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  #11  
Old 05-20-2017, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Bored5000 View Post
What? Ripken is in the top 25 all-time for WAR; the only two shortstops ahead of him are Honus Wagner and Alex Rodriguez, who obviously was not a shortstop his entire career and was a steroid guy.

Even if you are not a new-age stats guy, 3,184 hits and 430 home runs are not HoF numbers? Have you looked at Ray Schalk's career numbers?
Agreed. Sure Ripken got overhyped because of the streak, but independent of that he was an easy first ballot HOFer, one of the very few greatest shortstops ever.

My choice would be Lloyd Waner -- negative WAR if I recall.
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Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-20-2017 at 06:56 PM.
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  #12  
Old 05-20-2017, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
My choice would be Lloyd Waner -- negative WAR if I recall.
First name that popped into my mind. Worst stats in the hall.

As far as football Aikman makes Namath look like comparing Ruth to Rick Ferrell. No reason he is there other than the lucky Qb for that team during the Dallas run. Zero all-pros, 5 of 12 seasons below .500 and an almost 50/50 touchdown to INT rate. God-awful for the busts in that room.
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  #13  
Old 05-20-2017, 08:02 PM
Aquarian Sports Cards Aquarian Sports Cards is offline
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Originally Posted by The Cardfather View Post
I know that I'm going to take a lot of flack for this, but my choice is........

Cal Ripken, Jr.

A very good player who was fortunate enough (and healthy enough) not to ever take or need a day off. But NOT a Hall-of-Fame player, IMHO.
Well I don't know if you like modern stats but his WAR is quite impressive, and regardless of whether or not he belongs he's FAR from the worst player in the Hall.
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  #14  
Old 05-20-2017, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Snapolit1 View Post
Joe Namath won the biggest game in his sport in a legendary upset. Has to count for a lot. Not arguing he deserved the Hall, but far from the least deserving candidate I can imagine.
I specifically noted the difference between worst and least deserving. I stick to my guns that he is the worst player in the NFL HOF.
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  #15  
Old 05-20-2017, 08:04 PM
Aquarian Sports Cards Aquarian Sports Cards is offline
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Originally Posted by Econteachert205 View Post
Bill Bradley NBA, only in because of New York.
Ah, but the Basketball HOF is just that, the BASKETBALL HOF, not the NBA HOF. So his college and Olympic exploits are really what got him in. To me the Basketball HOF is hard to even quantify because of its weird structure.
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  #16  
Old 05-20-2017, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by rats60 View Post
Joe Namath is a no brainer for the Hof. 2 MVP awards. Only QB to throw for 4k yards under the old rules. Bart Starr never threw for 2500 yards. Bob Griese never threw for 2500 yards. Len Dawson never threw for 2900 yards. All contemporaries of Namath and in the Hof.

Baseball - Tommy McCarthy
Football - Bob Hayes
Basketball - Bill Bradley
So because he threw the ball a TON more than other QB's of his era he was great???

The two years he won MVP he threw as many INT's as TD's and completed barely 50% of his passes. Just because some yutz gives you an award doesn't mean you are great.

You also seem to conveniently have left out contemporaries like Unitas and Tarkenton and focused on good QB's from run oriented teams.

QB Rating

Namath - 65.5
Starr - 80.5
Griese - 77.4
Dawson - 82.6
Tarkenton - 80.4
Unitas - 78.2

Completion Percentage

Namath - 50.1
Starr - 57.4
Griese - 56.2
Dawson - 57.1
Tarkenton - 57
Unitas - 54.6

Interception Percentage

Namath - 5.8
Starr - 4.4
Griese - 5
Dawson - 4.9
Tarkenton - 4.1
Unitas - 4.9

Now just for grins and giggles let's look at some NON-HOF guys of his era with similar numbers

Rating

Lamonica - 72.9
Roman Gabriel (Who won an MVP) - 74.3
Norm Snead - 65.5


Completion %

Lamonica - 49.5
Gabriel - 52.6
Snead - 52.3

INT%

Lamonica - 5.3
Gabriel - 3.3!!!
Snead - 5.9

It's pretty obvious which group Namath belongs in and he's not even the class of that group!
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Last edited by Aquarian Sports Cards; 05-20-2017 at 08:27 PM.
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  #17  
Old 05-20-2017, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards View Post
So because he threw the ball a TON more than other QB's of his era he was great???

The two years he won MVP he threw as many INT's as TD's and completed barely 50% of his passes. Just because some yutz gives you an award doesn't mean you are great.

You also seem to conveniently have left out contemporaries like Unitas and Tarkenton and focused on good QB's from run oriented teams.

QB Rating

Namath - 65.5
Starr - 80.5
Griese - 77.4
Dawson - 82.6
Tarkenton - 80.4
Unitas - 78.2

Completion Percentage

Namath - 50.1
Starr - 57.4
Griese - 56.2
Dawson - 57.1
Tarkenton - 57
Unitas - 54.6

Interception Percentage

Namath - 5.8
Starr - 4.4
Griese - 5
Dawson - 4.9
Tarkenton - 4.1
Unitas - 4.9

Now just for grins and giggles let's look at some NON-HOF guys of his era with similar numbers

Rating

Lamonica - 72.9
Roman Gabriel (Who won an MVP) - 74.3
Norm Snead - 65.5


Completion %

Lamonica - 49.5
Gabriel - 52.6
Snead - 52.3

INT%

Lamonica - 5.3
Gabriel - 3.3!!!
Snead - 5.9

It's pretty obvious which group Namath belongs in and he's not even the class of that group!
Yes it is obvious. He belongs in the middle of the Hof class. Never said he was the best QB of his era, he was just better than some contemporaries in the Hof. Nice strawman though.

Namath was also voted the greatest QB in AFL history, over Griese, Dawson and Lamonica. I'll take the word of those yutz who saw them play over some random internet poster who probably didn't.

Last edited by rats60; 05-20-2017 at 10:38 PM.
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  #18  
Old 05-20-2017, 11:13 PM
Bill77 Bill77 is offline
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My choice would be Rube Marquard. He was about as bad of a choice as Lloyd Waner.
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  #19  
Old 05-21-2017, 01:30 AM
Aquarian Sports Cards Aquarian Sports Cards is offline
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Originally Posted by JustinD View Post
First name that popped into my mind. Worst stats in the hall.

As far as football Aikman makes Namath look like comparing Ruth to Rick Ferrell. No reason he is there other than the lucky Qb for that team during the Dallas run. Zero all-pros, 5 of 12 seasons below .500 and an almost 50/50 touchdown to INT rate. God-awful for the busts in that room.
Namath 173 TD's and 220 INT's

Aikman 165 TD's 141 INT's
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  #20  
Old 05-21-2017, 01:31 AM
Aquarian Sports Cards Aquarian Sports Cards is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rats60 View Post
Yes it is obvious. He belongs in the middle of the Hof class. Never said he was the best QB of his era, he was just better than some contemporaries in the Hof. Nice strawman though.

Namath was also voted the greatest QB in AFL history, over Griese, Dawson and Lamonica. I'll take the word of those yutz who saw them play over some random internet poster who probably didn't.
Not sure how comparing him statistically to the QB's YOU mentioned in a statistical comparison is a strawman, but OK.
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