Hottest Player To Collect...And Why?

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake

Cobb such a dirtbag...i like Judge if hes the baby bomber version of Jeter. RCs still reasonable. Mantle is always good. I think Ryan is underrated.

Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

Even as a "dirtbag", as you so eloquently put it... Cobb will ALWAYS be more desirable than Judge, Jeter, Ryan and ANY OTHERS you can name with the lone exception of Ruth.

[MattyC]

Originally Posted by Huysmans

Even as a "dirtbag", as you so eloquently put it... Cobb will ALWAYS be more desirable than Judge, Jeter, Ryan and ANY OTHERS you can name with the lone exception of Ruth.

More desirable to whom? This is all completely subjective; there will be people who like Jeter and not Ryan. People who like Gehrig and not Cobb. Judge collectors who don't have any interest in Mantle. And on and on.

[toolman tj]

Sorry for the error, I read the Cobb HOF info in a book years ago and it stuck with me. I should have fact checked that, so thanks for the correction.

[oldjudge]

Jeter who? DD is better than Jeter ever was.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by toolman tj

Sorry for the error, I read the Cobb HOF info in a book years ago and it stuck with me. I should have fact checked that, so thanks for the correction.

Not every book is accurate...especially (IMO) about Cobb - the more recent bios of him, with far more research, paint a very different picture than the previous ones.

Call it revisionist history if you want to, but those books may have helped spur the new interest in collecting his cards.

[packs]

Originally Posted by MattyC

More desirable to whom? This is all completely subjective; there will be people who like Jeter and not Ryan. People who like Gehrig and not Cobb. Judge collectors who don't have any interest in Mantle. And on and on.

There are literally millions of cards out there for Judge and Jeter collectors though. They'll never reach the same level. For ANY career-contemporary Cobb card it's going to cost you, which is what sures up the value of his more expensive options.

[MattyC]

Originally Posted by packs

There are literally millions of cards out there for Judge and Jeter collectors though. They'll never reach the same level. For ANY career-contemporary Cobb card it's going to cost you, which is what sures up the value of his more expensive options.

I do get that the PreWar players have fewer career contemporary cards— and thus taken in the aggregate, those cards will be worth more money that the average career contemporary card of a modern player. That said, it does not mean the best card of a modern player is not as worthwhile to the collector or potentially to the investor as well, provided the latter is content to shoulder the accompanying risk.

From a strictly monetary standpoint, which is admittedly not my purview, one who bought a PSA 10 Jeter SP early on did fantastically well. And the "entry cost" of obtaining that Jeter back then was probably not even high enough to buy a nice Cobb or Ruth card. The salient point being there are all sorts of good options in terms of players and cards for both the collector and the investor. Multiple avenues for satisfaction that are neither competitive nor mutually exclusive.

Interesting case in point, for the monetarily minded: in the last year, if I paid the usual AH retail dollar to obtain a great Cobb, Gehrig, Ruth, or Shoeless Joe, I would be lucky to be able to break even on the sale of those cards today. In contrast, if I was so inclined, I could make a much greater profit on some Harpers and Judges I purchased in that very same window of time.

Another factor to consider on such a topic is how thin the air is as one progresses from 5 digits to 6 digits, and even upward. Such cards can be much harder to sell than one would think, at first blush. So there are many variables to consider, from which cards, at which prices, to investment horizon. Buying "for keeps," as it were, for a collection, really does a great job of simplifying the situation— and a great job of eliminating the headache that usually accompanies anything money-related.

[Rhotchkiss]

1. Babe Ruth (no question; unfortunately most of his cards are ugly)
2. Cobb
3. Mantle
4. Wagner (the t206 alone keeps him in popular culture)
5. Lou Gehrig
6. Cy Young (his name is mentioned each year in the award of the best pitcher)
7. Joe Jackson (so long as field of dreams and other black Sox scandal-lore is popular)
8. Walter Johnson (unbeatable record)
9. Joe DiMaggio (unbeatable record and sung about by Simon and Garfunkel)
10. Eddie Plank - bc I just picked up his t206 card and wanted him on this list (I don’t really think he belongs)

IMO, Mantle is the only postwar card (not player-card) on this list. Other players may be more iconic - certainly Jackie Robinson, Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Pete Rose, Cal Ripken- but their cards are so plentiful that I just don’t think their cards make the list.

Then of course their are iconic cards of great players 1933 Goudey Lajoie, 48 Leaf Paige, T206 Magie (error), 1914 CJ Matty, 1888 Anson, etc... but that was not the topic.

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

1. Babe Ruth (no question; unfortunately most of his cards are ugly)
2. Cobb
3. Mantle
4. Wagner (the t206 alone keeps him in popular culture)
5. Lou Gehrig
6. Cy Young (his name is mentioned each year in the award of the best pitcher)
7. Joe Jackson (so long as field of dreams and other black Sox scandal-lore is popular)
8. Walter Johnson (unbeatable record)
9. Joe DiMaggio (unbeatable record and sung about by Simon and Garfunkel)
10. Eddie Plank - bc I just picked up his t206 card and wanted him on this list (I don’t really think he belongs)

IMO, Mantle is the only postwar card (not player-card) on this list. Other players may be more iconic - certainly Jackie Robinson, Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Pete Rose, Cal Ripken- but their cards are so plentiful that I just don’t think their cards make the list.

Then of course their are iconic cards of great players 1933 Goudey Lajoie, 48 Leaf Paige, T206 Magie (error), 1914 CJ Matty, 1888 Anson, etc... but that was not the topic.

Jackie Robinson surely lands somewhere in the top 10 most collectable players of all time and probably top 5 on my list

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by Gobucsmagic74

Jackie Robinson surely lands somewhere in the top 10 most collectable players of all time and probably top 5 on my list

I think Jackie is top 3-5 all time iconic baseball player (hell athlete), no doubt, and I basically state as much in my initial post. I just think that there are so many of his cards out there that when it comes to player-cards to collect for investment (and I think this thread intended investment) I think the much less populous, prewar studs are the ones to collect. But, admittedly I am totally biased bc I love the old old and rare stuff.

Regarding old vs new- nobody wins that fight. Everyone has their opinions. The good news is we are all on the same team bc whether it’s a t206 Wagner, a 1952 Topps mantle PSA 9, or a 2017 Judge, they are all cards and their success keeps the hobby and investment relevant and thriving. Go cards (regardless of era)!

[orly57]

"Interesting case in point, for the monetarily minded: in the last year, if I paid the usual AH retail dollar to obtain a great Cobb, Gehrig, Ruth, or Shoeless Joe, I would be lucky to be able to break even on the sale of those cards today. In contrast, if I was so inclined, I could make a much greater profit on some Harpers and Judges I purchased in that very same window of time."


Are you referring to a green Cobb or his rare postcards? Probably not. How about a 25 Exhibits Gehrig? Doubt it. A 14 cj joe Jackson? Naaaaa. Sounds to me like a straw man card you choose to compare to two particularly hot modern players. How many "hot" cards a year ago are worth far less today? New cards are like penny stocks: you can make a good profit if you sell at the perfect time. But like high risk stocks, if you hold on for too long, you can get burned. Even if the cards of the greats do stabilize a bit, they are safer than Cody Bellinger. I'm not sure that your hypothetical Cobb, jjax, and Gehrig cards would be hard to sell at a profit.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Sure in hindsight those three cards look great. But it's usually hindsight, how many people here were smart enough to stock up a year or two ago?

Has a red Cobb appreciated much? An E95? An M116? If you paid AH high retail could you really sell those at a profit for the most part?

[orly57]

Agreed Peter. I chose 3 cards that have gone up in value in order to illustrate the same flawed argument that Matty made by choosing two modern cards that have gone up in value. Both modern and vintage will have cards that stay the same or go up substantially in a year. You can't cherry-pick a couple of good examples from one side in order to strengthen your argument. Modern cards fluctuate far more. Sure, the e95 hasn't budged, but it hasn't tanked the way a bust prospect card would.

[Hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by packs

There are literally millions of cards out there for Judge and Jeter collectors though. They'll never reach the same level. For ANY career-contemporary Cobb card it's going to cost you, which is what sures up the value of his more expensive options.

They dont have to reach the same level. If you bought 100 93 SP Jeters 10 yrs ago you will have done well for yourself. You dont need to flip Cobbs to do well. Thats where I'm coming from ....thats what i thought this thread was about. *shrug* So, maybe buy some undervalued Ryan RC or some 2013 Judges and see what happens.



Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake

They dont have to reach the same level. If you bought 100 93 SP Jeters 10 yrs ago you will have done well for yourself. You dont need to flip Cobbs to do well. Thats where I'm coming from ....thats what i thought this thread was about. *shrug* So, maybe buy some undervalued Ryan RC or some 2013 Judges and see what happens.



Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

I am curious as to the time frame and price you think they were 10 years ago and what they are now. I know at some point more than 10 years ago when I was doing shows they were over 100.00 each and looking at EBay today, I see plenty of them selling for less. So, if there was profit to be made on Jeter, it is just fluctuation in price. On the other hand A-Rod SP rcs were also over 100, how did you do on those investments? I sold all my Mcgwire rcs for 100-200 back in 1998. Do you think those buyers are happy with their investments?

Modern cards are a game of hot potato. You have to get in at the right time and out at the right time. Even Hofers can see a loss if you aren't careful. Non-Hofers are pretty much guaranteed to lose you money long term. Of course there are a few exceptions such as Michael Jordan or Tom Brady whose cards just keep going up. I thought this thread was about who to buy and not lose money on. If that's the case, then Ruth, Cobb, Wagner and Gehrig are the best bets.

[Peter_Spaeth]

If you happen to catch them VERY early a modern player's cards can of course go way up. But once they have a strong year or two, or are considered an elite prospect, the market seems to price them as though they already have had a HOF career and it seems (to me anyhow) there really isn't that much room to grow. Perhaps a bad example because of overproduction, but look how cheap Pujols rookies are for the most part -- and he is about to get his 3000th hit to go with 600 HR, very few careers are going to match that.

[bigfanNY]

I started going to baseball card shows in 1973 I was 12 and most of the people in the room looked like adults to me. I met some other kids Rob lifson stands out. And it seemed like a long time until that changed but in the mid 1980's kids made up at least half of the crowd.
Now there were collectors of every type I knew guys who would not buy a card newer than 1920. I knew a lot of collectors who collected Goudey's and play ball's as kids who loved 1930's cards. I grew to love them too. It was very personal stories of games guys went to Gehrig Joe D Dean Hubbell ( William's but I don't many red sox fans) Teams they saw 35 tigers gas house gang 36 thru 39 Yankees. Then Mantle and May's
Card collecting is a personal thing. Those guys who collected in the 30's are very old now or passed on. And those sets do not get the attention they once did. I see that happening one day to the 50's and so on. Baseball has trouble drawing kids. Not my kids they go to games. But they don't collect. I collect more memorabilia now than cards. Things change over time but iconic cards are just that not just name but image. Wagner Ruth 33 Cobb t206 52 Mantle rookie is best example Jackie 47 Griffey rookie. They will always endure. I hope..

[BobC]

As of right this moment, i would have to say Ohtani cards. There's a new Bowman product just being released right this week i think that has a 1 of 1 superfractor (or some similar designation) rookie card of Ohtani's in it that already has a standing offer of $60,000 for it, even before it is pulled from a pack. As long as it grades at least a 9.5 and Blowout Cards gets it by May 11th, as I understand the conditions. And as the old saying goes, "all boats rise with the tide", so all Ohtani's other rookie cards are going ballistic right now.

As pointed out by other posters though, with these modern cards your best bet is to get them directly from packs, if possible, and then quickly dump them for a big profit. This is exactly why the Breakers are in control of the new card distribution market out there and why Topps and Panini are gearing their products to create these manufactured rarities that drive modern collectors insane with prices and values. It is essentially nothing more than a legalized form of gambling in my opinion.

[Hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by rats60

I am curious as to the time frame and price you think they were 10 years ago and what they are now. I know at some point more than 10 years ago when I was doing shows they were over 100.00 each and looking at EBay today, I see plenty of them selling for less. So, if there was profit to be made on Jeter, it is just fluctuation in price. On the other hand A-Rod SP rcs were also over 100, how did you do on those investments? I sold all my Mcgwire rcs for 100-200 back in 1998. Do you think those buyers are happy with their investments?

Modern cards are a game of hot potato. You have to get in at the right time and out at the right time. Even Hofers can see a loss if you aren't careful. Non-Hofers are pretty much guaranteed to lose you money long term. Of course there are a few exceptions such as Michael Jordan or Tom Brady whose cards just keep going up. I thought this thread was about who to buy and not lose money on. If that's the case, then Ruth, Cobb, Wagner and Gehrig are the best bets.

Jeters on ebay less than $100?? Do send me a link

And you can overpay on any card and lose $$$

What about guys out there that are undervalued? With some luck you can do ok.. buy em cheap, raw, slab em, etc.....thats why I say Ryan in a previous post...Lemieux, Messier (in NY especially) and even Gretzky in the hockey world...

Value!

Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake

Jeters on ebay less than $100?? Do send me a link

And you can overpay on any card and lose $$$

What about guys out there that are undervalued? With some luck you can do ok.. buy em cheap, raw, slab em, etc.....thats why I say Ryan in a previous post...Lemieux, Messier (in NY especially) and even Gretzky in the hockey world...

Value!

Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

Just go to EBay, type in 1993 SP Derek Jeter, then sort by completed auctions and lowest price. There are plenty that have sold for less than 100.

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by MattyC

More desirable to whom? This is all completely subjective; there will be people who like Jeter and not Ryan. People who like Gehrig and not Cobb. Judge collectors who don't have any interest in Mantle. And on and on.

The OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of collectors. There is very little subjectivity for this board on this topic. Have you read the other posts? Have you followed the hobby for any amount of time? Ruth and Cobb reign supreme atop all others when it comes to collecting... and whether or not you agree with it... is inconsequential.

[Snapolit1]

No one is arguing what is subjectively nicer, cooler, better, more important to collect. Those are not factual arguments. That's personal taste. If you want to collect every Mackey Sasser card every printed, go for it. Sounds like fun to me. If you want to open up a museum to Kevin Maas or Bake McBride, go for it. Sounds cool. But if someone is going to argue that modern era cars are a good investment I beg to differ. Yes, there is the occasional amazing obscure piece that someone is going to pay boku bucks for. But what is driving sales of cards today is a lottery aspect of burying supposed relics in boxes and people rushing to find them and make money.

People line up at 6 am in the morning outside the sneaker store in my neighborhood a few times a month. Like 200 people deep. It's because there is some new Jordan shoe or something being released. People line up and buy a dozen pairs and sell them to grateful people in Japan for 10 times the sticker price. Cool. Nice business model. God bless. It doesn't mean they are Michael Jordan or foot ware fans. I have seen people in card store literally cracking open cases of the Topps Heritage card and throwing them into garbage cans as quickly as they can looking for the supposed rareties.

[trdcrdkid]

My 13 year old nephew collects baseball cards, primarily recent cards with an emphasis on the Cubs. I gave him Javy Baez and Willson Contreras rookie cards for Christmas, along with a Donruss blaster box, and he was very happy. A few years ago I gave him a bunch of my doubles from the late 70s and early 80s, and he went through them picking out the Hall of Famers, which he put in his album. So this is a kid who collects current cards but is also interested in older cards.

I would assume that most of the people buying high-end recent cards at shows (autographs, relics, refractors of Trout, Bryant, Ohtani, etc.) are adults, simply because they're the ones with the money for that stuff. Same goes for the people paying $100-$150 for hobby boxes. But I'm sure there are plenty of other kids like my nephew, buying individual packs with what money they have and picking up a nicer card if the opportunity presents itself.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by trdcrdkid

My 13 year old nephew collects baseball cards, primarily recent cards with an emphasis on the Cubs. I gave him Javy Baez and Willson Contreras rookie cards for Christmas, along with a Donruss blaster box, and he was very happy. A few years ago I gave him a bunch of my doubles from the late 70s and early 80s, and he went through them picking out the Hall of Famers, which he put in his album. So this is a kid who collects current cards but is also interested in older cards.

I would assume that most of the people buying high-end recent cards at shows (autographs, relics, refractors of Trout, Bryant, Ohtani, etc.) are adults, simply because they're the ones with the money for that stuff. Same goes for the people paying $100-$150 for hobby boxes. But I'm sure there are plenty of other kids like my nephew, buying individual packs with what money they have and picking up a nicer card if the opportunity presents itself.

Or getting their parents to pay for the boxes.

[53Browns]

Yeah upper deck ruined it by starting the trend to price kids out of the hobby!