Counterfeits coming from Italy

[samosa4u]

I've been trying to figure out how to write this thread and I have decided the best thing to do is to just keep it simple. I will not be discussing my own personal experience and turning this post into a nine paragraph essay. Instead, I will just point out what's been happening and how all of you collectors can protect yourselves. I have decided to use the Q&A format for this post in order to make it easy for everyone to follow.

Q: What's the problem here?

A: I have noticed a lot of counterfeits coming out of Italy. The big cards that I have caught so far are the following:

- 1968 Sicker-Verlag Johan Cruyff RC
- 1974 Ageducatifs Michel Platini RC
- 1986 Panini Supersport Mike Tyson RC

Again, these are the ones that I have caught, but there are definitely more out there.

Q: How do I protect myself? What are some of the things that I should look out for?

A: At first I was thinking of posting scans of the fakes and pointing out what to look for, but then I realized that doing this would be a waste of my time. Counterfeiters can see this post and then make adjustments to their work. So I will just post one piece of advice that will help you the most - get a loupe! This is crazy, but there are some collectors here who still don't own one! A good one can cost around $10 and it will save you thousands of dollars down the line. Now these counterfeits look really good with the naked eye and have the same paper stock, size, and colors - this is why the loupe is the easiest way to catch them. The best thing to do is to start with the reverse side. Get your loupe and examine the lettering carefully. The edges of the lettering should be smooth. If you see pixels, then this means it was done on somebody's printer (it's fake).

Q: If I buy graded ones, then I'm safe, right?

A: Nope! I have strong reason to believe that some of these fakes have gotten past graders. If you declare these cards for $75 each, then I don't think graders are going to spend too much time on them. Furthermore, graders don't use the loupe on every card (unless they are expensive). If you do pick up any graded examples, then again please check them under your loupe and look for the pixels.

If you have any questions, then please post them here or just PM me. Otherwise, just follow the above advice and you should be fine.

[Arazi4442]

Thanks for the heads up. Pretty sure I got beat on a couple Panini Tyson's about 2-3 months ago. Live and learn, I guess. I'm usually pretty skeptical of raw cards on eBay but seller had a high number of feedback at 100%.
Kind of sad you have to keep your guard up ALL the time.

[samosa4u]

Originally Posted by Arazi4442

Pretty sure I got beat on a couple Panini Tyson's about 2-3 months ago.

I think Paypal gives you 180 days to file a claim.

[Exhibitman]

There are also fake Miras coming from eBay Italy. Be very, very wary of sellers offering large blocks of clean cards.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Can you show an example of a Mira you think was fake? When I've looked on ebay Italy for Miras I see a bunch of $4 cards and a bunch recovered from albums.

[Copa7]

I was going to post about this as well. But I think it was so well put, not much to add.

I will emphasise that graded cards are NOT safe as they have less knowledge than collectors.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Can you show an example of a Mira you think was fake? When I've looked on ebay Italy for Miras I see a bunch of $4 cards and a bunch recovered from albums.

A listing by eBay seller "comeravamo17" for a 1968 Mira album and stickers (item #302784423461) described as "Album figurine tuttosport imira completo con figurine da attaccare no panini lampo", which translates as a Mira Tuttosport album complete with stickers to attach not Panini or Lampo. The title added the word "anastatico".

I was underbidder on the lot. The buyer left negative feedback stating "Everything was reprints. Seller refused refund. Don't fall for the anastatic BS". The seller's response to the negative was "I specified several times that it was anastatic at the end but it did not return it"

Anastatic printing is a printing method but this ass-clown was using that word as code for reprint. I narrowly dodged getting cheated only because I was too cheap to top an E278 (about $300) bid.

What is scary isn't that the seller is a scumbag, it is that the cards and album themselves looked damned good on eBay. Scary good.

[Arazi4442]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

I think Paypal gives you 180 days to file a claim.

Thanks! I’ll get in contact with PayPal ASAP.