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  #11  
Old 09-29-2017, 10:50 AM
packs packs is offline
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I haven't read a single statement from a protester that mentioned being anti-military. Every statement I've read has been about fighting institutionalized racism. The anthem is seen as being a reflection of American values, but those values aren't always in place in society. Take for example the African American men who served in World War II against fascism and genocide who then came home to segregated bathrooms. That is why they protest during the anthem.

Last edited by packs; 09-29-2017 at 11:01 AM.
  #12  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by packs View Post
That is why they protest during the anthem.
No, read my earlier post. They protest against the anthem because the anthem is racist...

http://www.ebony.com/entertainment-c...#axzz4u4uQU1Tr

Everything is racist nowadays. Can't have historical plaques, can't have historical statues, can't have a national anthem, can't have anything that represents history because it's all racist.
  #13  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
I haven't read a single statement from a protester that mentioned being anti-military. Every statement I've read has been about fighting institutionalized racism. The anthem is seen as being a reflection of American values, but those values aren't always in place in society. Take for example the African American men who served in World War II against fascism and genocide who then came home to segregated bathrooms. That is why they protest during the anthem.
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  #14  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy View Post
No, read my earlier post. They protest against the anthem because the anthem is racist...

http://www.ebony.com/entertainment-c...#axzz4u4uQU1Tr

Everything is racist nowadays. Can't have historical plaques, can't have historical statues, can't have a national anthem, can't have anything that represents history because it's all racist.

Well, did you read the stanza from the anthem that is no longer recited? It is quite racist. But beyond that I think it's more important to listen to the people who are actually protesting and their self-professed motivations, none of which seem to mention the military at all.

As an aside, I don't think there is anything wrong with revisionist history. We are always changing the way we do things to better reflect the moment in time that we're in. I'll give you another example. Were you aware that prior to World War II Americans saluted the flag by extending the right arm to it? That tradition ended when the Nazi party adopted a similar salute. I don't think we're worse for wear for abandoning it.

Last edited by packs; 09-29-2017 at 11:11 AM.
  #15  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy View Post
The Star Spangled Banner has nothing to do with the military? Who knew?

Edited to add: The Star Spangled Banner is a military tune. It was written in a time of war, about war (the bombardment of Ft McHenry). The Star Spangled Banner is what is being protested. Blacks have labeled it as racist. ..

http://www.ebony.com/entertainment-c...#axzz4u4uQU1Tr

If it's not about the Star Spangled Banner, then why don't they just get out on the field at halftime and lock arms? Why not after the game? Why not some other venue?
People are protesting what they think is unfair racial treatment in America. Has zilch to with the military. A protest is about what the people protesting say its about. Not what other people want to turn it into.
  #16  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy View Post
No, read my earlier post. They protest against the anthem because the anthem is racist...

http://www.ebony.com/entertainment-c...#axzz4u4uQU1Tr

Everything is racist nowadays. Can't have historical plaques, can't have historical statues, can't have a national anthem, can't have anything that represents history because it's all racist.
Not everything is racist, only the things that are. Racism just happens to be a prevalent and shameful part of American history
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  #17  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by packs View Post
Well, did you read the stanza from the anthem that is no longer recited? It is quite racist. But beyond that I think it's more important to listen to the people who are actually protesting and their self-professed motivations, none of which seem to mention the military at all.

As an aside, I don't think there is anything wrong with revisionist history. We are always changing the way we do things to better reflect the moment in time that we're in. I'll give you another example. Were you aware that prior to World War II Americans saluted the flag by extending the right arm to it? That tradition ended when the Nazi party adopted a similar salute. I don't think we're worse for wear for abandoning it.
Racist? Not Racist? Whatever!
Military? Non-military? Whatever!

Do you believe that anybody has the right to protest while at work? While on the job? While being paid?
  #18  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy View Post
Racist? Not Racist? Whatever!
Military? Non-military? Whatever!

Do you believe that anybody has the right to protest while at work? While on the job? While being paid?
If you fire all the players, who is going to play the games? I don't think it's realistic to look at NFL players the same way you would an average employee. For example, is it reasonable for a normal employee to assume that failing a drug test would mean termination? I would say so. But that is not a foregone conclusion in the NFL.

Last edited by packs; 09-29-2017 at 11:26 AM.
  #19  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:31 AM
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If you fire all the players, who is going to play the games? I don't think it's realistic to look at NFL players the same way you would an average employee. For example, is it reasonable for a normal employee to assume that failing a drug test would mean termination? I would say so. But that is not a foregone conclusion in the NFL.
Employers have the right to make their own policies. If I failed a drug test at work, yes, I would be fired. Then again, if I beat my wife, it's none of their (my employer's) business where the NFL takes disciplinary action.

But, that didn't answer the question. Do you believe employees have the right to protest while at work on company time?

As far as firing all the players, I didn't say that and I don't want that. I fat deduction to their paycheck by order of a fine would be nice to see though.
  #20  
Old 09-29-2017, 11:34 AM
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The second the NFL starts fining players is the same second they all sit out. It would ruin the NFL.

I think employees should enjoy the same rights at work as they do outside of it. I don't feel as though I should have to surrender any freedoms because I need to feed myself. There are always going to be lines you can't cross in a professional setting, but I don't think that line is sitting down.

Last edited by packs; 09-29-2017 at 11:39 AM.
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