91 Topps Variations

[PolarBear]

I always thought the Desert Shield set was one of the best modern sets out there.

[ALR-bishop]

Given all the counterfeits/ fakes it is now tougher to build a good set from scratch. Wonder how many versions of it there are if the counterfeits are included

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Given all the counterfeits/ fakes it is now tougher to build a good set from scratch. Wonder how many versions of it there are if the counterfeits are included

Even on real DS cards I have seen 3 different foils used to make the stamp. I have also noticed the stamp does vary slightly from card to card on real DS cards. The thing I notice the most between real and fake stamps are the detail, especially in the stars on the flag.

[mouschi]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Even on real DS cards I have seen 3 different foils used to make the stamp. I have also noticed the stamp does vary slightly from card to card on real DS cards. The thing I notice the most between real and fake stamps are the detail, especially in the stars on the flag.

I'm curious to know more about this to see if I can track down the Canseco variations if they exist. Would you let me know what the differences are?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by mouschi

I'm curious to know more about this to see if I can track down the Canseco variations if they exist. Would you let me know what the differences are?

The foil stamp itself will be the same on the same players cards. The stamp changes slightly from player to player like the slight differences in the 89 Fleer Bill Ripken cards from the full 132 count Bill Ripken sheet.

The foil I have seen has 2 different shiny versions and one that has a duller finish.

[ALR-bishop]

Jackson--I agree with you in general about the 1991 set having more variants than any other Topps set. And to your point there are few master 1991 sets I would say there may be none. But that could depend on one's definition of a master set. As far as I know there is no accepted hobby definition of a master set. What is yours ? Would your definition be different for pre and post 1980 sets ? What would be your definition of a master set for any Topps Heritage set ? What would be your definition of a master 1991 Topps set ? Do you have a generic definition that would apply to all sets ?

I do have my own criteria which I apply to all my sets but it breaks down somewhat on the more modern sets. I have a Topps run from 1948 to 2015. I consider my set master if I have all variations listed in SCD, Becketts and The Registry. Additions can happen. iI do collect non listed/recognized variants in my sets, but view them as extras.

The gray area for me comes when a variant gains wide hobby recognition but is not listed in one of those sources, such as the 52 House yellow Tiger. I collect those but do not count them as part of a master. Another gray area, applicable to the 1991 set as well, are stock color and back differences. In or out. Someone might say you need the red and black cards from the
1st series of the 1952 set, but do you need the 52 and 54 gray backs, or the 56, 59 and 60 gray and white backs, or the 53 white and black bios ?

Not attempting to be argumentative. Everyone can have their own view . If a master set includes all variant cards, or cards that differ in any way from their counterparts, including unintended recurring or non recurring print defects, then I think there are exactly no master sets out there anywhere

[jacksoncoupage]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Jackson--I agree with you in general about the 1991 set having more variants than any other Topps set. And to your point there are few master 1991 sets I would say there may be none. But that could depend on one's definition of a master set. As far as I know there is no accepted hobby definition of a master set. What is yours ?

Oh, I agree entirely that even if a consensus was reached on criteria, when it comes to the 1991 issue, there will continue to be additions. That said, I should specify that a 1991 Topps set with the well-known errors (Comstock, Chamberlain, stats), all the advanced errors (Ventura, Tettleton, Coolaugh, et al) and all the key rarities (Whiten, Hoiles, Drabek, Boyd, Morgan, Bush and A*B* codes) plus the Bold 40th parallel and the Sweepstakes set (or as close as one can get) is the approximate of a master set in my example. The bigger point was that there would fewer of those "advanced" 1991 Topps sets than Desert Shield sets.

I have long argued that collecting all the variations for your junk era sets is the only thing that will set them apart in value from the sets without, even 20-40 years from now while they still hold their $5-20 value.

[jacksoncoupage]

Originally Posted by PolarBear

I always thought the Desert Shield set was one of the best modern sets out there.

I like this parallel as well, however, I think it's worth mentioning that there are far fewer "master" 1991 Topps sets out there and that's likely not going to change any time soon.

For reasons unknown, Topps made changes to the cards throughout production and went all out in correcting many of the most insignificant mistakes. This set has some of the toughest and seemingly shortest print-run variations of any Topps issue.