For Sale Artifically Aged Reprints $5.00 Makes Great Gifts See Pics

[rarerookies]

Hey guys. My name is Derek. I am new on here but not to the collecting side as I have been a sports card collector for over 20 years. I am just now finding time to be able to check out these forums and what all they have to offer.

I have some artificially aged cards for sale for $5.00 bucks each shipped

Payment by Paypal, Money Orders or check..

If you have any questions or wish to purchase, please email me at
goudeyruths@gmail.com or Private Message me.

Check out my photobucket items
http://s1205.photobucket.com/albums/...ed%20Reprints/

[Kawika]

This is a joke, right?

[Chris Counts]

I don't think this is a joke. He's been trying to sell them for a week in another section of the BST. Some board members cringed (like myself) while others defended his right to sell his junk here ...

[vintagecpa]

Actually there is plenty of money to be made buying these cards. Simply buy a few of these cards and list them on eBay. Use some of the following phrases: 1. Grampa's attic, 2. Selling as reprint, but looks real to me; 3. Doesn't say reprint anywhere on card; 4. I'm not a professional grader; 5. I don't have time to send to a professional grader. From what I see, people generally bid far more than $5 on these type of listings.

[buymycards]

These aren't 20's to 40's cards. If you are going to sell this crap at least put it in the correct area of the BST.

[margoaepi]

Besides the fact that this is disgusting . . . who would want an "artificially aged" Jordan?

[Ladder7]

Please, surf elsewhere.

[rarerookies]

What's the angst? Why the sore feelings towards these cards?

I personally like these cards. And have no problem offering them for sale to people who want them. Yeah authentic is always better but like a lot of things no one can afford authentic. Rolex's, Purses, Sunglasses, generic drugs, whatever the cheap alternative to the real thing. There's always the people who can drive BMW's and those who buy Camry's.

Even though they bear no real value of any sort there is some pleasure in collecting cards that are the greatest sports cards ever. No I will never own a real Mantle 52 rookie but I own a reprint and I look at it and think what it must be like to own such a card. I look at these and appreciate the birth of modern trading cards.

derek

[rarerookies]

Yes I am sure people take advantage of unsuspecting buyers of cards. I totally agree with that. I can go to bed each night knowing that I have disclosed that these cards were reprints. Once its outta my hands its outta my hands. With some cold medicine, brake fluid and a few other ingredients you can make meth. Why don't you start a campaign to ban brake fluid and cold medicine? Products can used for good things or bad. Gun's for defending homes or for murderers, cold medicine for people with allergies or making meth and reprints for people who appreciate trading cards and one's that are used to rip people off.

Its a two sided coin.

Originally Posted by vintagecpa

Actually there is plenty of money to be made buying these cards. Simply buy a few of these cards and list them on eBay. Use some of the following phrases: 1. Grampa's attic, 2. Selling as reprint, but looks real to me; 3. Doesn't say reprint anywhere on card; 4. I'm not a professional grader; 5. I don't have time to send to a professional grader. From what I see, people generally bid far more than $5 on these type of listings.

[Batter67up]

If the cards don't say reprint on them then there is a good chance they will be sold as originals by a fraudulent person. Sell reprints with them stamped as reprint or get them out of our hobby!

[rarerookies]

Just if they are reprints they should be stamped as reprints.

Not anything like never buy anything you are not familiar with? Stay away from Grandpa's Attic sellers?

Not to say that the cards weren't made to deceive a person but an educated person in the hobby would be able to quickly identify the real from the fake. Just like buying Rolex's, if you don't know what to look for you'll get burned on the purchase.

I don't spend "real" money on something that I am uneducated on. Whether its mutual funds, cars, watches, pens, or baseball cards. If I can't explain basic ins and outs of the product I am purchasing including if there are copies floating around then I don't need to make the purchase.

I've got burned buying a fraudulent card. $800 bucks. From a guy who got it from his dad and posted it on Craigslist because he needed the money real bad.

Do you know what? I have never been burned again on cards.

Yeah it sucks that people have to ruin the hobby buy screwing people over. There's a special place you know where for them.

I guess the best way to say it. You know how you can go into an art store and buy a reprint of the mona lisa. You hang it up on the wall and appreciate the creativity and the shear shock and aww of it. Same thing with a 1933 goudey ruth reprint

[rarerookies]

This is where you get the "education and not buying from reputable sellers" lightbulb

Originally Posted by vintagecpa

Actually there is plenty of money to be made buying these cards. Simply buy a few of these cards and list them on eBay. Use some of the following phrases: 1. Grampa's attic, 2. Selling as reprint, but looks real to me; 3. Doesn't say reprint anywhere on card; 4. I'm not a professional grader; 5. I don't have time to send to a professional grader. From what I see, people generally bid far more than $5 on these type of listings.

[rarerookies]

wondering why you think that way

Originally Posted by margoaepi

Besides the fact that this is disgusting . . . who would want an "artificially aged" Jordan?

[rarerookies]

Have you ever bought a pair of knockoff sunglasses or a Fucci purse for your wife?

Originally Posted by Kawika

This is a joke, right?

[Matthew H]

Above all this is the wrong place to advertise your cards; no one will buy them here.

[Kawika]

Originally Posted by rarerookies

Have you ever bought a pair of knockoff sunglasses or a Fucci purse for your wife?

No. I don't bother buying crap.

[rarerookies]

I don't consider my stuff crap. How many people do you know that can make a card got from new to old in 3 days?

Originally Posted by Kawika

No. I don't bother buying crap.

[BlueDevil89]

Activity such as this is a scourge to the hobby. I vote for a lifetime ban from the forum for engaging in such an unethical and deceptive practice.

All those in favor...

[Robextend]

My main fear is that these cards will end up in the hands of someone that will try and deceive and eventually rip off a buyer. Of course you have a right to sell these cards, however you are contributing to one of the big problems in this hobby. On this board your actions won't be received very well.

[AndyG09]

This is flat out wrong. I am all for the banishment!

[rarerookies]

I think Nazi's and the Communist's did similar things to beliefs that they didn't like too. Screw the Bill of Rights. Just a piece of paper when people disagree. If you disagree with this please tell me you disagree with all the pirated music, bootlegged movies, knock off purses and Folex watches.

[rarerookies]

We will get rid of all the religions, democracy, and capitalist ideas that plague our society forever!!!

[quinnsryche]

Why not just stamp them "reprint" and avoid all the contention? I think you wouldn't have so much venom spit at you if you just did that. What would be the harm in an embossed stamp on the back that says what it is? Those in the hobby are the only police in the hobby, so you have to see why some are so concerned. You must realize by doing this you create a problem that doesn't need to be. Topps issues reprints all the time and no one here bats an eyelash. That's because they are clearly marked as reprints and it's all done above board. I think it's the deceptive way this process is done that makes it so offensive to most on this site. Just some insights, take them or leave them. Yes this is America, you have every right to do what you do, but it doesn't make it moral.

[BlueDevil89]

rarerookies posted - "If you disagree with this please tell me you disagree with all the pirated music, bootlegged movies, knock off purses and Folex watches."

Yes, I disagree with all forms of pirated and counterfeited products. I do not support such activities as they violate trademark, patent, copyright laws, etc., and represent a form of theft.

As for your decision to take reprints and age them to look like originals, this is a form of fraud aimed at deceiving unsuspecting consumers. Just because you are making and selling the counterfeits as reprints for only $5 each, you think that you are not at fault - but you are! You know full well that the majority of individuals interested in your service are con artists who will attempt to pass off the fakes as originals for much higher prices. You are profiting from a service that supports the counterfeit card market. (Consider - Aren't the guys who produce meth in their home labs just as guilty as the dealers who sell / distribute the illegal drugs to addicts and children?)

It's disturbing that you would compare your unethical and immoral practice to the pursuit of freedom of "religions, democracy, and capitalist ideas". You truly have a warped sense of justice, and you apparently lack the basic understanding of the concept of what is right and wrong.

I hope that you will give further consideration to this matter and recognize that you are engaging in a dishonest actitivity that promotes fraud. If your artificial aging business were to actually take off and increase in volume, you could end up being prosecuted by authorities for conspiracy as part of a counterfeit memorabilia ring. Please discontinue your promotion of this dishonorable pursuit and find a hobby that is more worthy of your time and effort.

[jb217676]

Originally Posted by rarerookies

I don't consider my stuff crap. How many people do you know that can make a card got from new to old in 3 days?

During the "aging" process the copyright line has gone missing on the back of the Wagner. If you did that you should be ashamed of yourself. These cards will eventually trickle down into the hands of somebody who thinks they are real. If you have any self respect you should burn these cards and issue an apology to these long time collectors on this forum for even showing these. One of the biggest problems in this hobby is making sure the card you buy is authentic and unaltered and these cards are a slap in the face to all of the collectors here and abroad. You sacrificed your integrity for the 1 or 2 dollars you were hoping to get for each of these cards. Stuff like this won't fly here, and I can't believe you had the guts to try and sell these here. This isn't Craigslist or Ebay, this is Net54 and you're not welcome if you try to use this site to get your fake cards out into the world. Happy Thanksgiving!
Jeff

[vintagecpa]

Using the words meth and nazi's to justify your business? Unbelievable. The mere fact that whole reprint is evenly aged except for the copyright which is completely removed speaks volumes towards your target audience and your business ethics. You should be ashamed of yourself and should feel guilty for the role you have played in all the dishonest transactions these cards have been involved in on Ebay since you started your business, even if you weren't directly involved.

[Luke]

And I'm all for banning this guy, although I doubt that will stop him from trying to make a buck at other people's expenses.

[Matthew H]

Originally Posted by rarerookies

I don't consider my stuff crap. How many people do you know that can make a card got from new to old in 3 days?

I consider your stuff crap. This garbage is a dime a dozen on eBay and Craigslist. Here, it is considered a joke. It doesn't take artistic talent to erase "reprint", dip a card and bake it. It just takes an unethical a**hole.

I agree, ban.

[Chris Counts]

Politics, religion and fakes ... has there ever been a better case for banning someone?

[doug.goodman]

I am not in favor of banning him, I am in favor of not responding to his posts, so that they drop quickly off the front page, and we don't have to be bothered by him.

And, I hope nobody responds to this post so that it will drop quickly off the front page, as well.

I'm confident that 100% of the real collectors who read these forums have the exact same initial thoughts on this guy and his "products". Arguing with him does nothing except keep him in the headlines.

Best regards,
Doug

[Griffins]

I'm in favor of banning listings for reprints.
I'm betting that will have the added benefit of effectively banning the OP.

[sbfinley]

And Leon thought this would be a calm Thanksgiving.

[Kawika]

Rarerookies: I don't have any problem with reprints in the hobby - they have their place. Charles Mandel produces a line of Helmar Brewing cards that have an "artificially aged" look which I rather like - I have even picked up a few. However, his cards are modern creations - they are not reprints which can be mistaken for a vintage issue. You paid enough rope to hang yourself by showing the Wagner back. How convenient that the copyright data didn't survive the aging process! "Once its outta my hands its outta my hands." 'Nuf ced about your ethics.
The Nazi book burning photo was a nice touch. I get it. We're fascist totalitarians because we object to your abetting fraudsters with your doctored reprints. (As a Jew maybe I should feel offended but I'm only saddened by your less-than-brilliant intellect). Actually we are merely collectors who try to enjoy a hobby despite the fact that it is ridden with every sort of scumbaggery already. You are part of the problem, dude. I don't think anyone is serious about banning you - the few guys who have been banned so far were majorly egregious douches and you are just a putz - but I do feel that you are not going to fit in with a lot of folks here.

[rarerookies]

These cards have been around long before I got into the hobby of selling reprints and they will be around long after I am gone. I bought these cards from people selling them on Ebay.

I still say its more of an uneducated buyer issue than a moral argument. If you are going to invest in something you better know about it before you invest. If not then these cards could possibly be used in fraudulent activity.

Education of buyers not demise of capitalism

Originally Posted by vintagecpa

Using the words meth and nazi's to justify your business? Unbelievable. The mere fact that whole reprint is evenly aged except for the copyright which is completely removed speaks volumes towards your target audience and your business ethics. You should be ashamed of yourself and should feel guilty for the role you have played in all the dishonest transactions these cards have been involved in on Ebay since you started your business, even if you weren't directly involved.

[rarerookies]

I actually enjoyed this conversation. Its moved on from me trying to sell reprints to an ethical and moral debate. I didn't know that there was such an anti-reprint establishment among serious collectors. I thought of these more as novelty products. Replica rolex's, coach purses etc.

I enjoyed the conversation with you guys and will respect the wishes and not post anymore reprints for sale on this site.

I still believe an educated buyer wouldn't fall for a reprint but an uneducated buyer might. But these are the same people who respond to Nigerian Chain letters, buy lottery tickets and believe every too good to be true thing that pops up in there lives.

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

I am not in favor of banning him, I am in favor of not responding to his posts, so that they drop quickly off the front page, and we don't have to be bothered by him.

And, I hope nobody responds to this post so that it will drop quickly off the front page, as well.

I'm confident that 100% of the real collectors who read these forums have the exact same initial thoughts on this guy and his "products". Arguing with him does nothing except keep him in the headlines.

Best regards,
Doug

[sbfinley]

Originally Posted by rarerookies

I still believe an educated buyer wouldn't fall for a reprint but an uneducated buyer might. But these are the same people who respond to Nigerian Chain letters, buy lottery tickets and believe every too good to be true thing that pops up in there lives.

We were all new to this hobby and uneducated at some point. An influx of new people of all ages joining this hobby is the only thing that can sustain it's growth. Saying that it is fine if they get taken by a scam artist because they "should know better" is asinine. I could care less if you want to sell these fakes (in the right section), but your responses to the legitimate concerns of fellow hobbyist should be handled with a bit less crass.

[rarerookies]

My crass to the concerns of board members fell right in line of those responses I received after the initial post.

"This is a joke, right?"

"Some board members cringed (like myself) while others defended his right to sell his junk here ..."

"If you are going to sell this crap"

"Besides the fact that this is disgusting"

I was put in a position where I felt the need to defend my post. The Nazi and socialism references were maybe a bit extreme but I had to defend the right to express my civil liberties.

A few things you should know while living in a free democracy just in case you are new to it.
1. If its on TV: Turn the channel
2. If you don't like the laws: Go Vote
3. If you don't like the product: Don't Buy It


I'll end with a quote from one of my favorite political activists.

You measure a democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists.
-Abbie Hoffman-

Originally Posted by sbfinley

We were all new to this hobby and uneducated at some point. An influx of new people of all ages joining this hobby is the only thing that can sustain it's growth. Saying that it is fine if they get taken by a scam artist because they "should know better" is asinine. I could care less if you want to sell these fakes (in the right section), but your responses to the legitimate concerns of fellow hobbyist should be handled with a bit less crass.

[rarerookies]

If I understand your screen name to represent what you do for a living I assume you are a CPA. Your profession over the last 10 years have been plagued by immoral acts that did far worse to the nation than a few reprint baseball cards. Hmm... ENRON!!

CPA's do tax write-offs here, have "business lunches" and list attic space as a home office.

It's hard to believe someone who's associates basically dove us into a recession by inflating companies net worth's, cooking books and destroying trust in financial institutions would have such a problem with a few reprints.

Hows your quarterly's looking?

Originally Posted by vintagecpa

Using the words meth and nazi's to justify your business? Unbelievable. The mere fact that whole reprint is evenly aged except for the copyright which is completely removed speaks volumes towards your target audience and your business ethics. You should be ashamed of yourself and should feel guilty for the role you have played in all the dishonest transactions these cards have been involved in on Ebay since you started your business, even if you weren't directly involved.

[bigtrain]

Prior to the unwarranted, idiotic attack on another member's legitimate and honorable profession, I was on the fence as to whether a ban or suspension as suggested by others would be appropriate. I was unreasonably optimistic that the poster could be shown the error of his ways. Obviously, that is not going to happen. The OP is morally bankrupt and has no clue as to the true meaning of the civil liberties he claims to embrace.

[Matthew H]

How much for the Ruth?

[vintagecpa]

LOL. I never thought my professional choice would get ripped on a baseball card forum. For the record, I am a CPA. I think it would be a stretch to blame the latest recession on CPA's (or Enron). I don't know a single CPA that sold a sub-prime mortgage. Yes, when I prepare peoples taxes, there is a certain amount of "writing off" that occurs. But there is this minor detail called the tax code that guides us as to what is legal and not legal. Most everything is in black and white. A very similar code exists with copyright laws. But I'm sure your not interested in hearing about those laws.

[rarerookies]

So would you say "writing off business lunches or supplies" is governed by black and white or falls under the gray area and can be interpreted in different ways as taking legal copyrighted reprints and altering them to appear aged?

Originally Posted by vintagecpa

LOL. I never thought my professional choice would get ripped on a baseball card forum. For the record, I am a CPA. I think it would be a stretch to blame the latest recession on CPA's (or Enron). I don't know a single CPA that sold a sub-prime mortgage. Yes, when I prepare peoples taxes, there is a certain amount of "writing off" that occurs. But there is this minor detail called the tax code that guides us as to what is legal and not legal. Most everything is in black and white. A very similar code exists with copyright laws. But I'm sure your not interested in hearing about those laws.

[rarerookies]

lol

Originally Posted by Matthew H

How much for the Ruth?

[vintagecpa]

I'm afraid your just too unknowledgeable of the subject to have an intelligent conversation. However, I will answer your question simply for the entertainment value. If you are a business, you are allowed to "write off" 50% of meals and entertainment expenses. You obviously need to provide receipts and have some type of record that the expense is business-related (in the event of an audit). Business supplies can be deducted 100%.

In your case, for your business, you would be able to deduct (write-off) the cost of the legitimate reprint cards and aging chemicals (aka business supplies). If you go to lunch with you reprint card salesperson, you get to deduct 50% of that meal as long as you were discussing business. Not much of a gray area.

[rarerookies]

You must work for H&R block and don't understand the complexity of today's tax laws and the room built in for interpretation in those laws by lawmakers.

Originally Posted by vintagecpa

I'm afraid your just too unknowledgeable of the subject to have an intelligent conversation. However, I will answer your question simply for the entertainment value. If you are a business, you are allowed to "write off" 50% of meals and entertainment expenses. You obviously need to provide receipts and have some type of record that the expense is business-related (in the event of an audit). Business supplies can be deducted 100%.

In your case, for your business, you would be able to deduct (write-off) the cost of the legitimate reprint cards and aging chemicals (aka business supplies). If you go to lunch with you reprint card salesperson, you get to deduct 50% of that meal as long as you were discussing business. Not much of a gray area.

[vintagecpa]

This will be my last post regarding this hopeless conversation. I assume your last post is some sort of personal attack on my knowledge or skills. I'm afraid there are very few CPA's working at retail tax outfits like H&R Block. Most CPA's have their own practice (myself) or work for a larger CPA or private firm. However, I am somewhat familiar with the training and software H&R Block uses. If you walk into your nearest H&R Block and ask the same questions you ask me, you should get very similar answers.

Judging by how vehemently you are defending yourself, I suspect you don't see yourself doing anything wrong. At the very least, if you are going to continue with your current business (and I suspect you will), I would recommend not removing the copyright wording during your aging process. It is the one area that could potentially get you in trouble. Have a Happy Black Friday.

[rarerookies]

Thank you for debating on the subject. I was curious to what I would do while waiting for my wife to drag me out to the sales at 3am.

Have a Happy Black Friday as well.

Originally Posted by vintagecpa

This will be my last post regarding this hopeless conversation. I assume your last post is some sort of personal attack on my knowledge or skills. I'm afraid there are very few CPA's working at retail tax outfits like H&R Block. Most CPA's have their own practice (myself) or work for a larger CPA or private firm. However, I am somewhat familiar with the training and software H&R Block uses. If you walk into your nearest H&R Block and ask the same questions you ask me, you should get very similar answers.

Judging by how vehemently you are defending yourself, I suspect you don't see yourself doing anything wrong. At the very least, if you are going to continue with your current business (and I suspect you will), I would recommend not removing the copyright wording during your aging process. It is the one area that could potentially get you in trouble. Have a Happy Black Friday.

[sox1903wschamp]

Originally Posted by rarerookies

I didn't know that there was such an anti-reprint establishment among serious collectors.

Always do your homework.

[buymycards]

I think one of the reasons that many of us don't like these reprints is that we were burned by them when we first started collecting. It might not have been a lot of money but it still stings. Think about wives wanting to buy their husbands a Xmas gift, or parents buying a gift for their children. They probably won't do the necessary research and they may end up buying some of this stuff. Add in kids buying for their own collections, and other collectors who are just getting into cards and the potential for problems increases.

It is the people on ebay who list these as real cards and put them in an auction format that seem to cause the most problems. At least you are selling them as reprints, but they should also be clearly marked as reprints. Maybe buy yourself a red rubber "reprint" stamp and stamp the cards.

Rick

[rarerookies]

I've been burned too. Both on a Rolex and some Mantle cards. Well the Rolex was actually my dumb fault. You see I wire transferred the money out of country (this was like 15 years ago) and never heard from or received the watch.

The '56 mantle was my fault. I was an uneducated buyer and got took for $400 bucks. Does it piss me off and make me wanna go burn the SOB's house down. Well maybe. Do I want to start an all out witch hunt and ban everyone selling reprints because of a select few illegitimate people. No

Its like the parents of kids who want to ban guns because the parent left a loaded gun in the house and didn't explain the totality of a bullet through the body. Its not the gun who killed the person its the person that pulled the trigger.

Just like its not the card that took money from you, it was the person you bought it from

Originally Posted by buymycards

I think one of the reasons that many of us don't like these reprints is that we were burned by them when we first started collecting. It might not have been a lot of money but it still stings. Think about wives wanting to buy their husbands a Xmas gift, or parents buying a gift for their children. They probably won't do the necessary research and they may end up buying some of this stuff. Add in kids buying for their own collections, and other collectors who are just getting into cards and the potential for problems increases.

It is the people on ebay who list these as real cards and put them in an auction format that seem to cause the most problems. At least you are selling them as reprints, but they should also be clearly marked as reprints. Maybe buy yourself a red rubber "reprint" stamp and stamp the cards.

Rick