Beginnings, Personal Drummers and Adult Card Hobby Preferences...

[jchcollins]

For a while now, I’ve been trying to put a thread I guess on what I’m trying to imply by the subject of this post. I realize that there are likely psychology books out there on the subject of all manners of “collectors” and why we do what we do, (and I might be scared to open a can of worms by ever reading them…)

But it got me to thinking about the journey, why we continue - and along the way - exactly WHY is it that most of us find such perpetual joy in hoarding away old pieces of cardboard with pictures of men in uniforms on them?

Do you / did you enjoy or possibly treasure cards like this 35 years ago?




If you did but maybe don't so much now - why?

That may be a bit rhetorical; I assume all of us who have made it to N54 and stayed here as grown people at some point discovered actual vintage cards, found them to be extremely captivating, and launched upon a journey to want more and more of them, and increasingly nicer ones and more expensive ones. I was fascinated by some of the TCMA history cards, and any image of Babe Ruth or Ty Cobb or characters like that on cardboard when I was 10 years old, but quickly came to learn that these were not "real" cards issued when they were playing, and in some cases hadn't even been issued when they were alive. Case in point for me and what "does it" for me these days? - yeah you guessed it, stuff like this:






I guess what I'm kind of curious about is your thoughts as concerns the possibility of paradigm shifts. Do you like or value at all "Non-Playing Days" cards? For me for the longest time I couldn't understand why anyone would want a card like this:



The example here is Yogi, but there are lots of others with the same point to be made in the '67 Venezuelan set, including a very recently retired Sandy Koufax. One and most obvious to me as a kid - Yogi Berra was retired by 1967. He was what, a Mets coach by then? Having caught his last few games for them in 1965. Two, this is a terrible black and white picture. Three, even as if I didn't know, you are splashing out the fact that he is RETIRED (or "Retirado") in bold red letters under his picture. What in the world? Why would I want that? You might as well write in spanish "OLD AND NOT COOL" on the bottom. (A footnote here that of course now at age 46, I understand that these cards are both super condition sensitive and rare, and their value from a dollar perspective makes more sense to me. I just think it's interesting that judging from any criteria I would have carried as a kid as to both what made a vintage card cool and valuable - I would have shunned these all day long).

The triggers to seize upon here are more related to hobby history (the scarce '67 Topps Vennies...) and not so much the player and when he was active. Right? To note also the same point, though the cards are not as valuable - the 1940 Playballs that feature retired players like Wagner and Shoeless Joe, etc.

If you collect cards like these - question for you: Do you get more enjoyment out of the fact of the card being rare or the set? Or the player it pictures? Or both? Or design or something else? Curious really just as to thought process here and what makes something "treasured" in your mind for your collection?

For starters - when we were kids, at least those of us who grew of age with cards BEFORE social media, or YouTube videos, or maybe even before a monthly subscription to Dr. Beckett’s magazine - how did you start with cards? What initially gave you joy / satisfaction about those cards? Was it the cards for the cards themselves and the glee of owning them? Was it the tie to the game of baseball (or basketball or football or hockey or whatever) itself and the players or teams because you were familiar with them? I’ll give you a stumper, I started as a card collector at age 9 not with sports cards - but with these things. I'm not sure what attracted to me to them other than they made me laugh and were visually cool, other than the fact that everyone at school was collecting them:



Here are some other things I briefly jotted down that I thought might be interesting to explore. If you've lost my plot here, it's kind of "how do I get enjoyment out of different things perhaps" (cheaper would be nice, but not necessarily the only requirement) by broadening my horizons? These points might not answer that question directly, but could lead to discussion that would:


* Topps wax at the 7-11 vs. the “Hygrade Collectors Kit” (there were also others) at the mall bookstore. What types of cards were you exposed to first?

* Impressive, high-dollar vintage vs. screw that, here’s what does it for me personally. What voices are in your head - do they conflict?

* Fantasy cards, cards that never were, Topps Archives and Heritage concepts. Junk or really cool?

* Baseball nostalgia, then nostalgia for "the hobby" itself. (Which yes, the organized hobby itself is old now...) When you look at your collection where does your head go?


Thanks & Happy Friday!

[Harliduck]

That's a lot to unpack there John...but good stuff...

I can speak to the first section...the "newer" cards of the all time greats. When I was a kid collecting in the early 80's I knew all those names, but had NO access to any of there cards. There was a kid at school who had a beat up 76 Hank Aaron and he was a GOD. Haha. That said, those cards you posted, I remember them all, and stuff by Pacific cards and such...were super cool just so I could have a Babe Ruth or an Aaron card...and possibly see their unworldly stats in all their full glory. Those cards were coveted by me and my age group...but as we get older...and of course with the advent of Ebay and other buying options...the world got smaller and cards that were unobtainable and only witnessed in books were now available, and being an adult, affordable...

I look at my collection now and I think my 12 year old self would have dropped dead in disbelief at what I have...and as you said, those "newer" cards now don't serve the purpose they once did. I have zero interest, and funny enough, they hold no nostalgic place with me...weird now that I think about it.

Anyway...good post!

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Harliduck

That's a lot to unpack there John...

Yes, sorry. Unusually lengthy for me, and contains a lot of "thinking out loud", but part of that was on purpose so that it can be unpacked.

I'm much like you. I ate those cards up as a kid, but after I moved on to real vintage - rarely looked back. It just struck me as funny because I know for some collectors (a minority maybe, but still I've met them) those cards are even more special because it's a more direct memory to their childhood and that means more to them. Wondering if I'm missing out on something perhaps by being stuck so rigidly in my current paradigm.

[ALBB]

I never enjoyed the loads of " all time great sets" when they came out, never cared for the SSPC stuff of the late 70s either .

Alway looked as that stuff as " not real ", and my hobby money always went elsewhere

[laughlinfan]

I'm guessing somebody could do a whole psychology course (or more) on us collectors. Having been collecting for over 50 years, it is certainly a combination of many things for me. Have many items from when I was a kid that still make me smile with great memories of family members who helped me find stuff for sure. Growing up there was always the challenge and thrill of putting together a complete set of whatever I was chasing, but I was certainly less focused on completing sets as I got older. Nice items for players or teams I really liked will always catch my interest, certainly because of the happy memories they evoke. And to be honest, almost everything I collect or buy now my mind will say "That's cool!" - and having it be something that other people are looking for or would like is part of the equation for sure. I stopped collecting mainstream cards over 30 years ago when the glut came, and manufactured scarcities like 1 of x short printed cards do nothing for me. Finding unusual, scarce, or better yet one of a kind items like production art still gets my heart pumping! Funny thing is no one in my family collects, I never have friends over to look at stuff, but it still makes me happy to sit on a mountain of stuff from the past 55 years, and when I look at different items I have, my mind still says "That's cool!"

[Volod]

Very interesting and thought provoking thread. On the specific subject of "All Time Great"-type issues, my only encounter with such cards happened to be maybe the most poignant of all of my collecting memories. When I was nine years old, my father made time to take a road trip to Cooperstown, about fifty miles from our home. He took my brother and me along, perhaps only grudgingly when my mother requested it. After walking through the HOF, I can recall noticing a display of souvenir items for sale, one of which was the Callahan HOF set in a small box. Since my brother and I had been collecting Bowman cards for a year or more, I pointed the Callahans out to him and we both probably expressed great interest. This apparently caused my father to spring for the cost, likely just a few bucks at that time, but it is one of the fondest memories I have of stuff that my old man ever handed to me. Of course, like so much other childhood memorabilia that evaporated in the next few years, that rather obscure set of cards was lost and forgotten until about fifty years later when I stumbled upon it at a card show in Strongsville. Looking at the set later brought back a flood of memories, of my father, brother and my own early fascination with baseball and little pieces of pasteboard.

[deweyinthehall]

The first "cards" I ever had were those stickers and other inserts you could find in Wonder Bread packages in the early-to-mid-70s. Usually they had a Disney or Super Hero tie in, and they featured some funny license plate or college pennant parodies or some such. I only ever had a few, none saved, but as I got older and had more disposable income I did go back and acquire complete sets of perhaps 6 or 7 of these series (culminating in the Star Wars set from 1977).

The first pack of cards I ever opened was Topps Happy Days - again, never saved past the first month I had them but I went back and purchased complete sets of both series a few years ago.

With both the Wonder Bread and Happy Days sets, when I look through them today I can still recognize a handful of specific ones I know I had back in the day originally, and that gives me a really nice sense of nostaglia.

It wasn't until the spring of 1978 that I personally discovered baseball cards.
Remember the old Scholastic magazine, Dynamite? Each spring for a few years there, they'd include a small uncut panel of 6 of the new Topps cards. In the spring 1978 issue I received Tony Perez, Darrell Porter, Al Oliver and Cecil Cooper (two from a double print row, I know now, so only 4 different for me).

From that moment, and I can't explain why, I was hooked. I can still remember learning that you could get packs containing more of these at the store! How incredible was that?!? I can clearly recall that my first wax pack contained, among forgotten others, Jose Baez, Luis Tiant, Sparky Lyle RB, Rick Manning and George Hendrick.

I remember well seeing a couple 'old' 1977s one of my friends had - even though they opened the pack less than 12 months before, it still felt to my 10 year old brain that I was looking at some ancient relic. Then, when the spring of 1979 came around and I saw the first selection of 1979 cellos in a bin at McCrory's, I remember thinking "they come out with a new set EVERY year?!?"

I think most people learn about the game first and are then drawn to the cards - I had the cards and that is what drew me to the game. It was the cards that taught me new guys came along each year and that some players actually changed teams every so often.

From the outset, I always pursued the new Topps set each year, and I tried to get older cards from previous years - some of friends had small stacks of dog-eared '76s, '75s and 74s they gifted me. Then I discovered card shops, shows, and it was off to the races.

For me, I know that I am by nature a 'collector' - if I have one of something that is part of a series, I have a hard time not trying to acquire more. If I never discovered cards, I'd have a house full of vintage Star Wars, Legos, TV Guides or something else.

[Phishphan21]

I quit reading OP at “case in point “


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[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Phishphan21

I quit reading OP at “case in point “


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Appreciate your valuable contribution.


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[ALR-bishop]

I started collecting as a kid in 1957. The first set I completed was 1959 Topps which is a sentimental favorite. Ultimately collected Topps, Bowman and Fleer baseball. But from younger days had some 61 Fleer football and basketball, so completed those and they are my only mainstream non baseball sets. The 61 Fleer set is neat because all the pics are without helmets with clear facial views and checklisted in order by team. I like the 61 Fleer set because my uncle had season tickets to the Hawks games and he often took me. I actually got to see all the players in the set play

I also have a 13 card Essex Meats St Louis Hawks set ( Hawks were in St Louis until mid 60s) and an 8 Mayrose Meats St. Louis Cardinals football set ( they are now in Phoenix). On a good day I almost think I can still smell the bacon

There is a 14th card possible to the Hawks Essex Meats set, Sihugo Green, but I have never seen one.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

I also have a 13 card Essex Meats St Louis Hawks set ( Hawks were in St Louis until mid 60s) and an 8 Mayrose Meats St. Louis Cardinals football set ( they are now in Phoenix). On a good day I almost think I can still smell the bacon

As a kid in the late 1980's, true food issues weren't really a thing anymore. Maybe the Quaker or Nestle cards - I remember having some of those, but they were always airbrushed to remove the logos. Bleeeech.

[71buc]

Adam I love that Bruce Lee Return of the Dragon card. I’ve been collecting baseball since 1971 and that Bruce brought back more nostalgia than anything posted here. There are a lot of trees here in the PNW. The 10 year old version of me side kicked quite a few “O'Hara” Pines back in the day.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

Appreciate your valuable contribution.


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Now that is funny.