Heritage or PWCC?

[secondhandwatches]

Hi guys, was hoping to get a bit of help from the experts. I have a wonderfully centered psa graded 3.5 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle that I am potentially going to sell.

I'm looking at PWCC, Heritage, and REA.

My question is, is there that much difference in auction houses or will buyers of this particular card find it no matter where it is? I know when I am searching for a particular card I look everywhere for the one I love.

Appreciate any input. Thanks!

Larry Cohen

[G1911]

Decent people will avoid bidding in PWCC due to the fraud ring they’ve ran. Thus, it won’t matter much and most hobbyists will bid anywhere.

[Leon]

Sorry to interrupt but did you read this rule at the top of every page and in bold letters?

"If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it."

Originally Posted by secondhandwatches

Hi guys, was hoping to get a bit of help from the experts. I have a wonderfully centered psa graded 3.5 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle that I am potentially going to sell.

PWCC offered me -12.5% commission on the sale and can go in their next premier auction.


Heritage offered me -5% commission on the sale with it going in their next auction.


My question is, is there that much difference in auction houses or will buyers of this particular card find it no matter where it is?

Appreciate any input. Thanks!

[secondhandwatches]

QUOTE=Leon;2256712]Sorry to interrupt but did you read this rule at the top of every page and in bold letters?

"If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it."[/QUOTE]


Thank you, added.

[Peter_Spaeth]

I would not limit my choices to two. Ask some other significant AHs what they would do -- REA, LOTG, Mile High, Memory Lane, Goldin.

[raulus]

Since we're discussing specific businesses here, my name is Nicolo Renato Pinoli, and I approve this message.

I think the biggest question is whether there is any reason to believe that you might net more from one auction house than from another. Certainly fees are part of the calculus. At the same time, if one auction house charges 5% more, but the sales price is 20% higher than the other site, then you come out ahead.

So it strikes me that it's largely a question of whether there is likely to be any difference in the audiences reached by any given auction house, and if so, whether those differences are significant enough to result in a higher sales price for your item.

As you've already identified, there is also a timing difference that comes into play here, since PWCC seems like they will likely be able to get your item into their auction sooner. If you're looking to get paid sooner, and/or worried that the market might drop significantly in the interim, then this can certainly be a factor.

While I've certainly purchased from just about every major and minor auction house in the past, I've only ever used PWCC to consign items, mostly because they are geographically close to me here in Portland, and I have historically been able to physically drop items off, rather than having to ship them.

I will also observe that PWCC has changed their business model. They used to sell over eBay, and have now switched to selling entirely on their own site, including also sending out a smallish glossy auction catalogette of sorts every month for their monthly premier auction. Obviously, eBay has a built-in audience of buyers. I couldn't begin to really attempt to evaluate the size of PWCC's audience on its site, although my sense is that it's probably pretty good. My sense is that it might be smaller than what you see at Heritage, although there's always a question of how much smaller. Ultimately, all it takes is 2 more people deciding to go nuts on your item to drive up the price.

You might want to try to do some research to the extent that it's possible, looking at similar items over the last 6-12 months that were sold on each platform to see whether there are price differences. It could be difficult, maybe even impossible to match them up perfectly between the item, the grade, and the timing, all of which could definitely impact the price. But you might be able to find a handful of items that are close enough to attempt to evaluate whether there's really a statistically meaningful difference in results.

Without doing this research myself, and just based on what I see happening with items that I bid on and track at both of these sites, my sense is that you might get a little bit more at Heritage, potentially because their audience is slightly larger. But I wouldn't be willing to suggest anything more definitive, without attempting to really dig into the data and do some really exciting analysis.

Any way you slice it, my guess is that with your item and in today's market, you're looking at several tens of thousands of dollars. It's just a question of whether you might be able to squeeze a few extra grand out of it by using one site instead of another.

[raulus]

Since I clearly can't help myself, a few more thoughts that came to mind:

I think there's a lot more randomness to the auction world than we like to admit sometimes. In my experience, it's not uncommon for virtually the same item to close within a few minutes or hours of each other, even on the same auction platform, and for the prices to vary by 10% or more.

Admittedly, all of the "buy the card, not the holder" people will suggest that there were differences in the card, even if the holders were the same. But at the same time, my interpretation is that it's just the natural variation and randomness that comes when you have humans involved in buying illiquid and inherently unique assets.

So the bottom line is that even if you do a lot of research, think you know which auction house will give you the best outcomes, and then execute on it, the results might still not turn out just the way you expect. But hopefully it turns out that the randomness results in a higher price for your item!

[Casey2296]

LOTG & REA have impeccable reputations, plus they're the only two auction houses that, when I called, the owner picked up and took the time to answer any questions I had. That means more to me than squeezing out another 1% on commission. You can trust both Al & Brian to take care of you and your very significant card. Good luck!

[vintagebaseballcardguy]

Sterling Sports Auctions is another good one.

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by Casey2296

LOTG & REA have impeccable reputations, plus they're the only two auction houses that, when I called, the owner picked up and took the time to answer any questions I had. That means more to me than squeezing out another 1% on commission. You can trust both Al & Brian to take care of you and your very significant card. Good luck!

There many good auction houses mentioned and LOTG and REA are very good. Most auction houses mentioned have the exposure to a good following of bidders. Your card being an Iconic card will do very well in any. The big factors is where you will net the most.
In the case that you mentioned
Heritage -5% and PWCC -12.5%. That 7.5% back could be big money on your card.
A PSA 3.5 went for 78K in REA on 6/20/22. (the centering is ok left to right but not top to bottom)
for you that would have netted you an extra $5850 if you got the same sale price.

The key is do you think you will get that much more in the Sale price at Heritage to make up for the difference.

Tough call. Heritage is my preferred choice of those two and they do have a huge base of bidders and huge marketing to support and drive awareness.

The commission # makes it a hard choice for me

regardless

Great Card and Good Luck

[mrreality68]

as a quick FYI

I just found a 1952 Mantle on SCP auctions that's an SGC 3.5 with some time left in the auction.

IT is currently at 32K before BP

[raulus]

Originally Posted by mrreality68

as a quick FYI

I just found a 1952 Mantle on SCP auctions that's an SGC 3.5 with some time left in the auction.

IT is currently at 32K before BP

Not to get into a raging debate about the relative merits between SGC and PSA, but PSA 3.5s usually sell for more than SGC 3.5s. Naturally, there will always be some exceptions to the rule, such as the SGC 9.5 1952 Mantle currently at auction with Heritage that I’m sure will top 8 figures. But with 9.5 not being an eligible grade at PSA, I guess we’ll never know how they compare economically.

That and the last day and even the last few hours of most of these auctions can see the price double or triple, or then some… but it will be interesting to see where it lands when the SCP auction is finished.

[Empty77]

My experience as a buyer says that a certain company's exposure is reduced since moving from ebay to independent. The reason is lack of automatic search reminders by email (that ebay provided), and their own bizarre lack of simple email reminders about the start of each auction. I know they run on a set schedule and I could set my own reminder on my phone to check for new items, but the fact is that I miss them every other week (at least) from forgetting they are going on.

If there is a setting on their site for this I haven't found it. And maybe I'm the only one too dumb to figure it out, but even if so, their bidder list is whatever it used to be minus one. If there are others like me, then it is minus more.

They also now have a fast/complex extended bidding process which seems almost impossible to figure out or memorize unless using it often (an option ruled out for me by the aforementioned issue). So for those two problems combined I have decided not to consign there because it seems to me like their system hinders item exposure.

But like others said, this card in particular you're moving is the big one, and so those in the market for it are likely to be motivated to find it anywhere. For more modest items maybe not so much.

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by raulus

Not to get into a raging debate about the relative merits between SGC and PSA, but PSA 3.5s usually sell for more than SGC 3.5s. Naturally, there will always be some exceptions to the rule, such as the SGC 9.5 1952 Mantle currently at auction with Heritage that I’m sure will top 8 figures. But with 9.5 not being an eligible grade at PSA, I guess we’ll never know how they compare economically.

That and the last day and even the last few hours of most of these auctions can see the price double or triple, or then some… but it will be interesting to see where it lands when the SCP auction is finished.

You are 100% right about that and I did not want to get into that it would have over complicated and taken caused an entire separate thread.
THe hard part to me is front eye appeal without seeing the card. Because it was mentioned the Card was well centered. IF it looks real good and the Centering is well centered then the price would jump higher than a PSA 3.5 that is not as well centered.

But again you are correct just trying to help and not over complicate

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Empty77

My experience as a buyer says that a certain company's exposure is reduced since moving from ebay to independent. The reason is lack of automatic search reminders by email (that ebay provided), and their own bizarre lack of simple email reminders about the start of each auction. I know they run on a set schedule and I could set my own reminder on my phone to check for new items, but the fact is that I miss them every other week (at least) from forgetting they are going on.

If there is a setting on their site for this I haven't found it. And maybe I'm the only one too dumb to figure it out, but even if so, their bidder list is whatever it used to be minus one. If there are others like me, then it is minus more.

They also now have a fast/complex extended bidding process which seems almost impossible to figure out or memorize unless using it often (an option ruled out for me by the aforementioned issue). So for those two problems combined I have decided not to consign there because it seems to me like their system hinders item exposure.

But like others said, this card in particular you're moving is the big one, and so those in the market for it are likely to be motivated to find it anywhere. For more modest items maybe not so much.

Agree with your observations. In general, a bidder at that auction site has to be a lot more proactive, and in general I suspect that will lead to fewer bidders and lower prices. Naturally, for premier items, bidders will be happy to invest the time, but for the lower end, I would guess not.