I saw three very interesting items today (N310 Anson, E90-1 Clarke, E103 Lajoie)

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Posted By: warshawlaw

I was at a small show today and saw three very interesting cards:

N310 Anson: trimmed, with the ad meticulously cut away as to the top layer of paper

E90-1 Clarke error: trimmed at the top, otherwise nice

E103 Lajoie: writing on the front, considerable wear, small area colored in amateurishly in tbe background where a paper pull existed.

I had an interesting discussion as to value on these cards. The seller was focused on the fact that the cards had values in the many thousands in the book in top condition and wanted to sell them to me as a % of book. He also told me that he'd offered them to a major auction house but was refused. I, on the other hand, view cards like these as worth very minimal sums--maybe $100 or so each--mostly to have for the novelty value. One of the customers who was there had a 1952 Topps Mantle in poor condition due to glue damage at all four corners and some front surface damage, with a hefty price tag.

What do you think about assessing the values of significant cards in these low conditions?

Would the cards' sale value benefit from being authenticated by a grading service, assuming one would do so? I am certain that the Mantle would grade, obviously as a 1. The others might or might not grade (one had been rejected already for grading) but GAI would perhaps authenticate them.



[edited to change title]

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Posted By: J Levine

Pretty sure I know which dealer offered you the cards today...he has had that Anson for a few months and the Clarke nearly as long. I offered him a very small percentage of book for the Anson (n-300) but he decided to pass...the dealer usually has some bargains for me in the pre-war-early 50s and I have known him for nearly 10 years. He is a good guy and he tends to price his stuff not much higher than what he invested in it. The anson and clarke are fairly rare and might command a little premium in my mind...maybe 5-7% of high book. The others I would never pay more than 1-3% for...even the Mantle. But that is just my buying habits...

-Joshua

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Posted By: Nick Martinez

Adam,
I would value these in the 10% of book range, depends on if you could get them graded. The Mantle could go for up to 20%+, like a Wagner this card has some special power over people. It is a card that people want so they can say "I have a '52 Mantle."


Nick

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Posted By: Bryan

When it comes to the Mantle card. I have been offered $2500 for my GAI 1 1952 topps Mantle and have yet to get rid of it because I just can't force myself to get rid of "my 52 mantle."

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Posted By: Julie

front, myriad creases, corners very rounded--for a Cracker Jack Marquard, vg-ex (maybe only vg), and Mark Macrae was appalled at my giving up "a Ruth and a Johnson for a Cracker Jack Marquard." I THINK I made it clerar the condition of the beaters. I keep forgetting to ask him.

Surprised the hell out of me...both cards would have graded "poor" or "authentic."

Did you mean "N300" or something else (like a cabinet of some sort)? A cabinet with the ad trimmed off is worth a lot more than a small card with the ad trimmed off.

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Posted By: Gary B.

I ask since we live in the same general area - mind you, I'm not interested in the cards you mentioned, just curious...

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

is a Naxcom show in Van Nuys at the Airtel Plaza http://www.naxcomtradeshows.com/van_nuys.html

The dealer is Paul Markoe who is a great guy. He does not have a ton of vintage but he always has a huge inventory of lower grade cards. He is very fair in his pricing and always seems to have a little bit of everything.

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Posted By: runscott

Did you buy the Lajoie from him?

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

Scott,

I did not want to buy it as I thought it fit in perfectly with the other less than visually appealing cards you can only afford to collect.

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Posted By: hankron

For many collectors on normal budgets, owning a 1933 Goudey Ruth or 52 Topps Mantle is normally out of what they can expect to afford. When a very rough example comes along within their price range, it's nothing to sneeze at.
I've had a few chew toy Goudey Gehrigs and Ruths that I had no trouble selling at a good price, as it was a chance for the collectors to obtain one of their dream cards.

Many Net54 board members would act simularly if it was a Peck & Snyder Reds or N173 Dogs Head.

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Posted By: Bryan

OK, let's say you had a "chew toy" 52 topps mantle, such as myself. What would one expect to sell it at, and what would you buy with the cash? I ask this because it may help make my own mind up

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Posted By: JimB

I personally find it very frustrating when dealers say they are offering a card at "under book". What they usually mean is they are offering a card in good condition at less that the NM value in the "book". NM book value is almost irrelavent if the card is in poor condition. "Book" value for a fair/poor card is about 5-10% of the near mint value.
JimB

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Posted By: runscott

(exiting at God Chris' request)

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

<q>Damn, it's tough being a dollarless drunk.</q> Come on Scott, let's talk about what is really bothering you. This is merely a manifestation of a larger issue.

I am sure I speak for everyone when I say great job on the race. Would hate for the shinning moment in your life to apparently go unnoticed.

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Posted By: Chris B.

Can you two please take your pissing match to email? Its getting pretty old here.

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Posted By: runscott

Didn't mean to get your panties in a wad.

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Posted By: Chris B.

Actually I apologize Scott - after rereading your comments to Greg I now see that they are both informative and interesting with regard to vintage baseball cards.

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Posted By: runscott

First whining, now complaining about "pissing contests" while starting one of your own...that would make you a hypocrite, and not a particularly interesting one. Greg is an intelligent knowledgeable collector who I have ethical disagreements with, but enjoy spirited debates. I don't sense that you possess any of those qualities. But prove me wrong - rather than complaining that Greg and I aren't posting about vintage baseball (which we both do on a regular basis), post something of your own. For the life of me, I can't remember you posting anything. Perhaps it just wasn't memorable?

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Posted By: Rodney King

Stop hitting me officer

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Posted By: Gilbert Maines

Bryan:

Your '52 Mantle, as you know, is highly liquid. Depending on its condition it could sell for over $2000. If the card brings you more enjoyment than an equivalent value in antiquities, bullion, paintings or bearer bonds, then keep it. Since you ask what others would buy with the value from your card, I would put the $2000 to my baseball card wantlist, and buy whichever priority cards become available first.

But it sounds like you do not have an existing wantlist with priority cards. If what you are asking is what better baseball card investments are available in that price range, I have no expertise there.

Good luck,
Gilbert

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Posted By: bryan

It was more of a theory question than anything else. I am trying to put together a 52 topps set again. I actually thought about selling the card to gather some funds to pick up others from the set and then try to pick up the Mantle again at a later date. It might just be easier to keep the card and wait, especially since I don't think that the Mantle will raise in price any time soon. I have gotten some very nice offers for it though - very tempting indeed I would much rather have a very nice looking Mathews rookie if I had the chance though. I know this is not pre-war sorry guys and gals

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Posted By: warshawlaw

It is too pre-war, just depends on which war.

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Posted By: Gilbert Maines

Well Bryan, Id agree that selling the Mantle doesn't make sense if you are planning on putting a '52 set together. It would be way too hard to buy its replacement, I think.

I never understood that card's popularity though. Mantle and Mays started the previous year. But there are lots I do not understand.


My favorites from that set are Jethroe and Robinson. Both of them would steal home while the pitcher would be caught still holding the ball.

Good luck on the set, that is quite a task.

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Posted By: runscott

and replace the reprints with real ones as I picked them up. The reprints would make nice place-holders and would inspire you to replace them as quickly as possible.

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Posted By: bryan

I just may do that. I find it harder and harder to build this set now than what it was a couple of years ago when you could pick up stars and commons at a very decent price. There's the market for you