PSA buyback policy

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

Anyone ever dealt with PSA on buying back a card? If a card is noticeably less than the grade given, what will PSA do about such? IF they will buy it back...what determines the amount paid? SMR? Please lets not turn this into another why SGC is so great thread...

[Archive]

Posted By: Tony Andrea

Dave -
I recently sent a card back into Psa that I beleived was trimmed in one of their holders I owned.
I had communication personally through email with Joe Orlando for a couple days while they had it in their possesion and we spoke of a possible refund if found wrongly graded. He stated the card would be put back through their grading process and he would even have multiple graders look it over again to assure all was fine with the card. Things were great up until the time I received the card back a few days later. It was returned in its same exact holder which it was in when I sent it to them.
I made note of certain Blemishes and scratches on the holder before sending it in to confirm.
This tells me they didnt even open the slab for review, they simply looked it over through the holder it was in. Needless to say I wasnt satisfied but let it go at that point. This was my one experience with Psa Ive had regarding a possible buy back option your asking about if it helps.
FYI, the card in question was an E90-1 caramel card that was 1/8th of an inch short top to bottom, and 1/16th of an inch side to side. I think that warranted opening it up and taking a proper look at it, which In my opinion they did not do. Good luck.

Tony

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

Tony that does sound unfortunate....a card that shouldn't receive a number grade may be different from this case though. It's a T206 in a PSA 5....looks more like a 2 at best...and If I had submitted it I would think a 1! I guess we will see what happens....thought about posting a pic here but I'm probably going to end up unloading the card and didn't want to get into advertising the particular card in question....I guess we will just see what PSA says.

[Archive]

Posted By: Mike

PSA will quote you their paragraph in their grading procedures about how "even though certain aspects of a card may be indicitive of a certain grade, other aspects of the card are SO STRONG that the graders felt it warranted the higher". And since all grading is subjective, blah blah blah. Their guarantee means absolutely nothing.

I sent them in a PSA 10 card from the 1980s that had 85/15 centering on the back... not even CLOSE to their standard of 70/30.

They said it was a 10 because the corners and front surface were so great (they weren't).

What I'd be interested in seeing is a third party crack-out and resubmit some of these. They would clearly get lower grades the second time - sometimes a lot lower. Then what would Joe say? Would they have to buy back the card then?

But yes, theoretically they will pay you the SMR value if it doesn't grade.

[Archive]

Posted By: Tony Andrea

Hi Dave -
I like yourself do not want this thread to turn into an Sgc -vs- Psa war. For the record, I own many Psa cards and am happy with all of them except for this one.
Your post simply asked what might be the process of a buy back type situation and this was my one experience I had with something similiar. Nothing more, nothing less. Take care:-)

Tony

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

Yes the only problem I had was buying the card without a scan...I did feel comfortable buying a PSA 5 T206 of a HOF'er because I've never had any real issues with thier grading in the past. And I wouldn't make a deal out of it at all if it was a card that looked more like a 4...or even a high end 3 in the 5 holder...but a 2 at best...and probably a 1 graded EX? Just wasn't sure if anybody encountered such before....I know PSA would probably say I should have looked at the card first...but isn't that why i'm paying for cards graded by them? for the peace of mind and comfort that i'm paying for what i'm getting?

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

I have heard the same things about the PSA buyback policy. There's around a thousand people a day on this board. I would like to hear from ANYONE that has had a card bought back by PSA. My guess is there won't be many stepping up to this challenge. Maybe a lower end card here or there but not too much. My understanding is that they really say one thing and do another (or don't do another, if you know what I mean?). I am sure their policy is filled with ways they can squirm out of anything. I am still waiting for my call back from Orlando too....

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

Leon if that is the case....am I supposed to be happy if they send me a couple free vouchers for a $400 card?

[Archive]

Posted By: JK

Sorry, but it is simply impossible to answer your question honestly without this turning into a bashing psa thread, so I wont answer. I will say that psa's grading is been very inconsistent in my experience. Some will say that about SGC as well. The main difference I see - psa is more apt to overgrade mid grade cards - Ive seen too many 4s through 6s (like yours) that had no business in the slabs that they were in. SGC on the other hand does the opposite - IMO, they are more apt to undergrade a card rather than overgrade.

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

I don't want to say what would make you happy....Personally, I won't let PSA grade my cards anyway....therefore I wouldn't want PSA vouchers. If you plan on using them in the future, and $400 is fair to you, then I say go for it....and good luck with the issue.

[Archive]

Posted By: David Vargha

I too was "jobbed" by Orlando, et al on two PSA 9's that had obvious globs of crap on their front surface. I was told (after a long time) that the grades were correct.

This is PSA's actual return policy:

1. PSA never makes grading mistakes.

2. Any incorrectly graded cards will result in the current owner being compensated for the difference between the value of the incorrectly graded card and its correct grade.

3. When such an occurence happens, Rule 1 will be applied.

DavidVargha@hotmail.com

[Archive]

Posted By: warshawlaw

is iffy because they rarely confess to mistakes. I cross-examined Orlando on the issue of PSA mistakes after he'd testified to what a hands-on guy he was and how he'd know if a big mistake was made. I asked him if PSA had encapsulated a fake Babe Ruth rookie then bought it back from Andy Baran. Orlando said he didn't remember.

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

So does anyone have an idea what route I should go with PSA on this?? I know it's not an expensive card...$400 going by recent sales of same grade. There is no way I'd ever just try to sell it as is in a 5 holder...would be crazy. Should I try a phone call to Joe? Email? Seems like that will just get a no response. Customer Service? Someone else specific within the company??

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave

Here is another PSA card in a 5 I picked up last night on ebay. I got it at a pretty good price...now wondering if it also is a lower grade card or just a bad picture (which I originally assumed). There is no way with the look at the top of the card it should be in a 5 holder?? Starting to worry now...LOL

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

Something tells me he might have heard of me before so didn't call back for that reason. It would be difficult for him to manipulate this board the way I have heard he does the CU boards. If you call him he might call you back. I have heard he does return calls.....and from others I have heard he doesn't. Kind of like my wife with selective hearing....he will return the ones he wants to and she hears what she wants to . best regards

[Archive]

Posted By: dan mckee

I have had 2 situations. Both have old threads on this board. The first, I bought a PSA graded T205 Shean CUBS with no picture. I paid for the rare CUBS variation as stated. The item came and the label said Cubs but it was the common variation entombed. The seller took a sh&t on me so I went to PSA. They took the card, changed the slab to correctly state the common variation, and told me there would be no charge for the reholder. Too funny, I lost about $100.

Second, on the back of their submission forms, they state that they will reimburse your legal fees if you beat them in court. Well, I won my case against them and called Joe Orlando about this. He screamed at me, stated that since I bashed him on this chat board, that we have nothing else to talk about, then he hung up on me. Very proffessional ah? And what does me bashing him on this chat board have to do with a written stated policy of PSA ????

If you want fair treatment and great customer service, go to PSA, tell Joe Orlando that Dan Mckee sent you, then duck!

[Archive]

Posted By: James Gallo

I have had a couple issues with PSA. I had a card refused from SGC as being short, but not trimmed per sa. I sent it to PSA they cased it a PSA 1. The card did look good to me and measured fine IMO.

I recently bought a modern card and it was a PSA 10, uposn getting it, it had 2 huge stains on it. This is a card from 2003 folks. I emailed the seller and he was awesome took the card back and even refunded my shipping.

I agree with much of what has been said above and find that PSA does overgrade mid grade cards.

On the same note I generally love PSA 1's because 99% of the time a PSA 1 is really a 2-4.

I also just got back a Jeter rookie from PSA, they said is was trimmed, but I got this card out of a factory sealed set and it obviously measures fine.....

In the same batch I sent a Brett Rookie, just to get it cased. I knew it would be a 5-6, it came back a 7. I have concerns that when I sell this card the buyer will not be happy. It has wear at ever corner and is not better then a 5 or 6.

I don't understand who is looking at these cards sometimes.
I guess it is just a role of the dice and sometimes you end up ahead.

I would take nice scans of the card and sell it in the curent holder.

Let the buyer decide the value and don't even bother dealing with PSA. It may be more of a hassle then it is worth.


James G

Looking for 1915 Cracker Jacks and 1909-11 American Caramel E90-1.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff

I've got a 1941 Goudey that is absoluely miscut (the name is on the top, not the bottom) and PSA slabbed it as a straight 7, no qualifiers.... there is no SMR on 1941 Goudeys, so how would they determine what the difference in the value?

Thanks!

[Archive]

Posted By: dan mckee

PSA wasn't knowledgable enough to know that the name should be on the bottom. Just tell them the difference in value is $10,000.00 maybe you will catch a fish.

[Archive]

Posted By: JK

That's just a bad picture dave - no telling what the card might look like until you get a scan or see it for yourself.

[Archive]

Posted By: JK

Jeff - you sure that wasnt the rare "name on top" variation?

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff

Just catalogued!!! 1941 Goudey "Name On Top" variation, PSA 7 NM!!! True 1/1!!!

Only $7500, free shipping!!!

[Archive]

Posted By: Denny

Okayyy, I'm gonna do it... Standing up for _ is like watching a one legged ass kickin' contest...just doesn't make a whole lot of sense! Anyways, I've been told, that useing a high heat-shrinking gun, you can easily get these slabs open and replace the cards with one of your choice cards. How many times have you look'd at a card in a _ holder and said, "Are you kiddin' me?" There's no way that card is a "?". Does anybody else have any thoughts on this idea?

Denny Walsh

[Archive]

Posted By: Brian

<<There's around a thousand people a day on this board. I would like to hear from ANYONE that has had a card bought back by PSA.>>

In or around 2002, I purchased a 1953 Red Man card on ebay graded PSA 8. It arrived, I reviewed it, and it was nearly perfect. I put it away. About 12 months later, I sold off my Red Man cards. This card went to a collector friend, who called me to ask about the 3 wrinkles on the back of the card. Obviously, they were not there when I obtained the card. But I didn't review the card's condition before shipping it out. I gave a refund.

Next, I contacted PSA. I dealt with a customer rep who is no longer there (I think his name was Charlie). I sent him the card, detailed scans, the ebay auction, and contact information on the seller. Within two weeks, I received a check for the amount I paid for the card. Apparently, the ebay seller was also the submitter. Many cards from his submissions were returned to PSA with wrinkles.

My suggestion would be to make contact with a human at PSA not named Joe and hope for the best. I think I got lucky, because Charlie was a good guy. I called him several times, and he delivered on PSA's guarantee.

At any rate, this is one example. I only post this because Leon asked, don't shoot me

Brian

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

Brian (Obaks) said:

"I dealt with a customer rep who is no longer there (I think his name was Charlie)."



SO that's the whole issue. PSA got rid of the ONE guy that would make good on their guarantee !! Who said we couldn't figure this out? They just need to go find and hire that guy again....


Denny- yes, many, many PSA holders have been compromised and had other cards put in them. This issue is not PSA's fault, imo, it's the scumbags doing the cracking and re-holdering. I bought one at the last National, from a good friend, that had been cracked and put back together. You can tell as the sides look kind of frosty. best regards

[Archive]

Posted By: shane

I got a card off of eBay that I thought looked weird. I called Joe and told him the situation. He asked me to send the card to him for his graders to look at the card. He emailed me back three weeks later to let me know "PSA did not like the card." He asked me what I wanted for the card since it did not book in SMR. I asked for a refund in the amount of which I paid for the card. He sent the check out the next day.
Everything went smoothly and I was pleased that PSA stood behind their guarantee.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay wolt

I had 1 experience w/ a buy back card.
It was a modern card of Michael Jordan
a baseball card it was graded a PSA-10
but there was a faint pencil mark on the
back which I only noticed in passing.
Showed it to Joe at a Ft Washington show
he asked what the value is, I said around
$75, he then offered me $100 in grading
vouchers which I excepted.

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

It's nice to know they do buy them back.....

[Archive]

Posted By: JK

Shane - have you ever posted here before?

[Archive]

Posted By: Dan Bretta

Shane has posted here lots of times.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bob C

Several years ago I purchased a PSA 8 Tango Eggs HOF'R from a reputable seller for a significant hunk of change. Upon receipt, the card had multiple problems; staining, creases and it did not measure properly.
I contacted PSA and Mike Baker personally handled the situation. I sent the card to PSA to his attention. He subsequently agreed the card was not accurately graded and full SMR was refunded. I have to say he negotiated 1/2 to be refunded in submission credits but I was OK with that.
Now then, Mike Baker did the right thing then. Can the same be said for PSA now?

[Archive]

Posted By: cmoking

I had an obviously trimmed pre-war card in a PSA 4 holder. I emailed Orlando, sent it to him....two or three weeks later I got the card back sans holder and a check for the amount I said I paid for it.

As far as I was concerned on that card, they did the right thing.

[Archive]

Posted By: chris

so, is it my understand that the best way to deal with this kind of situation is just to contact joe orlando personally? i would assume that he might be difficult to get a hold of...in any event, it seems as if you have a decent chance at getting a refund, but certainly not 100%.

[Archive]

Posted By: Andy Baran

PSA did buy back a Fake Ruth Rookie from me years ago that was in a PSA 1 holder. I bought the card on ebay, then the seller immediately disappeared. At first, I was told that the card couldn't be fake because it was in a PSA holder. When they realized that they had made a mistake, they offered to buy the card back at SMR, which was much lower than I paid. Ultimately, they gave me my purchase price because I had saved all of the documentation, and they really wanted to get that card out of circulation.

In Joe Orlando's defense, I did not deal with him regarding this issue. He may have been employed by PSA, but he was not in charge at the time. My dealings were with Steve Rocchi and Mike Baker, who are now with GAI.

I had no idea that my name was mentioned in a court trial against PSA. Now, I'm just glad that I wasn't asked to appear.

[Archive]

Posted By: Griffin's

I had a modern card that was obviously overgraded several years ago- Charlie (customer service rep at the time) offered me the 1K I paid for it or 1500. in grading vouchers. Quick and easy, and most importantly, fair.
About 3 years ago I bought 2 PSA 4 Cleveland Fatima's sight unseen from 2 different sellers (I know, I know....). Upon getting them 1 of them had the corner torn off. I took both to PSA's CS rep, Peter Ma, at a show. He agreed the one was overgraded, and taking both of them we noticed the cert numbers were sequential. 3 days later he called me to tell me that they had reviewed them and both were accurately graded (my point was either one was overgraded or the other was undergraded) and sent them back to me.
I think, like any big company, customer service is only as good as the person handling it. I know of at least one major dealer that is working with PSA on buybacks (by finding overgraded cards and winning them to turn over to PSA) and there might be more. It's not as simple a process as SGC's seems to be, but it does happen. Vargha's booger card notwithstanding.

[Archive]

Posted By: shane

Dan,
I am new to Net54 and I try to post when I have something to contribute which is about 1/343 threads.

[Archive]

Posted By: David Vargha

Vargha's booger card notwithstanding.

Booger cards.

DavidVargha@hotmail.com