Uncatalogued Card Question... Update

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Posted By: Brian

If i have a card that is not catalogued in the Standard Catalogue would that bring a premium value?



The set is listed, and in the write up on the set it states the checklist may not be complete.

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Posted By: Rich Klein

And there is no right or wrong answer to this. As a cataloguer, I believe the information can only help you sell a card when it was previously unknown. Yet others, may well believe that a private sale of such cards, will benefit them more.

Personally, I'd say what the card is and not worry about it since it is literally a 50/50 choice

And I'll agree with what is below that the set matters -- but also whom the player is matters as well -- if it is some player with a "following" and not that many issues; there is a chance that the knowledge will incease what you recieve for that card. An example (at least to me) would be Fred McMullin (sic); the least important of the 8 men out. He has so few cards in his playing career and there is such a demand for Black Sox material, that any new examples of his cards would be quite a boon to you.

Rich

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Posted By: Rhett Yeakley

Brian, the answer to your question is 100% dependent on which set we are talking about. If it is a widely collected set with a fairly well-established checklist then a uncatalogued card could be worth a small fortune. If we are speaking of a set (and this sounds like it is the case here) that is very thinly collected and a checklist is still a work in progress then there will be very little premium attached to a new card discovery.

An example of the latter would be something like a new George Burke stamp or something along those lines. The checklist is wholely incomplete and there is probably little interest by the general body of collectors when a new player is found.

Without revealing who the card depicts, what set is it? If we know this we can answer the question a little better.

-Rhett

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Posted By: leon

I agree with Rhett on this one. I get calls fairly often from folks with uncatalogued cards asking me about value etc... The more scarce the set the less an uncatalogued card's value will increase vis a vis a known card. Gypsy Queen N175's are ones that come to mind. My guess is that there will be more found in the future, at least of different poses...same with E223 and N403's.....they are so seldom seen that an uncatalogued one won't raise their value a whole lot, usually. On a more commonly collected set it is just the opposite....

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Posted By: davidcycleback

Assuming it's from a cataloged set and folks are convinced the card is genuine, I believe an uncataloged card will usually receive a premium.

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Posted By: peter ullman

what set are we referring to...if you don't mind me asking?

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Posted By: Brian

well, this is the card.. just won. if i am correct, as the seller said, it is a 1909 Colgon's Chips "proof" i looked it up in the Standard Catalogue, and this player is not listed.

it does have back damage (scrapbook) but i think it is a nice buy for $43..

opinions???

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Posted By: Matt

nm

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Posted By: dstudeba

The seller is a good guy, it is definitely authentic.

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Posted By: Brian

Matt,



The best $35 i spent was on the Catalogue.. this is the 1st year i have bought it.. it is very interesting, and now i feel a little better picking up cards i never heard of before... live the above.

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Posted By: Matt

No doubt - the catalog is a critical reference.

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Posted By: leon

I have never thought those are Colgan's proofs. I think they might have been some subset of them.....I think you got a good buy and would value it a little more than you paid.....I had a snipe set below what you won it for (I have had a type for many years)....btw, they are characterized as Colgans proofs in the hobby they just don't look like a proof to me....plus, if I am not mistaking there is more than 1 of many players known....still a neat subset....and a good deal that you got....regarsd

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Posted By: Rhett Yeakley

That set is a perfect example of a set where "checklisted" or "uncatalogued" pretty much doesn't mean a whole lot.

That being said I forgot to throw out my snipe on that card, as I am a Colgan's collector, so if you want to make an easy little profit let me know and I would be happy to add it to my collection.

-Rhett

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Posted By: Brian

Rhett,


email me.. bcrott@msophs.com

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Posted By: Millerhouse

Leon is absolutely correct. These are in no way proofs. Given the many different places they've been found, they are clearly an insert issue of some sort making use of the Colgan's portraits. As for Henley, he has been known in the hobby for a number of years. Why SCD has never gotten around to listing him is a mystery. My recollection, though I'm currently without my copy to check my memory, is that Egan's old E-card guide (from the late '60s/early '70s) listed him with the set. Anyone have a copy of Egan handy to check?

Dan

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Posted By: leon

Egan classified the square issue as an anonymous issue and "part 3" of his Colgans expose'. He said they were an anonymous paper issue, not yet catalogued, and used photos from E254. He went on to say the titles had been removed and a printed title added in the bottom obverse. He felt the photos were definitely used from E-254 as some are known with the lettering that covered the photo in place although the background and associated lettering had been removed. He did list Henley as one of them....His publication was put out 39 yrs ago. You would think the SCD might have caught it by now....

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Posted By: peter ullman

Didn't Alan Hager discover these?(insert smiley face here!)

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Posted By: dan mckee

Is a jerk! You may never get that card and he steals money! Now before you guys bash me about the proof thing. Open up the listing and see how I answered the question about it being a proof. Leon will be proud of me!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=370105271061&ssPa geName=STRK:MESO:IT&ih=024

Q: how do you know that this is a proof? i'm very interested in the item but i'd just like to know a little more about it. can you be sure it is a proof? Nov-06-08

A: Actually, the square versions have been considered proofs in the hobby as long as I can remember from back in the 1960s and today are still cataloged as proofs. I have found some in a scrapbook with the normal round Colgans so I personally doubt they are proofs. Probably counter giveaways or from a candy box that has yet to be discovered. Thanks for the question. Dan.

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Posted By: Brian

Dan,

you got the payment?

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Posted By: dan mckee

maybe, I have a pile of mail and a million paypal payments to go through tonight. Dan.

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Posted By: leon

My friend....you are one of the good guys....I have seen a few things that made me scratch my head lately but I can always count on you.....take care and say hi to Dad for me!!

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Posted By: davidcycleback

The hobby doesn't considered them proofs. 'Proofs' is just a nickname. The T3 Turkey Reds aren't literally cabinet cards. And Rube Marquard wasn't a Rube. He was born and raised in the big city.

Maybe someone once marketed them as proofs and the name just stuck.

Related to Rube, I remember when an American reporter asked a Dominican Republic player to translate what fellow Dominican Bartolo Colon was saying. After listening to Colon speak for a little bit, the player told the reporter, "I can't. He's a hillbilly."

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Posted By: dan mckee

Hey Brian, card shipped this morning, hope you like it. Take care, Dan.

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Posted By: fkw

Now that the W555 mystery is solved, It would be great to solve this one




"Colgans Proofs"

IMO they are unrelated to Colgans but was included in some type of candy or gum in the same era.

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Posted By: boxingcardman

I beleive was given to these items by Alan Hager in hyping sales of them about 15-20 years ago.

Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc

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Posted By: Brian

Rhett, i emailed you this morning.. i will take your offer. my paypal ID brian@iwantmycookies.com