Mantle Opinion

[Bestdj777]

Hey everyone,

I know there are constant questions about Mantle autographs on the board so I am sorry for bothering yall, but I was wondering if y'all would mind weighing in on this signed photo. It is on a 1950s/60s photo that I own and looks to be handwritten rather than pre-printed, as the M in Mantle is smeared. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thank you!

[mighty bombjack]

That doesn't look smeared to me. It looks slowly drawn.

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by mighty bombjack

That doesn't look smeared to me. It looks slowly drawn.

Thanks. I thought that was just bleeding or smearing. I take it you think it's no good then?

[mighty bombjack]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

Thanks. I thought that was just bleeding or smearing. I take it you think it's no good then?

I can tell you for certain that I wouldn't buy it. It is possible that he was using a faulty pen, but the blots of ink look more like hesitation to me. I also don't particularly like the formation of the auto, but if it is an earlier auto it could be legit.

I'm curious what others here think, as I'm sure you are.

[joed25]

I believe it's authentic

[GoldenAge50s]

I don't like it at all.

[Sophiedog]

Looks like an authentic autograph signed by Mantle in the 1960's

[Duluth Eskimo]

Hard to tell without the item in hand, but I think it is authentic as well. Looks like a bad pen.

[ATP]

Agreed. To me this looks like a mid career autograph, and the strange look of the ink I am guessing is because it's a glossy sort of finish on the photo and it just didn't adhere well. The K is indicative of his earlier signatures.

[Bestdj777]

Thank you all for weighing in. I appreciate you taking the time to comment and offer your insight.

[shelly]

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by shelly

Thanks Shelly I purchased this as a while ago with some other premium photos and did not realize that it was signed until yesterday. I am glad to see that you and several of the other members think it is authentic.

[JimStinson]

I hate to be the "paranoid one" but are you certain that is not a pre-print? Impossible to tell from the scan but if you look at it under a glass and black light it should revel uneven "stress marks" on the photo. It does not hurt to be overly cautious
_________________
jim@stinsonsports.com

Vintage autographs for sale daily on my web site
stinsonsports.com

[Bestdj777]

Hi Jim,

Nothing wrong with being overly cautious. I have asked a few people offline about it possibly being a pre-print. It is hard to tell though when looking at it in person. It has all of the markings of an in person signature--bleeding ink, streaks, etc. And, I have never seen an identical premium photo of Mantle. So, I was leaning towards it being an actual signature (either real or fake). I will have to get a black light and loop and take a look at it. Either way, as long as it is not a forgery I am very satisfied with the piece.

Thanks!

Chris

[JimStinson]

I am in agreement with Shelly as far as the autograph being right for the time , but the Yankees and a few other teams did produce facsimiles complete with indentations , smears etc. that were sold in team packs , the "tell" would be the uneven distribution of ink and "overlay" of where lines in signature intersect. Perhaps its just the scan
_______________
jim@stinsonsports.com


Vintage Baseball autographs updated and for sale daily
stinsonsports.com

[thetruthisoutthere]

Looks to me like a printed (facsimile) sig that someone tried to trace over.

[JimStinson]

Originally Posted by thetruthisoutthere

Looks to me like a printed (facsimile) sig that someone tried to trace over.

Bingo !
_____________________
jim@stinsonsports.com


Vintage Baseball autographs updated and for sale daily
stinsonsports.com

[Bestdj777]

The picture was supposedly a premium issued by Alvarn, and it has the same picture/signature as the one on the brochure below (not my picture or my hand). If it were traced over, would it still be so light in certain areas? I would have thought you would have been able to see the printed signature underneath. Y'all know this stuff better than I do though.

My initial thoughts, after comparing it to the signature below, were that either 1) this was the proof used for the batting tips, or 2) it is a printed signature. I don't know though.

[Bestdj777]

Wanted to add. Don't doubt your judgment just trying to learn.

[shelly]

Never looked to see if it was a copy. The signiture is good and that is what I was looking at. It is nice to see that you get more than just one opinion. I would say the both Jim and Chris are correct after looking a lot closer. My bad

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by shelly

Never looked to see if it was a copy. The signiture is good and that is what I was looking at. It is nice to see that you get more than just one opinion. I would say the both Jim and Chris are correct after looking a lot closer. My bad

Hahah, I liked your first opinion better. I think I will go with that one

I think I got a little too excited too early with this one. In the end, it looks like item I received was the item I paid for--a premium photo with a pre-printed signature and possibly traced over signature. I think I will stick to baseball cards and $10 autos on the BST board. The fact that it can be so hard to tell for certain on some of these is a bit scary. Thank you for the education.

[shelly]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

Hahah, I liked your first opinion better. I think I will go with that one

I think I got a little too excited too early with this one. In the end, it looks like item I received was the item I paid for--a premium photo with a pre-printed signature and possibly traced over signature. I think I will stick to baseball cards and $10 autos on the BST board. The fact that it can be so hard to tell for certain on some of these is a bit scary. Thank you for the education.

That is why this site is so good. Nothing is taken for fact.

[Frozen in Time]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

Hahah, I liked your first opinion better. I think I will go with that one

I think I got a little too excited too early with this one. In the end, it looks like item I received was the item I paid for--a premium photo with a pre-printed signature and possibly traced over signature. I think I will stick to baseball cards and $10 autos on the BST board. The fact that it can be so hard to tell for certain on some of these is a bit scary. Thank you for the education.

A relatively common 60's Mantle premium photo with a pre-printed auto (not traced over). Have seen several of them! I had essentially the same first reaction until I started seeing exactly the same premium photo and auto (flaws and all) over the last 10 years or so.

Craig

[JimStinson]

You had to be there to realize how particularly tough it was in the late 60's to get Mantle to sign an autograph.

They played day baseball then and the Yankees were in last place , Mantle had been moved from the outfield to first base. A bunch of us kids would cut school and take the bus from Jersey to Yankee Stadium

We'd get there three hours before the game wait outside where the players came in ....no Mantle. Before the game during infield practice we'd be hanging close to the 1st base dugout yelling for "The Mick" to just turn around and wave at us , remember there was almost NO ONE in the stadium and he would just smirk and ignore us.

Some of the other players were great , Mel Stottlemyre would actually REMEMBER us and pull up a chair and talk , as kids we must have asked him the most stupid questions in the World but he didn't seem to mind.

After awhile before and after the games we would spread out and stake out the various entrances and exits in an effort to find out where Mantle came in and left from but we never once found out.

There was NEVER more than a handful of autograph seekers and most were kids and he still went out of his way to avoid us
__________________________
jim@stinsonsports.com

Vintage autographs for Sale on my Web site
stinsonsports.com

[David Atkatz]

On August 28, 1966 Mickey signed this baseball for me outside the Stadium. As we often did, my friend Howie and I walked to Yankee Stadium to get some autographs. My uncle had given me a brand new OAL (Cronin) ball, and I had it with me. We arrived at the Stadium about the sixth inning, and there was absolutely no one outside the player's entrance. Howie and I sat down on the iron pipe fencing on either side of the entrance--he on one side of the door, me on the other--with our backs to the door, facing the chain-link fence entrance to the player's parking lot directly across the street.
After fifteen minutes or so, someone left the building. As he passed me, walking directly away from the Stadium towards the parking lot, I realized that the red-polo-shirted blond with the widest neck I had ever seen was my baseball idol. I ran after him, imploring him to stop and sign: "Mickey, Mickey, please... I'll never have this chance again... Please... " I got to him just as he entered the parking lot. Without turning around he slammed the chain-link door in my face. So I ran down the block to where the cars exited and entered the lot. I was standing at the gate, clutching the ball and a pen in my fifteen-year-old hands, when Mickey stopped his car (a Chrysler Imperial with Texas plates), rolled down his window, took the pen and the ball, signed it, handed it back, and drove on. He never said a word.

[Bestdj777]

Thank you for sharing your stories. It is a shame he treated fans like that. I wonder how many young New Yorkers grew up hating him as a result. I remember waiting outside of the chain link fence after a Rangers game waiting for my idol at the time--Nolan Ryan--to appear and sign autos. If he had showed up and snubbed me I likely would have stopped collecting his cards right then.


And, Craig, thanks again for the insight both here and in PMs.

I love this board.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

On August 28, 1966 Mickey signed this baseball for me outside the Stadium. As we often did, my friend Howie and I walked to Yankee Stadium to get some autographs. My uncle had given me a brand new OAL (Cronin) ball, and I had it with me. We arrived at the Stadium about the sixth inning, and there was absolutely no one outside the player's entrance. Howie and I sat down on the iron pipe fencing on either side of the entrance--he on one side of the door, me on the other--with our backs to the door, facing the chain-link fence entrance to the player's parking lot directly across the street.
After fifteen minutes or so, someone left the building. As he passed me, walking directly away from the Stadium towards the parking lot, I realized that the red-polo-shirted blond with the widest neck I had ever seen was my baseball idol. I ran after him, imploring him to stop and sign: "Mickey, Mickey, please... I'll never have this chance again... Please... " I got to him just as he entered the parking lot. Without turning around he slammed the chain-link door in my face. So I ran down the block to where the cars exited and entered the lot. I was standing at the gate, clutching the ball and a pen in my fifteen-year-old hands, when Mickey stopped his car (a Chrysler Imperial with Texas plates), rolled down his window, took the pen and the ball, signed it, handed it back, and drove on. He never said a word.

GREAT STORY David, thanks for sharing it!

[Runscott]

Yes, great story David. I'm just glad that as a 15-yr old, you were prepared with a good pen and ball. At the same age, I took a good ball to a game and had it signed with a bad pen by a few Giants. Then took the same ball to a Phillies game, but with a 'good' pen. I only know 'good' vs 'bad' because after several years, the bad pen ink began to blur. The Phillies autos still look brand new.

Then took a bad ball to a Reds game and all the signatures on one panel faded to absolute nothingness, but the other panel signatures look beautiful.

Good planning, David, and as a result, a great treasure. Too bad, though, hearing from you and others as to how fan-unfriendly Mantle was at the close of his career. It could just be that Happy Hour was winding down and he needed to roll for last call.

[shelly]

In the fiftys I would go to Cleveland Stadium and get autographs. I dont know why but it was fun at the time. Mickey would sign comeing or going when he was in town. I guess when you become larger than life it becomes a lot harder. He was a drunk and in pain most of the time. To people in NY he is still and always will be the Mick.

[autograf]

@David.....good day for me too......I was born that day.........cool story.....