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  #91  
Old 04-20-2017, 06:29 PM
steve B steve B is offline
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So we'll remove a sports mascot so we don't have to see the poverty and other problems we have forced on them for a century or more. Yeah, that's a feel good moment.

While the eastern tribes mostly either moved, were killed off or went with being assimilated the central and western ones got totally clobbered and are still struggling today. Not all of them can start up casinos, unlike some eastern tribes that are for the most part pretty sketchy as still being tribes.

Maybe if we made sports teams with native american mascots pay a licensing fee? For pro teams a large one that would fund some needed improvements in their living conditions? And maybe a sliding scale of smaller fees for college and HS teams. That might be actual progress. And if the fee was big enough, it would effectively remove some of the mascots.

Yes, celebrate our cultural differences, but under the skin for the most part we're all just people. We generally tend to want the same basic things and behave the same basic ways.

The Native American using blackface was included to point out the frustrating hypocrisy and double standards that exist across our entire society. Probably should have left it for its own post.

Steve B
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  #92  
Old 04-20-2017, 08:26 PM
dgo71 dgo71 is offline
Derek 0u3ll3tt3
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Originally Posted by steve B View Post
So we'll remove a sports mascot so we don't have to see the poverty and other problems we have forced on them for a century or more. Yeah, that's a feel good moment.
I don't think the two things are mutually exclusive

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Originally Posted by steve B View Post
Maybe if we made sports teams with native american mascots pay a licensing fee? For pro teams a large one that would fund some needed improvements in their living conditions? And maybe a sliding scale of smaller fees for college and HS teams. That might be actual progress. And if the fee was big enough, it would effectively remove some of the mascots.
I think that's a fantastic idea.
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  #93  
Old 04-21-2017, 03:21 PM
KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
Kyle May
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve B View Post
So we'll remove a sports mascot so we don't have to see the poverty and other problems we have forced on them for a century or more. Yeah, that's a feel good moment.

While the eastern tribes mostly either moved, were killed off or went with being assimilated the central and western ones got totally clobbered and are still struggling today. Not all of them can start up casinos, unlike some eastern tribes that are for the most part pretty sketchy as still being tribes.

Maybe if we made sports teams with native american mascots pay a licensing fee? For pro teams a large one that would fund some needed improvements in their living conditions? And maybe a sliding scale of smaller fees for college and HS teams. That might be actual progress. And if the fee was big enough, it would effectively remove some of the mascots.

Yes, celebrate our cultural differences, but under the skin for the most part we're all just people. We generally tend to want the same basic things and behave the same basic ways.

The Native American using blackface was included to point out the frustrating hypocrisy and double standards that exist across our entire society. Probably should have left it for its own post.

Steve B
There are two issues here.

One is funding, particularly public funding. Grade School Systems would probably ditch anything related to Native Americans in a heartbeat due to funding - no way can a licensing fee be justified in many cases for a mascot. Colleges would probably ditch it in most cases, barring Florida State and other schools that truly honor their Native American relationship. Pro sports need to become private entities that no longer fund anything related to their organizations with public money - yes that includes stadiums. Too much money involved with sports to be asking for public funds on top of all other revenue. However, I do agree that at the pro level, if they were to take public funding out of it, a licensing fee to use a Native American-related logo/mascot/name would be terrific. Donate it to the reservations, and bring awareness to the atrocity that is the reservation.

The other issue is where does the line get drawn? For Notre Dame, is someone going to require schools/teams send money to Irish-related charities to use an Irish-related logo/mascot/name? What about about the mascots/logos/names with American historical relations - Patriots, Minutemen, etc.? It's a bit of a slippery slope.


Otherwise, I think the idea is great.
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Last edited by KMayUSA6060; 04-21-2017 at 03:22 PM.
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  #94  
Old 04-21-2017, 09:14 PM
steve B steve B is offline
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The fee wouldn't need to be large depending on the organization. The Indians? Yeah, a BIG fee. A local High school that maybe has a team named after the local tribe? (Plenty of those in the northeast) Maybe $1 a year.

I was in a car club when Chrysler had a bit of a flap over trademarks. Every Chrysler related car club got a cease and desist over any trademarked anything they were using. Which was a major problem for the "Slant Six Club" and "New England Mighty Mopars" It got settled pretty quickly once the people from the "Hemi Owners Group" and a couple others where most of the members have a lot of money threatened to sue. In the end they were just being heavy handed about needing to actively license or protect trademarks so they wouldn't be lost, and pretty much everyone got a license for $1 a year to use any of Chryslers trademarks.

Steve B
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  #95  
Old 04-25-2017, 03:57 PM
KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
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Originally Posted by steve B View Post
The fee wouldn't need to be large depending on the organization. The Indians? Yeah, a BIG fee. A local High school that maybe has a team named after the local tribe? (Plenty of those in the northeast) Maybe $1 a year.

I was in a car club when Chrysler had a bit of a flap over trademarks. Every Chrysler related car club got a cease and desist over any trademarked anything they were using. Which was a major problem for the "Slant Six Club" and "New England Mighty Mopars" It got settled pretty quickly once the people from the "Hemi Owners Group" and a couple others where most of the members have a lot of money threatened to sue. In the end they were just being heavy handed about needing to actively license or protect trademarks so they wouldn't be lost, and pretty much everyone got a license for $1 a year to use any of Chryslers trademarks.

Steve B
I don't have a problem with the fee, but you need to take the tax payer money out of all sports, then. The difference between your two scenarios is the car companies are privately owned companies.

I also am not a fan of fundraisers to bring awareness to something. People are always looking to dip into somebody else's pocket. If you see something wrong, or want to bring awareness, speak up. Use your 1st Amendment Right, not my money.
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  #96  
Old 04-26-2017, 02:18 PM
steve B steve B is offline
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Originally Posted by KMayUSA6060 View Post
I don't have a problem with the fee, but you need to take the tax payer money out of all sports, then. The difference between your two scenarios is the car companies are privately owned companies.

I also am not a fan of fundraisers to bring awareness to something. People are always looking to dip into somebody else's pocket. If you see something wrong, or want to bring awareness, speak up. Use your 1st Amendment Right, not my money.
While I'm not a fan of taxpayer money for the current crazy stadiums, I don't see why you'd have to remove all taxpayer money from all sports.

School bands license music unless they buy sheet music and perform it almost exactly as written.
http://www.halftimemag.com/features/...licensing.html

The same goes for plays if I'm not mistaken.

So what would be different about paying a fee to license a logo.

Not as a way to bring awareness, but as a way for the tribes to make a bit of money.

I'm totally with you on the awareness fundraisers. The first time it really clicked for me was when a bunch of musicians, some pretty big names were doing a concert to save Walden Woods a then privately owned bit of forest near Walden Pond that the owner wanted to develop. I heard the lineup and that they were trying to raise 7 million. And it dawned on me that some of those performers could simply write a check and get it done.

Steve B
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  #97  
Old 06-19-2017, 01:32 PM
KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
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Somewhat relevant here.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.d138d749cf77
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  #98  
Old 06-19-2017, 01:35 PM
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vintagetoppsguy vintagetoppsguy is offline
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Wow, you beat me to it by a few seconds. I was just about to revive this thread and post the same thing. Very relevant and sets precedence for the Redskins by ruling that a ban on offensive names is unconstitutional.
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  #99  
Old 06-19-2017, 01:39 PM
KMayUSA6060 KMayUSA6060 is offline
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Wow, you beat me to it by a few seconds. I was just about to revive this thread and post the same thing. Very relevant and sets precedence for the Redskins by ruling that a ban on offensive names is unconstitutional.
In my opinion, good for the Supreme Court. No matter your opinion on the matter, there is a lawful/unlawful line that needs to be upheld.
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  #100  
Old 06-19-2017, 05:57 PM
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bravos4evr bravos4evr is offline
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Whatever. . . .sure many folks on Indian reservations are happy they are inundated with alcohol on their reservations and have astonomical alcoholism rates . . . still doesn't make it a good thing.

Somehow we've gotten to a point where caring about other people being treated decently is a vice.
hyperbolic bull$hit quotes like this are why everyone is getting sick to death of a certain side's mamby pamby identity crap.

Remember back in the 80's when christian groups complained about TV programs being too violent or sexy and the response was "you have a dial on your TV use it" well, you have a choice of sports team to support, make your choice and let the rest of us make ours. Your opinion means nothing, being offended is nothing but a whine for attention and an attempt to make everyone do your bidding like a foot stomping toddler.
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