. These acts show two baseball player who feel taking PEDS is cheating and feel it would damage their reputation and taint their numbers if people knew they took them. Hard to argue otherwise.
And, yes, I think Bonds was a great player before he took steroids, a Joe DiMaggio or Willie Mays type, and was the best player on steroids after. Last edited by drc; 04-23-2012 at 10:28 AM. |
#16
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Yep, no doubt Bonds was a HOF'er before the steroids, my question is, if he hadnt turned to steroids when he got older,would he have gotten to the 600 HR plateau?
If roids didnt give the players an advantage, they wouldnt be taking them. |
#17
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I never said steroids do no good. I was just stating that they aren't going to improve those I stated. Obviously they will make you bigger, stronger, not faster necessarily, and help recover from injuries/surgeries, but they aren't going to help those factors I mentioned above.
Bonds took them because he was jealous of McGwire and Sosa and wanted to chase records, smaller name players took them following injuries so they can get the paycheck to afford life after baseball and to compete, others did so to be the best and to get the richest of paychecks. But if you looked at the list of players who were caught taking steroids, a lot of them had marginal improvement because they lacked having been born with the perfect genes like Bonds for example. Bonds' eyes were so good, he could pick-up the seems on the pitchers release point and know what type of pitch was coming. And based off of where his arm would be angled, he knew whether that pitch would be in his zone or not. He never struck out, and had a pretty good average. Obviously top tier players were blessed with those abilities. |
#18
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There's a lot of us out here that have good hand eye coordination, and played one form of ball or another for several years, but that doesn't mean we were good enough to catch up to a 92 mph fastball while also being able to react to a curve. Due to the fact that a steroid user can work out longer, harder and more often with less muscle recovery time, bat speed is increased allowing the batter that extra fraction of a second to wait and identify a pitch. I'd say that's helping the batter be better.
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#19
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But I do agree to avoid an argument, it will enhance what you can enhance if used properly. Being bigger, stronger doesn't necessarily always translates well on a diamond compared to other sports. Baseball is about flexibility and range of motion. Get too large in upper body, can't really throw the ball well or swing the bat with as much fluidity. |
#20
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But we are getting a lot off topic, sorry my bad :P.
I do not avoid people, each player is a piece of history. Those who avoid OJ in my opinion is understandable. Why don't you avoid Cobb for that matter, he killed someone...Those of you who don't collect OJ, do you collect Ray Lewis? Killed someone. Donte Stallworth? Hit and run. Just curious, if you can collect Cobb, you can collect anyone else. And for those stating proof on Cobb, there were previous postings a while back on here you can use as reference. |
#21
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#22
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Pre-steroids, Bonds was an excellent player, but I see no statistical measures that would make the pre-steroids Bonds the greatest player ever. Adjusted for their different eras, Mays beats him in most categories. Pre-steroids, Bonds won 1 HR title, 1 RBI crown, 0 batting titles. Even with steroids, he failed to hit .300 for his career, earned 4 fewer Gold Gloves than Mays while playing the easier outfield position, won only 1 RBI crown and a grand total of 2 HR titles. Also, despite playing 22 seasons, Bonds is not in the top 14 in All-Star nominations. Had he not used steroids, I don't think he would have made it to 600 home runs, and I don't think he would have managed much better than a .280 lifetime BA. He would have had his 500-500 accomplishment, 3 or 4 MVPs, and maybe another Gold Glove or two - and I think he would have been regarded as one of the top 20 position players ever (behind Ruth, Wagner, Cobb, Williams, Mays, Gehrig, Musial, Mantle, Aaron, etc.). |
#23
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It doesn't matter how many times you lead the league in a statistical category, because his MVP's show otherwise, that's flawed thinking. He was in TOP 5 in MVP voting from 1990-2000, that's 10 YEARS of consistency, and won it 3 times, second once, and should have won more if you compare the winner's stats to his since that's what your basis is on. Bonds easily would have hit 600+ home runs, there is no way using steroids will give you 200+ home runs, or EVERYONE would do that. If Bonds didn't get as many free passes as he did, he would have been closer to 900-1000 home runs. He average 140 walks a year! That's absurd! Usually it's "good" if a player can manage half that many, or almost half that. One year he had over 200 walks, that is a lot of wasted at bats. Bonds IS the most feared hitter of ALL TIME, plain and simple, and while he didn't win home run titles, he couldn't. Hard to win when you have hundreds of less at bats due to walks. Last edited by HOF Auto Rookies; 04-24-2012 at 09:12 AM. |
#24
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And Ruth being mentioned everywhere as the best baseball player ever, IMO is a JOKE. He was a one dimenshional player, that's it. He ONLY could hit. A god awful fielder, base runner. I don't consider him top 5. When I look at best players ever, I look at players who can do it all, the five tools, Ruth was waaaaaay off from that.
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