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  #51  
Old 11-24-2018, 08:54 PM
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Perhaps somewhere, Robert James Fischer is looking up (I assume) with contempt.
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  #52  
Old 11-24-2018, 09:49 PM
mark evans mark evans is offline
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I agree that chess at the highest levels may well be in trouble, especially insofar as public interest. It appears that championship matches henceforth may unfortunately always or nearly always be resolved by rapid or blitz games.

I'm disappointed that this match is not receiving more publicity given first American player since Fischer in '72.
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  #53  
Old 11-25-2018, 02:59 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
Perhaps somewhere, Robert James Fischer is looking up (I assume) with contempt.
No doubt Fischer is looking up. He earned his place in hell with his anti-semitic rants
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  #54  
Old 11-25-2018, 11:43 AM
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Quote:
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No doubt Fischer is looking up. He earned his place in hell with his anti-semitic rants
He was already mentally unwell, it seems, at his peak. Amazing piece by the way, must reading.

http://www.thestacksreader.com/the-day-bobby-blew-it/

A priceless line: He wears a business suit about as naturally as a python wears a necktie.
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  #55  
Old 11-25-2018, 09:42 PM
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Thanks, Peter. Good story.
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  #56  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:25 PM
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I know very little about chess, but I followed the game for a while just now and was disappointed to see Carlsen agree to a draw after just 31 moves when it seemed he was starting to press the attack and perhaps had an advantage. In the hour or more I followed it, I did not see a single piece captured. I assume that's unusual. Caruana just seemed to be making nothing moves hoping to survive, although I don't know enough to judge. I imagine by chess standards this was extremely boring and even pathetic. Certainly the posters commenting on the site I was watching were disgusted.
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  #57  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:26 PM
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The 12th and final game just ended in a draw.

With all due respect, the game started out sharply with both players fighting for a win. Fabiano had an early advantage, but let it slip as Magnus developed a very strong attack. He wavered a little, and then without warning offered Fabiano a draw. Apparently he actually said he would have a big advantage in the tiebreaker and expected to beat Caruana. Very strange ending for sure.

Wednesday they play four games, 25 minutes each per player, and if that ends 2-2 they will play a long series of 5 minute blitz games until someone wins.

In Carlsen's long career, he has never lost a tiebreaker. Wednesday should be interesting.
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  #58  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:33 PM
Arazi4442 Arazi4442 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
The 12th and final game just ended in a draw.

With all due respect, the game started out sharply with both players fighting for a win. Fabiano had an early advantage, but let it slip as Magnus developed a very strong attack. He wavered a little, and then without warning offered Fabiano a draw. Apparently he actually said he would have a big advantage in the tiebreaker and expected to beat Caruana. Very strange ending for sure.

Wednesday they play four games, 25 minutes each per player, and if that ends 2-2 they will play a long series of 5 minute blitz games until someone wins.

In Carlsen's long career, he has never lost a tiebreaker. Wednesday should be interesting.
No matter how the tiebreak ends up, I'm sad to say I was pretty disappointed in this world title match. Magnus looking to cement his status as the best ever vs. the first American challenger in nearly a half century. If they had traded hyper aggressive wins or even if they both took chances and Magnus wiped the floor with Fabiano, it could have gotten much more attention.

Like waiting 4 years for a Super Bowl game and it's decided in OT by a FG contest.
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  #59  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:46 PM
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I was just watching the grandmasters moderating the match do an analysis of the position. In almost every line, Magnus had a winning game. Yet he decided to offer Fabiano a draw, when Fabiano was in very bad time pressure (which of course makes it harder to find a successful defense). None of them understood why he did not press on to victory.

When Carlsen was shown all his winning lines in the post game analysis, he apparently responded "I don't care." A great mystery to me.
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  #60  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:47 PM
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Peter- I just noticed you posted the result a minute before me. Obviously we were typing at the same time.
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  #61  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
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Peter- I just noticed you posted the result a minute before me. Obviously we were typing at the same time.
No doubt your analysis was far superior. I was just conveying my gut reaction.
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  #62  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
I was just watching the grandmasters moderating the match do an analysis of the position. In almost every line, Magnus had a winning game. Yet he decided to offer Fabiano a draw, when Fabiano was in very bad time pressure (which of course makes it harder to find a successful defense). None of them understood why he did not press on to victory.

When Carlsen was shown all his winning lines in the post game analysis, he apparently responded "I don't care." A great mystery to me.
His analysis obviously was that, even with an advantage in the game, his chances of winning were greater in a tiebreaker. Risk averse. Not like a true champion. If he were a boxer he'd be content to win on points. I lost a lot of respect for him. I hope somehow Caruana can speed up his play and win.
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Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 11-26-2018 at 12:52 PM.
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  #63  
Old 11-26-2018, 01:17 PM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
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If Caruana were to win the tiebreaker, Magnus's decision to offer a draw will haunt him for a long time to come. If he wins it, it will soon be forgotten.

One thing I learned in this match is that Carlsen was a better player four or five years ago than he is now. Chess players can't stay at their peak forever, and while he is still arguably the strongest player in the world, the rest of the pack is gradually catching up. A 23 year old Magnus would have won this match handily. He is now pushing 28, and while still very young, he is in the early stages of his downswing.
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  #64  
Old 11-27-2018, 08:02 AM
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Maybe he should join Ernie Ratelband's lawsuit in order to lower his age back to 23

This discussion is now getting depressing for old guys like me.
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  #65  
Old 11-27-2018, 08:16 AM
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I'm 66 Al, and although I still love to play chess, the old noggin' doesn't always calculate as quickly and clearly as I would like.
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  #66  
Old 11-27-2018, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
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I'm 66 Al, and although I still love to play chess, the old noggin' doesn't always calculate as quickly and clearly as I would like.
Though much is taken, much abides.
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  #67  
Old 11-27-2018, 11:11 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
He was already mentally unwell, it seems, at his peak. Amazing piece by the way, must reading.

http://www.thestacksreader.com/the-day-bobby-blew-it/

A priceless line: He wears a business suit about as naturally as a python wears a necktie.
I finally read the article Peter, thanks for the link. I always knew how hard it was to get Bobby to go to Iceland, but never read that much detail about it. I always thought he was afraid of losing.

His mental problems continued when the match started. He lost game one on a silly blunder, and forfeited game two when he refused to play. He claimed his chair was bugged with microphones, and there were cameras hidden in the florescent lights. His entourage thought he was having a breakdown and were ready to give up on the match.

After a few days he calmed down, and when he sat down for game three he proceeded to play some of the best chess ever seen. Over the final nineteen games he won seven times and only lost once. That is an enormous margin for players of that caliber.

It was also the last competitive chess he ever played. He never played another serious game for the rest of his life.

Last edited by barrysloate; 11-27-2018 at 11:15 AM.
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  #68  
Old 11-27-2018, 11:19 AM
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He was supposed to play Karpov in 1975 but his conditions were rejected.

He played Spassky in 1992. It was not for a title, but I think most people would consider it a serious match.
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Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 11-27-2018 at 11:40 AM.
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  #69  
Old 11-28-2018, 05:00 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
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The 1992 match was an exhibition and not sanctioned. Fischer was 49 and Spassky was in his mid-50's, and the chess they played was mediocre. It was also what got Fischer banned from ever returning to the United States. IIRC, it was played in Yugoslavia and Americans weren't allowed there. The whole match was kind of sad as it reminded Fischer's fans of how he wasted his talents.
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  #70  
Old 11-28-2018, 10:09 AM
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Magnus Carlsen won the first game of the tiebreaker and leads 1-0.
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  #71  
Old 11-28-2018, 11:09 AM
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Magnus Carlsen just won the second game and leads 2-0. This one was a bit of a steamroller. Carlsen only needs a draw in the final two games to retain his title.
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  #72  
Old 11-28-2018, 12:25 PM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
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Carlsen won the third game and has retained his World Champion crown. My take is Caruana was unable to win even a single game, and Carlsen was undoubtedly the better player.

I am very disappointed with the result, but what can you do. I want to thank everyone who participated on this thread. As you may have noticed, I'm a chess junkie. I am also a big fan of Fabiano, and feel bad that he couldn't have played better.
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  #73  
Old 11-28-2018, 12:39 PM
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What a difference a day makes. Complete domination of the rapids by Carlsen.
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  #74  
Old 11-28-2018, 01:26 PM
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Complete domination indeed.

The first game Caruana was behind but looked like he could draw. Then he missed a move and lost in the endgame.

In the second game Caruana had a reasonable initiative and attack, but miscalculated and lost very quickly.

Needing a win only in the third game, Caruana pressed for victory, but sometimes when you press too hard in an even position you lose. That is exactly what happened.

Carlsen showed today, and throughout the match, that he is still the best player in the world, until proven otherwise.

Last edited by barrysloate; 11-28-2018 at 01:27 PM.
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