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Well, did you read the stanza from the anthem that is no longer recited? It is quite racist. But beyond that I think it's more important to listen to the people who are actually protesting and their self-professed motivations, none of which seem to mention the military at all. As an aside, I don't think there is anything wrong with revisionist history. We are always changing the way we do things to better reflect the moment in time that we're in. I'll give you another example. Were you aware that prior to World War II Americans saluted the flag by extending the right arm to it? That tradition ended when the Nazi party adopted a similar salute. I don't think we're worse for wear for abandoning it. Last edited by packs; 09-29-2017 at 09:11 AM. |
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Military? Non-military? Whatever! Do you believe that anybody has the right to protest while at work? While on the job? While being paid? |
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If you fire all the players, who is going to play the games? I don't think it's realistic to look at NFL players the same way you would an average employee. For example, is it reasonable for a normal employee to assume that failing a drug test would mean termination? I would say so. But that is not a foregone conclusion in the NFL.
Last edited by packs; 09-29-2017 at 09:26 AM. |
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But, that didn't answer the question. Do you believe employees have the right to protest while at work on company time? As far as firing all the players, I didn't say that and I don't want that. I fat deduction to their paycheck by order of a fine would be nice to see though. |
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The second the NFL starts fining players is the same second they all sit out. It would ruin the NFL.
I think employees should enjoy the same rights at work as they do outside of it. I don't feel as though I should have to surrender any freedoms because I need to feed myself. There are always going to be lines you can't cross in a professional setting, but I don't think that line is sitting down. Last edited by packs; 09-29-2017 at 09:39 AM. |
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LOL, seriously? It's 10:45 here in Houston. I get off work at noon on Fridays. It's my right to go have a beer after work if I choose. You really think I should be afforded that same right while at work?
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Then, let's go back to my example with Todd. He's an attorney. When the bailiff comes in the courtroom and says, "All rise," do you think it's Todd's right to stay seated in protest?
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You are correct, David. If you decide to protest anything at work you can be fired. Your constitutional rights are not protected while at work, therefore the owners should come down on them , but it will never happen for fear they will be called a racist. They are as pathetic as their employees.
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#10
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Your statement is oversimplistic. It is by no means clear that a player could be fired for failing to stand for the anthem. In fact, I would bet he cannot.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/marcede.../#3333baa12976 Moot point, though--ain't gonna happen.
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If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other. - Ulysses S. Grant, military commander, 18th US President. |
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I don't think you can be fired for fulfilling your jury duty obligation, for example. There are public policy limits to the unfettered right to fire an at will employee.
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My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
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Only government employees are protected from termination of employment by the First Amendment, I believe.
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Need a spreadsheet to help track your set, player run, or collection? Check out Sheets4Collectors on Etsy. https://www.etsy.com/shop/Sheets4Collectors - Hall of Famers Progress: 318/340 (93.53%) - Grover Hartley PC Needs: T207 Anonymous Factory 25 Back, 1914 New York Evening Sun Supplements, 1917 D328 Weil Baking Co., and (possibly) 1917 Merchant's Bakery - Jim Thome PC - Cleveland Indians Franchise Hall of Fame |
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Maybe you can, but if you have contractual protections such as may be found in collective bargaining agreements, there are often obstacles to such firings. An owner would likely have to claim that the "protest" violated a morals provision in the CBA and convince an arbitrator that certain broad and likely amorphous language governing player conduct precludes gestures (kneeling) during the anthem. Then he would have to show that such conduct is so outrageous that the punishment is not fine or suspension, but termination of the contract. Good luck with that, even at the arbitration level. Never mind what a judge would do with that thereafter if the player appealed. Go for it.
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If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other. - Ulysses S. Grant, military commander, 18th US President. Last edited by nolemmings; 10-01-2017 at 09:43 AM. |
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BTW, it should be remembered that the great Jackie Robinson, who served in the military during a time of World War, also protested the flag:
In his 1972 autobiography, I Never Had It Made, Jackie Robinson -- who broke baseball’s color line in 1947 -- wrote, "As I write this twenty years later, I cannot stand and sing the anthem. I cannot salute the flag; I know that I am a black man in a white world."
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If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other. - Ulysses S. Grant, military commander, 18th US President. |
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Last edited by Snapolit1; 10-01-2017 at 01:31 PM. |
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