The Junk Wax Era- when did it start?

[1963Topps Set]

Originally Posted by valediction

I think most people look way too hard to find fault with things they didn't grow up with, and ignore the faults in those they DID grow up with. Part of human nature, things that we are familiar with seem 'better' than other things. It happens all the time the music today sucks, the movies aren't as good, TV shows are terrible, sports cards are junk, etc.

I completely agree with that statement! However, if you check carefully, you will see that the quality in most things have gone down considerably. To coin a well worn phrase, they don't make 'me like they used to!

[valediction]

Originally Posted by 1963Topps Set

I completely agree with that statement! However, if you check carefully, you will see that the quality in most things have gone down considerably. To coin a well worn phrase, they don't make 'me like they used to!

Depends on what you're looking at.

In sports cards, it's been a fair while since I opened boxes with 70+% off center rates, miscuts so bad you can see two distinct cards, 90% or so rates of print spots/dots, cards stained with wax, gum eating through the cards like I saw regularly in the 80's. I get less wrong/blank backs or fronts, the card stock is better, print quality is better, less rough cut edges...

[1963Topps Set]

Actually, wrong backs, miscuts (where you see two cards), variations, bleed through errors, overprints, and many others are rather collectable today. They add to the spontinatiety and personality of the older cards. The new cards are to pristine, glossy, always right, who needs that? I don't.

[valediction]

Originally Posted by 1963Topps Set

Actually, wrong backs, miscuts (where you see two cards), variations, bleed through errors, overprints, and many others are rather collectable today. They add to the spontinatiety and personality of the older cards. The new cards are to pristine, glossy, always right, who needs that? I don't.

But that's just making my point. Who knows how people will feel 20-30-50 years from now about the cards of TODAY. You have nostalgia for the cards you grew up with. You rationalize and excuse the flaws that if they happened today would be chalked up as 'nobody at Topps cares, quality control sucks'. Because they happened when you collected and the eras before, they are unique, add personality, etc. Take cards being issued in 4-7 series over the summer. That wouldn't work as well today because everyone would order each series and save them, unless Topps released markedly less product as the season progressed, there wouldn't be scarce series. When Topps makes SP's as something to chase so it's more challenging than just 'buy a box of series 1 and series 2 and be done', they get lambasted, but when you are chasing cards that didn't get released in your town 50 years ago, it's perfectly fine to spend years chasing those last 25 SP's and brag about the finish. Maybe those Super SP's from 2013 Topps will be looked on fondly and adults coming back in the hobby in 20 years will be telling stories about bugging their mom at the checkout line at Target and they pulled that Bryce Harper Sunglasses variation from the one pack their mom bought them back in the day, complaining about how new cards are junk.

[1963Topps Set]

In the future, doesn't matter how far along, a 1954 Topps set will always be in far more demand then the 2014 Topps set. As I stated in a previous post, I can go to my local supermarket and get unopened packs from the late 1980s / early 1990s (These are already over 20 - 25 years old!) but there are no unopened packs from the late 1960s / early 1970s. Junk will always be junk no matter how old it is.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by 1963Topps Set

In the future, doesn't matter how far along, a 1954 Topps set will always be in far more demand then the 2014 Topps set. As I stated in a previous post, I can go to my local supermarket and get unopened packs from the late 1980s / early 1990s (These are already over 20 - 25 years old!) but there are no unopened packs from the late 1960s / early 1970s. Junk will always be junk no matter how old it is.

could argue that the 1954 topps isn't big in demand either..

[1963Topps Set]

You mean you would rather have a 2014 set then a 1954 set? As far as 1954 Topps not being in demand, then give me an Aaron rookie for the same price as the most expensive card in the 2014 set.

[mortimer brewster]

I purchased a baseball book back in 1978, written in 1976. In the book Cy Berger mentioned that Topps sold 500 Million baseball cards in 1975. With a 660 card set you can do the math.

To me the wax era officially began with the introduction of Pro Set in 1988 (football) then score etc.


I remember in 1991 buying a pack of Upper Deck baseball cards at my local Vix drug store. When I opened a pack, right in the middle was a pro set card. Packs were pretty much tamper proof. Were they using the same print facilities? If I remember the President of Pro Set was a shady character.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by mortimer brewster

I purchased a baseball book back in 1978, written in 1976. In the book Cy Berger mentioned that Topps sold 500 Million baseball cards in 1975. With a 660 card set you can do the math.

To me the wax era officially began with the introduction of Pro Set in 1988 (football) then score etc.


I remember in 1991 buying a pack of Upper Deck baseball cards at my local Vix drug store. When I opened a pack, right in the middle was a pro set card. Packs were pretty much tamper proof. Were they using the same print facilities? If I remember the President of Pro Set was a shady character.

There was a company that advertised in the Thomas Register* that they offered secure random packing for trading cards.



*At the time an enormous yellow pages of sorts mostly for manufacturing. Like bigger than an encyclopedia.

[West]

I too would be interested in hearing of any production numbers that people have found. Specifically for Topps in the junk era '87-'94. Someone mentioned the population figure of a billion cards for Topps in the mid-80's. Would love to see a source for this.

According to the novel "Card Sharks" UD made 125,000 cases, which is approx. 1.4 billion cards, in the inaugural 1989 set. I'm not sure how accurate that is, but it was referenced in the book. As some may remember, there were rumors of extra press runs of star players and Griffey going straight to the dealers.

But let's say Topps made a billion cards of say, '90 topps. After you divide by 792, that makes 1.25 million of each card in the set. My guess is that the actual population was closer to 5-10 million of each card. That would make the total print run somewhere between 4-8 billion cards. That seems like an absurd number, yet just from what I see for unopened availability I feel like the production continued to grow each year from 1987-1992. I know the production figures were quite heavily guarded but does anyone have any info we could use to sort of indirectly piece this together?

[toad strangler]

Great thread. Need some updated thoughts! Early 80's to mid 80's cases are vanishing. Sure there are many hording it but it's getting tougher to find and very expensive 1985 on down. 1986 Topps wax cases, with virtually no anchor rookie card, command a grand now. Sorry Cecil Fielder lol

[wdwfan]

I agree with this. I've started looking for boxes, rack packs, unopened sets, cases (of Traded/The Rookies sets), Glossy/Tiffany sets, etc. from the 1980s-1990s, and they're expensive. The asking prices are expensive at least. But I'm going to try and start picking a few of those things up.

Originally Posted by toad strangler

Great thread. Need some updated thoughts! Early 80's to mid 80's cases are vanishing. Sure there are many hording it but it's getting tougher to find and very expensive 1985 on down. 1986 Topps wax cases, with virtually no anchor rookie card, command a grand now. Sorry Cecil Fielder lol

[Exhibitman]

The other issues that are starting to rise are the mid-nineties premium issues with either insert cards or serial #d cards. That $200K Select Jeter is the biggest one but high end limited edition cards of the era have a loyal following and are getting pricey. I used to pull them regularly from the cheapo bins and junk wax tables at the National but found relatively few available this past year at the show. The unopened has gone up. If there are decent inserts or parallels in the issue, it isn't a $20 box anymore.

On a tangential but somewhat related note, last year I purchased an unopened box of 2013 Panini Golden Age. It was really cheap (I think about $15) and I was hoping for a signed Bad News Bears card. I got one



but I also pulled a redemption card for a signed Stan Lee card. It was long expired but many states make it illegal to terminate redemptions or require valuables to go through the escheat process. I went to the Panini site and plugged in the code and it showed as active. Four months later my card arrived. So those old redemption cards may still be honored.

[mortimer brewster]

I should have typed Junk Era

[Elberson]

I found it a nice read and lots of info. I recently purchased a few lots of cards, so had to justify my spending lol

2400....82 donruss
2400....86 donruss
2400....87 donruss
2400....87 fleer glossy
2400....88 fleer glossy

[wdwfan]

My collecting started in 1987 when my grandmother gave me the green Christmas boxed set for Christmas that year. We sat there and looked at the fronts and backs of every card. She didn't follow baseball and didn't care anything about it nor cards, but she sat there to spend time with me. I still have that set and box today.


That said, 1987 through about 1991 was my heyday for collecting. After school on Fridays, we'd go get ice cream. It was next door to a Piggly Wiggly, and my parents would let me walk over there to buy packs of cards. I really picked up football in 1990 and 1991 when I started playing in school.

But to answer the original OP, I think 1987 started the overproduction era. But I still do buy packs of that stuff when I see them. I bought 3 1989 Donruss packs last weekend at the flea market for $1.