Edelman

Yastrzemski Sports · #1 02-04-2019, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim65

The Super Bowl MVP was suspended 4 games for PED's. Steroids is tolerated way more by football fans than baseball fans. Not fair but its the way it is.

Ok. Thanks. I wasn’t aware. I get it now and I can comment.
Steroids in sports are a mixed issue - and the issue is that no one cares as long as the player can help your team. One of the most popular players in the league is Bartolo Colon. Everyone loves big sexy. No one cares that he has a ped suspension. They wonder how he can keep doing it at his age. Same with Nelson Cruz. No one cares as long as he hits 40 hr and forget quickly that he had some help. The Mets welcomed Robinson Cano. The issue comes down the road when the player can’t help the team any more or when their question about the HOF comes up. Then they are horrible cheaters and there is no place in the game for them. But while the player is productive the fans welcome them.

KMayUSA6060 · #2 02-04-2019, 12:01 PM

I hate Edelman because he went to Can't State.

Go Zips.

steve B · #3 02-04-2019, 12:50 PM

I think a lot of it has to do with how the player approaches things when they get caught, as well as the sport.

Mostly players where they have some nearly valid excuse but accept their suspension are treated a bit better than the ones who try to make up insane stuff to get out of it.

Lance Armstrong - I didn't dope, and I'll sue you back to the stone age if you say I did. ---- Proof after his career is over, still denied it. Lifetime ban.

Alberto Contador - I tested positive for what? It must have been in the beef the fans sent. (entirely plausible, as it was clenbuterol, and at a level 400x lower than the WADA wants people tested for. ) Some appeals and delays, finally a year suspension and a few race results from 2010 and 2011 annulled in 2012. Back racing in late 2012 as part of the suspension was retroactive somehow.

D. Bergin · #4 02-04-2019, 01:57 PM

Edelman is a nice, solid little player, but when I clicked on this thread I assumed it was going to be more about how so many Pats fans and others in the media seem all of a sudden be claiming that Edelman is a future HOF'er.

Almost as if it's a foregone conclusion.

Headscratching to say the least. I understand he's been on several teams that have won Super Bowls, and has performed well in the Playoffs, but when a guy like Isaac Bruce, with twice as many catches and 3 times as many yards, while playing in a less offensive friendly era, has problems getting in. I don't understand how Edelman has a chance, even if he has several more strong years left in him.

Maybe he's the Lynn Swann of our generation, and he gets in strictly because of his postseason exploits. I don't know.

At this point, he seems like a poor mans Wes Welker.......but with rings. Welker was pretty much done after his age 32 season, which Edelman is right now.

pokerplyr80 · #5 02-04-2019, 02:12 PM

Edelman isn't as flashy or physically talented as guys like Moss, Beckham, and many others. But he gets the job done when it counts the most. 3rd down, and in the playoffs. What he did in that last drive against the Saints, and yesterday winning super bowl mvp, will be remembered for a long time. I am not a Patriots fan but I think that will get him into the HOF eventually, just perhaps not in his first year or two of eligibility.

As for the issue of his ped suspension not hurting his image as much as players in other sports others in this thread mentioned one of the main reasons. He accepted his punishment graciously, apologized, and took responsibility right away.

packs · #6 02-04-2019, 03:26 PM

Edelman isn't any different from Brady. Neither player has respect for the rules or the people they play against, so much so that they'll compromise their integrity for a cheap victory; as though it means anything to win a game you cheated in.

obcbobd · #7 02-04-2019, 05:07 PM

I believe Edelman was a first time offender who was suspended for four games.

Wasn't Mejía was supended three times and banned for life.

I do agree that it's odd that people have been up in arms about PEDs in more so in baseball, but not so much in football. I would assume steroid use in football is much higher.

Peter_Spaeth · #8 02-04-2019, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Edelman isn't any different from Brady. Neither player has respect for the rules or the people they play against, so much so that they'll compromise their integrity for a cheap victory; as though it means anything to win a game you cheated in.

Deflategate lives!!!

buymycards · #9 02-05-2019, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Edelman is a nice, solid little player, but when I clicked on this thread I assumed it was going to be more about how so many Pats fans and others in the media seem all of a sudden be claiming that Edelman is a future HOF'er.

Almost as if it's a foregone conclusion.

Headscratching to say the least. I understand he's been on several teams that have won Super Bowls, and has performed well in the Playoffs, but when a guy like Isaac Bruce, with twice as many catches and 3 times as many yards, while playing in a less offensive friendly era, has problems getting in. I don't understand how Edelman has a chance, even if he has several more strong years left in him.

Maybe he's the Lynn Swann of our generation, and he gets in strictly because of his postseason exploits. I don't know.

At this point, he seems like a poor mans Wes Welker.......but with rings. Welker was pretty much done after his age 32 season, which Edelman is right now.

He needs to stay around a long time to get the numbers for the HOF. He has 499 receptions, which puts him in a tie for 148th all time. He has 5398 receiving yards, for 248th all time. 224th in yards per game. He is a solid player, and he benefits from having Brady and Belichek heavily involving him in the game plan. But HOF? I doubt it.

steve B · #10 02-05-2019, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buymycards

He needs to stay around a long time to get the numbers for the HOF. He has 499 receptions, which puts him in a tie for 148th all time. He has 5398 receiving yards, for 248th all time. 224th in yards per game. He is a solid player, and he benefits from having Brady and Belichek heavily involving him in the game plan. But HOF? I doubt it.

And that's part of the puzzle. What would he do on a team where he was the primary receiver instead of in a system where someone else will get more looks if the matchup is better. How open does he get if teams aren't double teaming Gronk?

Or, on another team does he take one too many passes over the middle into big hits because everyone knows where the ball is going and instead of having a good season after recovering from a knee injury, it's a couple knee injuries and a handful of concussions and he's out of the league after 5 years?

A lot of Patriots recievers don't put up amazing numbers, but might do well on other teams. Of course Moss was horrible in Oakland playing for a team that just wasn't good.

How to rate a solid player in a system that isn't geared towards making stars? I'm not sure that's answerable as far as the HOF goes.

Peter_Spaeth · #11 02-05-2019, 05:50 PM

Moss had head case seasons, but he was supremely talented, IMO other than Rice as good as anyone to ever play that position. Not just phenomenal athletic ability, but an uncanny ability to get effortlessly to the open space. Small possession receivers like Edelman and Welker before him are doubtless valuable, but I wouldn't put them in the category of game-breaking deep threats like Moss, Isaac Bruce who was mentioned previously, etc. As Steve mentioned, they also need the right team to thrive.

egri · #12 02-07-2019, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve B

A lot of Patriots recievers don't put up amazing numbers, but might do well on other teams. Of course Moss was horrible in Oakland playing for a team that just wasn't good.

Moss was a star in Minnesota before he went to Oakland. His time with the Raiders was an aberration, not his time with New England.

Jim65 · #13 02-04-2019, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yastrzemski Sports

Ok. Thanks. I wasn’t aware. I get it now and I can comment.
Steroids in sports are a mixed issue - and the issue is that no one cares as long as the player can help your team. One of the most popular players in the league is Bartolo Colon. Everyone loves big sexy. No one cares that he has a ped suspension. They wonder how he can keep doing it at his age. Same with Nelson Cruz. No one cares as long as he hits 40 hr and forget quickly that he had some help. The Mets welcomed Robinson Cano. The issue comes down the road when the player can’t help the team any more or when their question about the HOF comes up. Then they are horrible cheaters and there is no place in the game for them. But while the player is productive the fans welcome them.

There is definitely a double standard. Likable guys like David Ortiz and Andy Pettitte get passes for cheating but unlikeable guy like ARod, Clemens and Barry Bonds are treated like axe murderers.

I'm guilty too, I have an issue with Cano but I love the Mets so I will root for him.