First player to reach 3000 hits not to make the HOF?

[Bored5000]

Originally Posted by PowderedH2O

Rice comes up often as the weakest HOFer. I saw him play his entire career. Is he George Brett? Nope. But there are DOZENS of guys in the HOF worse than Rice. I have no issue with a bigger HOF where Murphy, Parker, Foster, Harvey, Hernandez, and Mattingly are right there alongside him. And each of those guys is better than many of the guys in now.

I would have an issue with that. The HoF should be harder to get into, not easier. It isn't the Hall of Very Good.

Player X is in so Player Y should also be in always serves to lower the overall quality of the inductees.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by Bored5000

I would have an issue with that. The HoF should be harder to get into, not easier. It isn't the Hall of Very Good.

Player X is in so Player Y should also be in always serves to lower the overall quality of the inductees.

Totally agree. The Hall of Fame should be the farthest thing away from handing out Participation Trophies.

There will always be passionate arguments for those who aren't in...

Minnie Minoso and Luis Tiant are the two I support for induction. I really hated the fact that Minnie passed away without that honor, but after the way Ron Santo was treated, I'm not surprised.

[packs]

You always see the Jim Rice guys who turn out whenever someone rains on his parade. And it's always the same argument: did you see him play?

So question for you guys: did you think Jim Rice was better than Albert Belle? You would have seen them both play by virtue of seeing Rice.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

You always see the Jim Rice guys who turn out whenever someone rains on his parade. And it's always the same argument: did you see him play?

So question for you guys: did you think Jim Rice was better than Albert Belle? You would have seen them both play by virtue of seeing Rice.

I saw a lot of Rice from 81 on when I moved here and I was not a huge fan, honestly. It seemed he killed a huge number of rallies with weak grounders to short. I really wonder if, overall, Evans was not a better player despite obviously not having the few megaseasons, which of course you can't take away from Rice.

[nat]

Evans was the better player. Part of the reason that he doesn't get as much recognition as he deserves is that his best season, when he led the league in HRs, was cut short by the strike.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by packs

You always see the Jim Rice guys who turn out whenever someone rains on his parade. And it's always the same argument: did you see him play?

So question for you guys: did you think Jim Rice was better than Albert Belle? You would have seen them both play by virtue of seeing Rice.

Yes.

I'd rate them pretty close overall as hitters, Belle maybe a bit better overall, while Rice had more power. I've never seen the ball get out of the park so fast. No lengthy HR calls with him up.

[NiceDocter]

The answer..... PETE ROSE

[seanofjapan]

Originally Posted by NiceDocter

The answer..... PETE ROSE

Its funny that this thread got to four pages before someone mentioned the most obvious example.

[glynparson]

Originally Posted by Bored5000

I would have an issue with that. The HoF should be harder to get into, not easier. It isn't the Hall of Very Good.

Player X is in so Player Y should also be in always serves to lower the overall quality of the inductees.

Nor is it the hall of greatest of the greats but the hall of fame. I never understood that argument. I for one am for a larger hall it is a museum there to tell the games history. so if you are a figure that contributes to the games history put them in. Allow the plaques to tell their level of greatness by their stats and their stories and contributions.

[packs]

Let Juan Pierre be the cautionary tale and most likely mirror for Markakis. In 11 seasons between 2001 and 2011, Pierre amassed nearly 2,000 hits by age 33.

He then retired 2 years later at age 35 with only just over 2200 hits.

[orioles93]

Originally Posted by packs

Let Juan Pierre be the cautionary tale and most likely mirror for Markakis. In 11 seasons between 2001 and 2011, Pierre amassed nearly 2,000 hits by age 33.

He then retired 2 years later at age 35 with only just over 2200 hits.

Juan Pierre was a singles hitter with speed. He had no power. He also couldn’t throw. Markakis is a more complete hitter and player and has been incredibly consistent over his career. He is the type of player that I think ages well. Never had a ton of power. So you don’t have to worry about that declining, and he’s always been a contact hitter with a good eye.he keeps himself in shape. I see him being an above average player for atleast 5 more years.

[packs]

Why do you think that though? He'll be 39 years old in 5 more years. The only active players who aren't pitchers that are 38 or above are Adrian Beltre and Chase Utley. Beltre hasn't been able to stay on the field dating back to last season and Utley is a role player.

[orioles93]

Originally Posted by packs

Why do you think that though? He'll be 39 years old in 5 more years. The only active players who aren't pitchers that are 38 or above are Adrian Beltre and Chase Utley. Beltre hasn't been able to stay on the field dating back to last season and Utley is a role player.

Just a gut feeling i guess. Everyone thought he was declining in his last few years in Baltimore. Not many people thought he would have many good years left. Instead he went to Atlanta and has gotten better. His double totals the last 4 years are 38, 38, 39, and 37(so far this year). His RBI totals have gone up the last 3 years, and outside of 2015 his homer totals have stayed fairly consistent. 2015 wasn't a disaster year even though he only hit 3 home runs, he hit .296/370 and had 38 doubles and 181 hits.

The main reason I think he has a chance to get to 3000 hits and remain consistent for at least 5 years is he has remained very healthy for almost his entire career. He has played 155 games or better every season in his career except his rookie year (147) and one season that he got hurt (104). Players who stay healthy have more chances to accumulate stats such as hits. I just see him staying healthy and sticking around long enough to get there.

[h2oya311]

Does the Hall look at contributions outside of just the stats? Ichiro is pretty much a household name and he brought people to the ballparks, especially in Seattle. I remember shelling out some serious coin just to get standing room tickets to see Ichiro in 2001 when the Mariners were at Fenway. He is a lock IMO, regardless of how you slice and dice it.

And, Peter, I too have always considered Biggio as a top-tier player, and was pleasantly surprised to see how highly regarded he was in Bill James' work. Good stuff!