Clean Sweep Auctions 1961 Fleer Lot

[carlsonjok]

A request and a rant:

Request: If someone here ends up winning the lot of 42 signed 1961 Fleer cards in tonight's Clean Sweep auction, PM me if you have any interest in selling those that you don't need. I needed about 20 of them and had been marshalling my funds to bid.

Rant: I will state up front that I swim in the shallow end of the hobby pool. But, I have participated in enough auctions that I thought I understood how they work. Get your initial bid in prior to the start of extended bidding. Once extended bidding commences, auction rules may vary, but generally lots close after a period of inactivity (either lot-by-lot or on the auction as a whole.)

Not Clean Sweep, which has VIP bidding. You don't need to get your initial bid in before extended bidding begins. You need to get that initial bid in 3 hours before extended bidding begins. So, when I logged in about 45 minutes before the timer on the lot says it closes, I am completely shut out of bidding. Maybe I should have read closer, but I've really never seen anything like this before. I don't get the point of having two different bidding deadlines. Can someone explain this to me like you would explain it to an idiot (because apparently that is exactly what I am.)

Postscript: I see that there are a few I need in the upcoming Collectors Connection (née Birmingham) auction. I guess I'll go read their rules a lot more closely.

[Michael B]

Scott appears to be very transparent and very oriented to customer service. I am sure he would be happy to answer any questions you have regarding his auctions. You don't need the secret password and color of the day to bid close to the end. I do know that some of the auctions I participate in you need to enter a bid at least an hour before official end. A few people on here have even mentioned placeholder bids. Not necessarily your top bid, but it saves you a seat at the table if there is extended bidding.

[Kaneen]

Jeff...I'm sorry things didn't work out for you, I know how frustrating it can be when you lose out on a rare opportunity to add elusive items to the collection.

This was my first time bidding in a Clean Sweep Auction. I had previously done some business with them at the National, and on eBay. When I registered to bid in their online auction last week, I saw in pretty plain site a statement to make sure and read their auction rules, because they differ somewhat from other auction house rules. It only took a couple minutes, and the rules were pretty straightforward.

To be eligible to participate in the extended bidding period, one had to place a bid in that specific lot 3 hours prior (8pm est) to the scheduled auction end time (11pm est). If you placed an initial bid on 10 or more lots by the 8pm deadline, you were given VIP status, meaning you could then participate in extended bidding on any lot in the auction, whether or not you had placed a prior initial bid in that specific lot.

After I registered I received a daily email reminding me when the auction was scheduled to close. Those emails included a statement in the very first line reminding me that initial bids had to be made by 8pm. Yesterday, the closing day, I received an email reminder notice early in the day. Here is the first paragraph of that email:

"Our current auction ends TODAY Wednesday February 3. Initial bids must be placed by 8 PM EST TODAY. Bidders who bid on 10 or more lots can bid on any lot at any time, new bidders please check our auction rules as they are different than other auction houses and ebay."

Later yesterday afternoon I received another email with the following subject line:

"FINAL NOTICE - Great Clean Sweep Auction Closes TODAY WED 10/3 - Initial Bids 8 PM EST/Ten Minute Rule 11PM EST - Great Cards and Autographs - Don't Miss Out"

The text of the email again explained the 8pm initial bid deadline.

Not trying to make you feel worse than you already do about it...I only post this to say that as a new bidder who has never participated in an auction with this specific rule, I don't think they could have done much more to make sure I was aware of their unusual initial bid deadline.

[carlsonjok]

Originally Posted by Kaneen

Not trying to make you feel worse than you already do about it...I only post this to say that as a new bidder who has never participated in an auction with this specific rule, I don't think they could have done much more to make sure I was aware of their unusual initial bid deadline.

Obviously, I know all this now, but it doesn't really answer my actual question. As I said, I am not a whale in this hobby, so my opinion is worth almost as much as you paid for it. But, I have been back in the hobby for about 10 years now and have participated in at least a few auctions every year. This is the first time I have ever seen this type of closing rule. So, yes, I was probably a bit more lackadaisical than I should have been when I read the rules. As it was, the lot closed right where my max bid was, so it is highly likely I wouldn't have won anyways.

My question though, when you cut through my pique, was what the rationale for this type of rule is? As an example, another thing I found noteworthy about Clean Sweep was that they don't accept electronic payments for auctions even though they do on the things they are selling outright on the site. For auctions, they require either check or money order. I get this as the possibility of fraud is higher with Paypal and credit cards and the size of their risk is greater with auctions vs straight purchases. But, I am struggling to wrap the overripe melon I call a head around the reason for having three auction closes: a soft close, a hard close that starts extended bidding, and then a final close after some period of inactivity.

[earlywynnfan]

I can't answer your specific question, but wait till you bid on one of their lots, see you have the only bid on an item, go to bed at 1 in the morning as still the only bidder, only to find out one of those "VIP" bidders decided to come bid. Worst auction rule ever, and I've been a fan of their auction house for a long long time.

[Kaneen]

I really don't know what their rationale for the 3 hour window from 8 to 11 is...as a participant, I can only say that this was basically dead time, as I put in initial bids before 8, and then had to wait till 11 for what we all know is when the "real" auction starts. I'm sure it's somehow all about the money...it always is, lol.

As for the VIP thing, that one is definitely money driven. I was really only seriously interested in 5 or 6 lots. But once I put my initial bids on those, I actually looked for 4 or 5 more lots to perhaps throw an initial bid on (knowing I wouldn't win them), just in case I saw something late in the night that might be a good deal on a whim (the frustrating scenario the above poster experienced). In the end, I didn't do it...but if I had that would have bumped the bidding on 5 additional lots. And every time a lot gets bid bumped, the house (and consignor) makes more money.

As for the methods of payment accepted...that one seems pretty straightforward. With PayPal or a credit card, a buyer could pay, receive their items, the auction house could pay out the consignor of the lot, and then 30 to 90 days later the buyer could do a charge back or dispute of some kind and leave them holding the bag. With a check or money order, once the funds have cleared they have their money and there's little to no risk of getting burned in that type of scenario. The difference I see when purchasing from their online store is that they actually own all those items, whereas many auction items are consigned to them by a third party.