NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you give an opinion of a person or company your full name needs to be in your post. Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Sports (Primarily) Vintage Memorabilia Forum incl. Game Used

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-04-2012, 12:20 PM
cardsfan22 cardsfan22 is offline
member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 8
Default Help solve the great baseball mystery

I have a really interesting mystery and would be grateful to anyone that has any insight. I am a huge lifelong Cardinals fan and my childhood hero growing up was Jack Clark. A few years ago Jack sold some of his personal stuff from his career including his two Silver Slugger awards and some home run balls. Recently on an impulse (I usually dont buy a lot of sports memorabilia) I bought his 300th home run ball from the guy Jack sold it to back in 2007. I received the ball and a letter from Jack stating this was his 300th home run ball that he hit while on the Padres on July 30th, 1990 and he even signed the ball "My 300th". There was no doubt in my mind that the ball and the letter were indeed from Jack Clark as there are also pictures of him signing the ball.

Now here is where the mystery begins. As I was looking at the ball I noticed that it said "A. Bartlett Giamatti" as the National League President on the front. Out of curiosity I looked up online and discovered that Giamatti had served as National League President from 1986 until his sudden death in 1989. After his death William D. White became the president. So my obvious question was how could this ball be from a game in 1990 with Giamatti's name on it as president when he had been dead for a year? I have talked to a few people and done a bunch of research but so far no one can tell me 100% if it is possible for a ball used in 1990 to still have Giamatti as president on the ball. Do you think a team would use balls that still had Giamiatti as the president in a year when there was another president? There was also the fact that the lock-out occured at the beginning of 1990 so I wasnt sure if that would make a difference as well.

Any help solving this would be greatly appreciated!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-04-2012, 12:36 PM
travrosty travrosty is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 2,239
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsfan22 View Post
I have a really interesting mystery and would be grateful to anyone that has any insight. I am a huge lifelong Cardinals fan and my childhood hero growing up was Jack Clark. A few years ago Jack sold some of his personal stuff from his career including his two Silver Slugger awards and some home run balls. Recently on an impulse (I usually dont buy a lot of sports memorabilia) I bought his 300th home run ball from the guy Jack sold it to back in 2007. I received the ball and a letter from Jack stating this was his 300th home run ball that he hit while on the Padres on July 30th, 1990 and he even signed the ball "My 300th". There was no doubt in my mind that the ball and the letter were indeed from Jack Clark as there are also pictures of him signing the ball.

Now here is where the mystery begins. As I was looking at the ball I noticed that it said "A. Bartlett Giamatti" as the National League President on the front. Out of curiosity I looked up online and discovered that Giamatti had served as National League President from 1986 until his sudden death in 1989. After his death William D. White became the president. So my obvious question was how could this ball be from a game in 1990 with Giamatti's name on it as president when he had been dead for a year? I have talked to a few people and done a bunch of research but so far no one can tell me 100% if it is possible for a ball used in 1990 to still have Giamatti as president on the ball. Do you think a team would use balls that still had Giamiatti as the president in a year when there was another president? There was also the fact that the lock-out occured at the beginning of 1990 so I wasnt sure if that would make a difference as well.

Any help solving this would be greatly appreciated!



does anyone know where jack clark lives, maybe he can shed some light on it himself?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-04-2012, 01:23 PM
BrandonG's Avatar
BrandonG BrandonG is offline
Brandon M. Grunbaum
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Newport Beach, CA
Posts: 230
Default

I had a similar question when it came to finding Giamatti baseballs inside Coleman boxes. Rawlings did do a reprint of the Giamatti ball for some reason, but it was my understanding that they were not used in games and were sold at discount in the 1990's. Does the ball have a Haiti stamp underneath the Rawlings logo? If not it is one of these reprints, if it does then it is from the actual period when Bart was President.
__________________
History of the Baseball Official National & American League Base Ball Guides now available! Here
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-04-2012, 01:30 PM
jimq jimq is offline
member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 87
Default

Here's a website that has what seems like pretty good information, including photos. Doesn't show anything Giamatti used in 1990 but it does show Giamatti in 1989.

I guess it's possible that the Padres could have had some leftovers from 89 but it seems odd that they would be using them in late July.


Interesting reading anyway, good luck on your search!

http://photos.bigleaguebaseballs.com...LL-010.JPG.php
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-04-2012, 01:30 PM
Splinte1941 Splinte1941 is offline
WillRow.ett III
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 204
Default

Jack Clark went through bankruptcy, did he not? Your obvious concern is that he was simply passing this ball off as his 300th, not realizing the problem with the ball's stamping, to make some extra cash. Whoops.

The Haiti stamp or lack thereof will provide you all the evidence you need. I hope you can find the guy you bought it from and maybe even Clark.

Can't MLB shed some light on this?

Last edited by Splinte1941; 05-04-2012 at 01:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-04-2012, 02:14 PM
Scott Garner's Avatar
Scott Garner Scott Garner is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 5,174
Default

What was the date of "Dude's" 300th HR?

At what point the game was played in the season could potentially be a factor. If the HR was hit late in the 1990 season I think you could eliminate that as a good probability, FWIW.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-04-2012, 03:37 PM
cardsfan22 cardsfan22 is offline
member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 8
Default

Thank you for all the responses and for all the interesting insight! The date of the home run was July 30th, 1990 Padres vs Braves. The ball does have the Haiti stamp and definitely looks like a game used ball. I am going to try and attach a few pictures of the ball. I guess my only concern is that maybe Jack grabbed another ball that he had and said it was his 300th HR, whether intentional or not. There is writing on the ball in ink that looks pretty old that says 300th HR and the date and who he hit it off. He then signed "My 300th" when he sold it in 2007.

Another forum member sent me a private message and said in his experience in the industry often times balls from previous years are used even if the commissioner has changed, that especially back in 1990 they would never just throw away good balls. Also the fact that Giamatti died suddenly would make it even more likely they would still be using his stamped ball in 1990.

All in all I am leaning towards this being the actual ball, just funny how it just had to have the Giamatti stamp which would naturally make me question its authenticity.

photo 1.jpg

photo 2.jpg

photo 3.jpg
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-04-2012, 04:12 PM
Aquifer Aquifer is offline
Eric Nelson
member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Castro Valley, CA
Posts: 52
Default Clark 300th

Considering that Kent Mercker's name is spelled wrong on the ball, it would make sense that Jack wrote it! As for believing anything he says, I'd be careful.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-04-2012, 04:55 PM
mcgwirecom's Avatar
mcgwirecom mcgwirecom is offline
R@nda!! H@hn
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Hatboro, Pa
Posts: 841
Default

Wouldn't be the first time there was a descrepancy on a milestone HR ball. Remember Mickey's 500th? That was a fiasco! I was at the Guernseys auction where it was pulled.

Last edited by mcgwirecom; 05-04-2012 at 04:56 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-04-2012, 05:54 PM
Splinte1941 Splinte1941 is offline
WillRow.ett III
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 204
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquifer View Post
Considering that Kent Mercker's name is spelled wrong on the ball, it would make sense that Jack wrote it! As for believing anything he says, I'd be careful.
I would agree with this and as I said before, considering The Dude's financial woes, smoke starts to appear. Hope I'm wrong.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Hey Big Spender Yankeefan51 Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 119 06-27-2011 08:27 PM
solve a mystery? 1960s small baseball cards, cut outs Archive Postwar Baseball Cards Forum (Pre-1980) 3 05-04-2008 09:58 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:03 AM.


ebay GSB