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Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

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  #1  
Old 08-09-2012, 10:13 AM
timn1 timn1 is offline
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Default Mathewson pronunciation? (and book recommendation)

After hearing great things about it for years, I've finally gotten around to reading Eric Rolfe Greenberg's novel The Celebrant (which WP Kinsella, author of [Shoeless Joe]/Field of Dreams, calls the best BB novel ever written). I think WPK may be right, it is tremendous. The characters are really well drawn, and the baseball action done well. Highest recommendation!

Mathewson is central to the book, and one moment in which a character calls him "Matson" got me wondering whether his name might have been pronounced "Matheson" at the time.

This infoplease site gives both pronunciations:
http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/people/A0832207.html

I also found this thread from 2011:
http://www.net54baseball.com/archive...?t-137301.html

"Matheson" makes sense to me. Should he join the list of recently revised (or at least proposed) names? "Nap Lajoway," "Johnny Ee-vers," "KyeKye Cuyler," "Earle Coombs," "Dan Broothers"... am I forgetting anyone?

Last edited by timn1; 08-09-2012 at 04:08 PM. Reason: correction of title
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  #2  
Old 08-09-2012, 10:19 AM
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add Ha-nus Wagner, not Hoe-nus.
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  #3  
Old 08-09-2012, 11:38 AM
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Ed See-cot (Cicotte)
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  #4  
Old 08-09-2012, 11:52 AM
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It has happened several times growing up that I would call a player by a pronunciation until I finally would see a televised game of that player and realize I had been saying it wrong all that time.

It would be nice if the cards had the pronunciation on the back of the cards for some of these newer players.

Maybe someone can make a pronunciation set for the vintage players.
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  #5  
Old 08-09-2012, 11:59 AM
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Most of these debates can be decided when listening to the Glory of their Times CD...

http://www.amazon.com/The-Glory-Thei...their+times+cd

...and the 1939 Hall of Fame Game and Inductions CD...

http://www.amazon.com/1939-Baseball-...+centennial+cd


I believe it is LA-zha-way ...and MATH-eh-son....
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  #6  
Old 08-09-2012, 01:23 PM
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I remember when I was younger and just getting into cards I would ask dealers at shows if they had cards of Nap Lajoy. It would be a while until I found out it was La-Joo-Way.
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  #7  
Old 08-09-2012, 03:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
I remember when I was younger and just getting into cards I would ask dealers at shows if they had cards of Nap Lajoy. It would be a while until I found out it was La-Joo-Way.
Ditto... I probably had never heard it pronounced LaJooWay until listening to Glory of their times.

I believe Sam Crawford also pronounced Eve-ers which I had never heard.


edit to add:
Quote:
Originally Posted by timn1 View Post
"Matheson" makes sense to me. Should he join the list of recently revised (or at least proposed) names? "Nap Lajoway," "Johnny Ee-vers," "KyeKye Cuyler," "Earle Coombs," "Dan Broothers"... am I forgetting anyone?
Sorry Tim, I went back and re-read your post....You beat me to Ee-vers !


Loved the Celebrant. Read it on rec from this site (FrankW I think). It really lit a fire under me to go for the t206-518 set

Last edited by tonyo; 08-09-2012 at 03:40 PM.
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  #8  
Old 08-09-2012, 06:50 PM
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There was a while where I was pronouncing Schoendienst like I was saying Shown-a-dentist.
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  #9  
Old 08-09-2012, 08:22 PM
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Alejandro Pom-pay. (Pompez)

-Ryan
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  #10  
Old 08-10-2012, 08:57 AM
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I believe Eddie Frierson who has made a life study of Christy for his one man play told a SABR Deadball gathering that it is Math-U-son?

At some of these gatherings we have often gone over player names, I do know Eve-ers is correct. One SABR member called every Lajoie in New England and came up with a variety of choices?
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  #11  
Old 08-10-2012, 09:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timn1 View Post
After hearing great things about it for years, I've finally gotten around to reading Eric Rolfe Greenberg's novel The Celebrant (which WP Kinsella, author of [Shoeless Joe]/Field of Dreams, calls the best BB novel ever written). I think WPK may be right, it is tremendous. The characters are really well drawn, and the baseball action done well. Highest recommendation!

Mathewson is central to the book, and one moment in which a character calls him "Matson" got me wondering whether his name might have been pronounced "Matheson" at the time.

This infoplease site gives both pronunciations:
http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/people/A0832207.html

I also found this thread from 2011:
http://www.net54baseball.com/archive...?t-137301.html

"Matheson" makes sense to me. Should he join the list of recently revised (or at least proposed) names? "Nap Lajoway," "Johnny Ee-vers," "KyeKye Cuyler," "Earle Coombs," "Dan Broothers"... am I forgetting anyone?
In the book, as I recall, the character who pronounces it Matson -- I think it was the narrator's uncle who has a thick accent --knows nothing about baseball and the mispronunciation is a humorous way to convey that.
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Old 08-10-2012, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T206Collector View Post
Most of these debates can be decided when listening to the Glory of their Times CD...
I've noticed different players pronounce players' names differently, even the old guys on this cd who were contemporaries. Makes sense, as we do the same (Gonzaga, etc.), so you can't rely completely on "Glory of Their Times".

I'll re-listen and write down some examples.
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  #13  
Old 08-10-2012, 10:39 AM
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Ma-the-wson
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  #14  
Old 08-10-2012, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Runscott View Post
I've noticed different players pronounce players' names differently, even the old guys on this cd who were contemporaries. Makes sense, as we do the same (Gonzaga, etc.), so you can't rely completely on "Glory of Their Times".

I'll re-listen and write down some examples.
I don't remember any inconsistencies in pronunciation, but that doesn't mean there weren't any. Cicotte, maybe? Or was it just that Ritter pronounced it "sa-COTT-tee" and others like Joe Wood called him "SY-cott." Neal and I were struck when doing the set by how many names were different from what we had thought. Just with Washington players, for instance, Joe Cantillon and Clyde Milan. Makes me wonder how many pronunciations are to be found on the raw tapes that would change the common perception?
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Old 08-10-2012, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hankphenom View Post
...Makes me wonder how many pronunciations are to be found on the raw tapes that would change the common perception?
Sounds like you've got a new project to work on
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  #16  
Old 08-10-2012, 10:42 AM
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A little off topic, but Kinsella's Box Socials is funny, sweet and an excellent read
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  #17  
Old 08-10-2012, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbcard1 View Post
A little off topic, but Kinsella's Box Socials is funny, sweet and an excellent read
Did you read "Iowa Baseball Confederacy"? I thought it was even better than "Field of Dreams".
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  #18  
Old 08-10-2012, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
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Did you read "Iowa Baseball Confederacy"? I thought it was even better than "Field of Dreams".


+1

I also think the correct pronunciation is Math'-yew-son

Last edited by tbob; 08-10-2012 at 03:24 PM.
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  #19  
Old 08-10-2012, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Runscott View Post
Makes sense, as we do the same (Gonzaga, etc.)
Only folks from outside of Spokane (That's SPO-CAN, not SPO-CAIN, LOL) mispronounce it

Gahn-Za-Guh

Not quite sure how to write out the middle syllable

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Old 08-10-2012, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
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I also think the correct pronunciation is Math'-yew-son
That's how I've always said it.

Tabe
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  #21  
Old 08-11-2012, 05:56 AM
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La-zha-way was at the 1939 induction, and you can hear him announced and then hear him talk on the Centenial CD i posted above. The announcer also says Math-eh-son, i believe, even though i always say Math-u-son, which is what I call my son of the same name (when I'm not calling him Matty).
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Last edited by T206Collector; 08-11-2012 at 05:57 AM.
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  #22  
Old 08-11-2012, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hankphenom View Post
I don't remember any inconsistencies in pronunciation, but that doesn't mean there weren't any. Cicotte, maybe? Or was it just that Ritter pronounced it "sa-COTT-tee" and others like Joe Wood called him "SY-cott."
My parents had friends with the name Cicotte and as I remember it, it was pronounced "Sa COTT Ta"
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Old 08-11-2012, 12:33 PM
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I was going to post a reply to something similar with Bill Hedin in the related to pre-war player thread. He basically said people in his family pronounce his last name three different ways. I'm going to a family reunion tonight, where half the people pronounce my last name a different way than I do, and we are all from the same section of the same small state!

Basically, there may not be just one way to properly pronounce a last name. Heck, I know first hand from my mom, who moved down to Florida over 20 years ago, she doesn't even pronounce her name the same. She picked up a southern accent somewhere along the line and can't shake the darn thing, even when she's in Jersey
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Old 08-11-2012, 04:11 PM
Hankphenom Hankphenom is offline
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Just heard back from a friend to whom I recently lent the raw tapes, and who has become more or less obsessed with listening to them. He said:

"Can recall from the tapes 4 pronunciations for Cicotte, 2 for Evers, 2 for Manush, 2 for Wagner's first name, 2 for Donie Bush's first name, 2 for Marquard ... DON'T GET ME STARTED!"

Ha! I did not remember any of this, but wasn't really paying attention to that aspect. Also, that was 15 years and many brain cells ago.
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Old 08-11-2012, 07:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hankphenom View Post
Just heard back from a friend to whom I recently lent the raw tapes, and who has become more or less obsessed with listening to them. He said:

"Can recall from the tapes 4 pronunciations for Cicotte, 2 for Evers, 2 for Manush, 2 for Wagner's first name, 2 for Donie Bush's first name, 2 for Marquard ... DON'T GET ME STARTED!"

Ha! I did not remember any of this, but wasn't really paying attention to that aspect. Also, that was 15 years and many brain cells ago.
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