NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-13-2006, 06:45 PM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Julie Vognar

One of the seven Negro League players elected to the Hall of Fame (this doesn't include the pre-Negro league, or the executives)--my friend Britt Peter can't out ANYTHING about him, in any book aboiut the Negro Leagues, or anywhere else. Anybody help?

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-13-2006, 08:08 PM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Cooper was a solid left-handed pitcher for the Detroit Stars in the 1920's and Kansas City Monarchs from the late 20's to early 40's. He also managed the Monarchs in the 1930's.

For his sustained excellence he's a worthy HOFer, but was never a dominant pitcher. Once the stats are released, I'm sure his election will make more sense.

Of the 8 pitchers on the ballot, I personally had him ranked 6th. Out of those 8, the top 6 would all have been legitimate HOFers. Only 3 of them were elected (Ray Brown, Jose Mendez, Andy Cooper).






-Ryan

Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-13-2006, 08:20 PM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: jimsandy cooper

SCD, starting with its Feb 24th issue and continuing for the next three issues had excellent profiles on all 39 candidates for the 06 ballot. It included pictures, bios and whatever stats were available.

Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-14-2006, 07:16 AM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Daniel Bretta

The stats that I have available for him shows that he compiled a 145-65 W/L record not including his time in Cuba...these stats I'm sure are incomplete. His best year was probably 1936 when he went 27-8 for the Monarchs. He became the manager of the Monarchs in 1937 and won the first Negro American League Pennant...he won two more pennants in 1939 and '40 before passing away at the young age of 45.

Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-14-2006, 11:52 AM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Daniel,

What is the source of your stats? I believe your numbers differ from the "official" numbers compiled by the committee appointed by the HOF.

Cooper's lifetime record in Cuba was 11-17.

-Ryan

Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-14-2006, 01:27 PM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Daniel Bretta

Ryan, I took them from "The Biographical Encyclopedia of the Negro Baseball Leagues" by James A. Riley. I'm at work right now and don't have the book with me so I'm not sure how they came up with their statistics....I do know that they have his record in Cuba at 15-17 over three years.

Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-14-2006, 02:10 PM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Daniel,

Riley's stats differ from what is ultimately going to be considered the "official" statistical record. Cooper's lifetime record for the Negro Leagues, California Winter League, and Cuba combined is 149-80. A .651 winning percentage is still impressive.

His record in Cuba is as follows:

1923-24: 1-6
1924 (Gran Premio): 1-2
1924-25: 3-2
1928-29: 6-7

Total: 11 wins, 17 losses.

-Ryan

Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-14-2006, 04:28 PM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Daniel Bretta

I'm not sure anyone will ever have a definitive statisitcal account of the Negro Leagues, but I'm sure the Negro League Committee spent more time researching Andy Cooper than Riley did. I wonder how he came up with 15 wins in Cuba though?

Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-14-2006, 06:28 PM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Paul

I know this is sour grapes from a guy who now needs Cooper's card, but it sure seems strange that they would elect someone who was never considered a dominant pitcher. With so many outstanding, dominant candidates out there (Dick Redding????), why Cooper? Maybe it will make sense when his stats are released, like Ryan says.

Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-15-2006, 06:46 AM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Chad

If you can imagine Tom Glavine becoming a manager and winning a couple of pennants, that about sums up Andy Cooper for me. Like Glavine, he was never dominant like Randy Johnson or Pedro Martinez, but he was consistently excellent over a long career while pitching for excellent teams. He was a good choice, I think.

--Chad

Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 03-15-2006, 10:23 AM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Paul

I am far from an expert, but it just seems like Lefty Grove didn't make it, but Phil Niekro did -- or maybe Tom Glavine with some success as a manager like Chad says.

Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 03-15-2006, 10:58 AM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Chad

They just had great careers in different ways. The committee got it right with Mendez, Cooper and Ray Brown, but maybe dropped the ball on Dick Redding. I would have liked to see Redding get in before Pompez and Manley--hell, I would have liked Nip Winters, John Donaldson or Chet Brewer to get in before those two--but that's all spilled milk now. I'm choosing to focus on the 15 inductions they made that I'm happy with. It's cool people are talking about these guys, too. A lot more people know about Dobie Moore and Alejandro Oms and Red Parnell, for sure.

--Chad

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 03-16-2006, 02:11 AM
Archive Archive is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 58,359
Default Andy Cooper?

Posted By: Julie Vognar

from my friend Britt, to whom I read the first 8 posts...

Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:05 AM.


ebay GSB