Some National Thoughts

[Rich Klein]

I've had many different ways I've attended the National and whilst the show is great; I do believe there are many ways the show could be improved

First the positives:

1) The booth fees; although they seem expensive; are actually quite a bargain. If you figure 3 tables per booth and five days (including set-up) to buy or sell material; the tables average a very small amount on a per day basis.

2) The material at the show is awesome. If you can not find what you are looking for at the National; that item may not exist

3) You can SEE what you are buying. No matter how good scans are; nothing quite matches your own eyes

4) The availability for camaderie with fellow collectors/dealers is great. In my days back at Beckett; I enjoyed hanging out at Leon's/Scott's/Richard's Booth -- and got to meet and chat with many of you. That is just one example


Now for some things I'd like to see improved

1) I'd like to have the hours changed as a buyer/seller/corporate

My structure for hours would be this (And I don't think this would cost the promoters any money)

Tues == Early Set Up (Whatever the current hours for Early Set-Up would remain. Some dealers need more than one day to set-up and others want to come early. I have no problems with the extra charge for the early set-up.

Wed; Set Up Continues Until 5 PM -- After that --from 5-9 could the Corporate/Super VIP Party. Yes; booths and the show floor would be closed at that point; but dealers would have the option of staying in the venue or leaving. The party would not be on the show floor but another room. Earlier in the day; the National would have various seminars run as well. I miss those early seminars and I'd wager many collectors and dealers would love to hear insights from other of their bretheren.

Thurs: Dealer Set Up 8 Am; Super VIP entrence 9 AM; VIP 9:30; General Public 10 Am-7 PM
Events such as Leon's soiree could be held in the venue after 7 PM in other rooms on site. More on Leon Later (as he would say it's all good)

Friday: Dealer Set Up 8:30; Super VIP 9:00; Vip 9:30; general Public 10-6.

Saturday: Dealer Set up 8:30; Super VIP 9:00; VIP 9:30; General Public 10-5

Sunday: Dealer Set up 9; Super VIP 10: VIP 10:30; General Public 11-3.

Few Notes on the Hours:

1) Dealers are discouraged from closing their booth early; but with prior permission; that would be allowed. For example; since Leon is so involved with the net 54 Dinner; if he and Scott need to leave early -- that would be planned in advance and OK'd by the Nat people. This also gives approval for the Legendary people to leave early the day of their auction etc.

2) The Sunday Issue would be that no dealer can start carrying out material until 2 PM. The booth next to me was empty at 9:30 AM on Sunday and I don't know about you -- but if I pay $25 for my family to come in at 10 AM and the 3rd booth I see when I come in is closed; I wonder what exactly I paid my $$ for.


Few Other Suggestions:

1) I mentioned Seminars earlier -- if at all possible; we need to put a couple back on the schedule each year.

2) Better "approval" from the National to work with people; even if that particular deal does not make them $$. A couple of example I really enjoy is Stadiaplex; which is a really cool postcard only show run during the National but run outside the venue. Why that can't be a small part of the show I don't know. Leon's dinner is the closest thing to a hospitality room the hobby has. I know PSA does a luncheon, more of these events would be great

3) Please reduce the admission costs to enter this show. I understand for the vintage dealers that the admission cost is a small part of the cost BUT if we really want the next generation to be interested; we need to lower the cost. IIRC; the cost to park is $11 and admission to the show is $18. I don't know about you -- but a collector of "average" cards feels the pain of spending that much before they buy the cards they need for their Derek Jeter collection. We don't want to run museum's; we want to sell cards. If it turns out that attendance is about the same with much lower admission than with the $18 admission; then we can go back to the higher rate. I just want to try that once.

4) Many of the people who Run the National and are on the Board are friends of mine for many years and they know I want the National to succeed just as much as they do. I have not missed a National since 1983 and it's the best weekend of the year for me. I just want the National to be better; not an endurance contest.

5) I know a couple of people thought the show would be great with music pumped in. I agree with them and perhaps someone can figure out a way to hook up a SATellite Radio to the PA so we could listen to various stations during the day. Leon; I agree with you that we don't want Music drowning out conversations; but just as something in the background; such as MUSAK (sic) used to be.

If I think of anything else; I'll edit and post to this thread. I'm also curious as to your thoughts

Regards
Rich

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

5) I know a couple of people thought the show would be great with music pumped in. I agree with them and perhaps someone can figure out a way to hook up a SATellite Radio to the PA so we could listen to various stations during the day.

Regards
Rich

Hey Rich,
We can talk about this over lunch today but I like all of your ideas except the music one. When you have 10k+ people in a room talking it's hard to listen to music. I would be hoarse after the first day.

[slidekellyslide]

I think some low noise level baseball music could put people into a buying mood.

A little "Joltin' Joe DiMaggio" or "Willie, Mickey and the Duke".....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRvyF...e=channel_page

[Jewish-collector]

I absolutely loved my entire National experience. The Net54 dinner was, without doubt, the absolute highlight of the trip to Cleveland. If the attendence keeps increasing, Leon will have to rent out a larger facility.

I agree with Rich that the admission price (and parking) is way too expensive. If you drive & park there, it costs $26 per day just to get in the door before you even buy anything.

I really like the National in Cleveland personally, but I think the organizers should be holding the National in additional different cities than what they are currently doing. I know next year will be in Baltimore, but then it seems to rotate between Chicago and Cleveland. Why not try other cities that have been mentioned in the past ?

During the late 1970s and early 80s, larger sports collectors conventions included seminars and discussion panels but the hobby eventually drifted into the mammoth show/autograph pavilion model. With the advance of the internet, less business than ever takes place in person and fewer discussions occur between dealers and collectors who share the same passion. I'd like to see more of these type seminars & discussions during the National weekend, either during show hours or after show hours rather than a separate "Premier Collectible Conference and Exhibition (PCCE)" show that was unsuccessfully held in April of 2008 in Chicago.

Much better & less expensive food courts. At least in Cleveland, you can't just walk outside & grab lunch. So make lunch better quality & more affordable to us poor slobs.

Regards,
Alan

[Steve D]

The change I want to see is for the National to get out of the Cleveland-Chicago-East Coast rotation.

Why not put Dallas and Los Angeles in the rotation?

I live in San Antonio TX, and the only National I've ever been able to go to was in Houston. We need to get the National to more cities, so more collectors have the chance to attend. Half the country is currently being left out of the mix, and I'm sick of it!


Steve

[Exhibitman]

Cleveland's IX Center is a shabby, shoddy, decrepit dog of a facility with terrible food, bathrooms that rival a bus station in Tijuana, and no amenities in walking distance. Shouldn't we aspire to something nicer for the premiere event of the hobby? IMO we would be far better served with a first-rate venue in a first-tier city, even if it costs a bit more. I know quite a few very "advanced" (free-spending) collectors who'd had a bellyful of Cleveland and skipped this show. Enough with the garage sale/thrift store approach. We don't need to slum it.

[Jim VB]

Maybe I'm wrong, but my understanding was that the Midwest/East Coast bias was being driven by the dealers themselves. The further west you go, the scarcer the product and exhibitors. (Especially in vintage cards, the West was still pretty unpopulated when much of the stuff we collect was distributed.)

I know the best attended National was in Anaheim, but many East Coast dealers didn't want to schlep their stuff across the country and back.

(From a retired retailer's point of view, the goal should be to schlep it across the country, SELL IT, and let someone else bring it back. Lots of guys would have to change their pricing and thinking. Novel concept, huh?)

I do know that Mike Berkus is a regular reader of the Non-Sports board. Although a good number of future events are already locked into certain cities, he may be more than willing to revisit the decision making process. I'll drop him an email and ask him if he wants to join the discussion.

[Ejm1]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Cleveland's IX Center is a shabby, shoddy, decrepit dog of a facility with terrible food, bathrooms that rival a bus station in Tijuana, and no amenities in walking distance. Shouldn't we aspire to something nicer for the premiere event of the hobby? IMO we would be far better served with a first-rate venue in a first-tier city, even if it costs a bit more. I know quite a few very "advanced" (free-spending) collectors who'd had a bellyful of Cleveland and skipped this show. Enough with the garage sale/thrift store approach. We don't need to slum it.

WOW!! MR. High End Millionare dealer/collector/pompus ass. The National is'nt all about you megabuck nerds. You got some big stones calling the I-X a dump. I'm glad you know some advanced collectors, go start a show with them and call it the Trust Fund Collectors National and only let certain tax bracket types in and you can hold it in any well heeled city you like. Glad you hate it, don't go back. Don't need you.

[tbob]

Originally Posted by Steve D

The change I want to see is for the National to get out of the Cleveland-Chicago-East Coast rotation.

Why not put Dallas and Los Angeles in the rotation?

I live in San Antonio TX, and the only National I've ever been able to go to was in Houston. We need to get the National to more cities, so more collectors have the chance to attend. Half the country is currently being left out of the mix, and I'm sick of it!


Steve

Amen. Chicago every 4th year and drop Cleveland. Baltimore next year will be great and I wish 2011 was in Dallas and 2012 in St. Louis.

[HexsHeroes]

By my count, from 1980 - 2009, the National has been held in the following cities:

7x Chicago, IL
5x Anaheim, CA
5x Cleveland, OH
2x Arlington, TX
2x Atlanta, GA
2x Atlantic City, NJ
2x St. Louis, MO
1x Detroit, MI
1x Houston, TX
1x Los Angeles, CA
1x Parsippany, NJ (across from NYC0
1x San Francisco, CA


I am sure other locations continue to be investigated, with a strong emphasis on accessibility, lodging, costs, climate, etc.

Some of the other significant cities that came to my mind for outside consideration include:

Richmond, VA
Philadelphia, PA
Pittsburgh, PA
Cincinnati, OH
Lexington, KY
Indianapolis, IN
Minneapolis, MN
Milwaukee, WS
Des Moines, IA
Wichita, KS
Lincoln, NE
Omaha, NE
Denver, CO
Reno, NV

I am sure there are some wonderful options in Oregon or Washington state too.

[Jim VB]

In talking to Mike Berkus yesterday, the first thing he mentioned is that any potential site have 300,000 square feet of exhibitor space, all on one level. Baltimore will be right at that minimum.

If that condition is met, they move on to things like hotels (prices and availability), parking, union rules, etc.

That size venue will eliminate an awful lot of potential locations.

[autograf]

Lexington KY is out.............not enough floor space. Louisville would be in based on that though. No major league teams in about 2/3 of your list above too. Typically the home team (or one of them) is home when the national is in play. Is that a dealbreaker? Not for me but just saying..........

[Jewish-collector]

Does Pittsburgh have a facility large enough ? You would think the organizers would like to take advantage of the city's success in FB and hockey.

[slidekellyslide]

[QUOTE=HexsHeroes;740400]
I am sure other locations continue to be investigated, with a strong emphasis on accessibility, lodging, costs, climate, etc.

Some of the other significant cities that came to my mind for outside consideration include:


Lincoln, NE
Omaha, NE

[/QUOTE

Neither Omaha or Lincoln have facilities large enough for the National. Lincoln does have the Lancaster Event Center which I'm sure has enough square footage, but it's spread out over 5 buildings...there is definitely ample parking and all the buildings are very close together. Would never happen though. Heck, I'd settle for a card show in just one of the buildings...the only show that goes on around here is 2-3 times at the mall...and that's just a joke...only once have I seen anyone there with pre WW1 material and it was outrageously priced.