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  #1  
Old 09-24-2017, 02:36 AM
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Eddie S.
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Default A few wrestling card questions (Carnation and Parkhurst)

I know most of the hobby's top wrestling collectors are on here, so I wanted to ask a couple questions about the 1986 Carnation hot cocoa set and the two Parkhurst sets.

With regard to the 1986 Carnation set, was that an extremely limited regional distribution? It kind of blows my mind that a major brand like Carnation (which was just acquired by Nestle at the time) would put out cards in packages of cocoa and the the population of a Flair card for example is 1/3 of that found in a mail-only set like the Wrestling All-Stars. I am guessing the Carnation cards were only available in the Midwest and the South, since there are not any WWF wrestlers in the set?

Does the Flair card show up at auction with any kind of frequency? Ebay does not show a single Flair Carnation auction within the past three months. I really can't find any information on auction prices (and SMR does not cover the set), so what is a fair price for the Flair card in PSA 7 or 8?

When I look at the Parkhurst populations, it kind of surprises me how many cards are on eBay, given that Bronko Nagurski is the only subject with a graded population above 30. I know that low-grade/ungraded cards from the two sets are not worth much money other than Nagurski, but it surprises me a bit to see multiple cards available of the set's stars.

I know the Parkhurst sets are condition sensitive, but are there many raw cards out there that just have not been graded because it is not worth it to have them graded? Even the Bronko Nagurski card has many more options available on eBay at various price points despite having a population nearly identical to the Flair Carnation card.

It amazes me how cheap the cards are of stars like Buddy Rogers, Gorgeous George, Lou Thesz, Bobo Brazil and Killer Kowalski.

Last edited by Bored5000; 09-24-2017 at 02:41 AM.
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  #2  
Old 09-24-2017, 07:11 AM
camaro69 camaro69 is offline
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Default parkhurst

I am not sure of the real reason why there does not seem to be a lot of these graded.But I would think that condition is likely one of the biggest reasons.To me it does not make a lot of sense to grade cards from these two sets only to end up with a 3 or a 4. Grading is not cheap and the time and effort does not warrant the end result. In a lot of cases you need to pay $10 or more for a decent single raw.The same card if only graded a 3 or a 4 may not bring much more than $20-$25.So really what was the point in sending it in to PSA or who ever for grading.If it is just about the bottom line then selling it raw may have been the best choice.Now if graded cards is your preference then I say do it.Also you have to maybe consider the production run.After all how many cases of wrestling cards would you think might sell back in the 50's as compared to sports cards.

I think that the reason for so many cards to be found in less then great condition is that these might have been played with more.They likely were a lot less cared for then the hockey cards were from the same time period. I think that people who were buying wrestling cards may not have been buying so many hockey cards. If they were buying any at all.

I really took a liking to the 1955 Parkhurst wrestling set myself. I liked the color and I really liked the green backs.Sort of reminds me of the Quaker Oats hockey cards from the same year. I have built 6 complete sets of the 1955 Parkhurst and have well over 100 extra.Only did one 1954 Parkhurst wrestling set and still have quite a few extra singles. But I have also started a graded 1955 set.Have about half the set.Not a high grade set at all.My plan is to pull enough cards from my raw sets and have them graded so that I will have a completely graded set as well.But it is something that requires a fair bit of responsible thought.Most likely what I have will only be 4's-6's graded and it will cost me nearly a grand to do so.Is it worth it? No not at all.But I just think it may be neat to have a complete graded set to go along with the raw sets.

Good luck with your collecting if you are starting in on the wrestling sets.I have never seen the other set that you mentioned. Living here in Canada we may never had been offered those since like you said that they seem to have been a regional release.
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  #3  
Old 09-24-2017, 08:30 AM
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The Carnation Major League Wrestling set is kind of a mystery. I started posting about the set on CU in early 2011 and there hasn't been one person come forward with any real information on the set. In my view the set is much more rare than the Wrestling All Stars and I am not sure if that is due to it actually being more rare from production or preservation. In my research I determined that the set was put out in the Pro Wrestling USA days when the AWA and NWA ran joint cards to try and combat the growing dominance of the WWF. The back of the cards have a 1985 copyright date and it went defunct in the end of 85 and so I am not sure where the 1986 came from.


If you look at the OPC Series II that PSA has labeled 1985 which is clearly wrong as the cards are advertised as Wrestlemania II and feature many action shots from that card which ran April 7th 1986 it may be an error on their part. In an effort to most effectively respond to your question I just went and grabbed a card and what is even more peculiar is that there is a poster offer on the back that was valid until December 31, 1986 and if you mailed $2.50 to Kalamazoo,MI they would send you a wrestling poster. I have never seen one ever surface. You would surely think with all of the random items that come up for sale on EBAY that one would have been sold. I have been actively searching for these cards since 2009 and I have never seen a box or poster and just little sealed packs. The cards are very condition sensitive due to the packaging and centering and many have a surface wrinkle on the back at the top and will only grade a PSA 5. I think the number that exist is higher than the pop report implies due to this but not significantly as many have been sent in that are lower grade copies. One thing that is true is they are very tough in high grade with only 2 PSA 10's from the entire set graded and only 11 Mint copies. It may be possible that this was a test product or only offered for a very short period of time. I am not sure if anyone knows.


In terms of pricing the cards spiked significantly at one time in any condition but have come down a lot. The higher grade cards really never come up for sale so it is hard to determine value. There is a Flair PSA 7 for sale on EBAY for $215 right now. I would say that card would at least go for $125 or higher in a straight auction. The cards came two to a pack and the sequencing is the same hence why the seller has the Kamala up too. The Road Warriors and Rick Martel came together and The Koloffs and Sergeant Slaughter. Here are some scans of the cards from the set.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 24martel404.jpg (39.4 KB, 45 views)
File Type: jpg 22slaughter402.jpg (43.1 KB, 45 views)
File Type: jpg 23koloff403.jpg (43.8 KB, 45 views)
File Type: jpg 25warriors405.jpg (38.6 KB, 46 views)
File Type: jpg 21flair401 (1).jpg (38.4 KB, 45 views)
File Type: jpg 20kamala400.jpg (39.8 KB, 45 views)

Last edited by Dpeck100; 09-24-2017 at 08:35 AM.
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  #4  
Old 09-24-2017, 10:58 AM
wrestlingcardking wrestlingcardking is offline
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Default Parkhurst wrestling cards

Thanks for your post. I was one of the first guys to send Parkhurst wrestling cards into PSA and continue to build each of the sets in graded form. Although I feel that some of the stars can be found somewhat cheap they have risen in value in the last few years. There have been a few aggressive buyers of these cards and you can see that even the mid grade cards (especially from 1955) have been sold at good prices. In my experience the 55s have much less production issues than the 54s. Between centering issues, lack of quality card stock, wax stains, etc, it is extremely difficult to find a card that would grade a PSA 7 (near mint). I've put some money into the cards even when it looked like it might bot be a good investment because I love the cards. I have no doubt that I would receive my money back and then some if I did decide to sell today but that might not have always been the case. I actually passed up on buying some really high grade 55s when the previous owner decided to sell out because I didn't think there was a market for them, but I was wrong, and it is a decision that I regret and now I do not have the top 1955 set anymore. I like the fact that there are many singles on ebay today as I believe that unless the cards get into circulation, collectors may not even attempt to collect the set and have the patience and competitiveness to win auctions of complete sets. It seems there used to be many auctions for sets years ago but those are coming up less and less these days. Again thanks for your interest in these cards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bored5000 View Post
When I look at the Parkhurst populations, it kind of surprises me how many cards are on eBay, given that Bronko Nagurski is the only subject with a graded population above 30. I know that low-grade/ungraded cards from the two sets are not worth much money other than Nagurski, but it surprises me a bit to see multiple cards available of the set's stars.

I know the Parkhurst sets are condition sensitive, but are there many raw cards out there that just have not been graded because it is not worth it to have them graded? Even the Bronko Nagurski card has many more options available on eBay at various price points despite having a population nearly identical to the Flair Carnation card.

It amazes me how cheap the cards are of stars like Buddy Rogers, Gorgeous George, Lou Thesz, Bobo Brazil and Killer Kowalski.
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  #5  
Old 09-24-2017, 11:00 AM
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Eddie S.
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Thanks for the information, guys. Your information was very helpful. I had also done a bunch of Googling before starting this thread and found some previous threads each of you posted in about the Psrkhurst and Carnation sets.

I have been watching the Flair PSA 7 that is currently on eBay. The card originally started as a $350 BIN and has been steadily dropping in price each time the 10-day listing for the card passes without a sale. I am looking forward to the upcoming 30 For 30 on Flair. The trailer for the episode looks as though the program will be outstanding.

Last edited by Bored5000; 09-24-2017 at 11:02 AM.
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  #6  
Old 09-24-2017, 11:05 AM
wrestlingcardking wrestlingcardking is offline
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Are you getting into the market for each of these sets?
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Old 09-24-2017, 03:01 PM
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Eddie S.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrestlingcardking View Post
Are you getting into the market for each of these sets?
I would like to pick up a few of the major cards. I wish I had seen the complete sets of Parkhurst cards that sold at Mile High a few months ago. I realize the sets were lower condition, but $241 for a complete set from both years seemed like a great pick up for a collector.

I am mostly a non sports collector or sports outside the big four. I just finished the 1972 STP racing set. That is where the card in my avatar comes from. That is only an 11-card set, but there are a couple of extreme rarities contained within that set. I post most frequently in the "vintage racing" thread on the main board. Other than the '72 STP set, my collection is largely a variety of iconic/star type cards from a bunch of different sets and genres.

I like collecting racing (and cards outside the big four sports in general) because there are only a handful of cards that individually sell for over $500. I am always interested whenever the various wrestling sets are discussed on here, since I grew up as a huge WWF fan and faithfully read the Apter magazines each month.

I check out the auctions for wrestling cards on eBay at least a couple times a week. I am sure you know this, but so much of the eBay auctions for wrestling cards always seem to be modern autograph cards/diva cards.

Last edited by Bored5000; 09-24-2017 at 03:25 PM.
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Old 09-24-2017, 03:23 PM
wrestlingcardking wrestlingcardking is offline
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Let me know who you are looking for and i may have some if you want to go that route....i'd say they are lower grade if i have them.
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Old 09-24-2017, 04:12 PM
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PM sent.
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Old 09-25-2017, 09:57 PM
wrestlingcardking wrestlingcardking is offline
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Cards shipped today.....enjoy!
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