NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you give an opinion of a person or company your full name needs to be in your post. Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on Ebay
Pre-WWII Cards
Post WWII Cards
Vintage Memorabilia
Babe Ruth Cards
Ty Cobb Cards
Lou Gehrig Cards
Mickey Mantle Cards
Goudey Cards
Bowman Cards
T205s on Ebay
Tobacco "T" Cards
Caramel "E" Cards
Vintage Baseball Postcards
Football Cards on Ebay
Exhibit Cards
Strip Cards
Baking Cards
Sporting News
Playball Cards on Ebay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #51  
Old 07-17-2019, 08:50 AM
vintagetoppsguy's Avatar
vintagetoppsguy vintagetoppsguy is online now
D@v!d J@m3s
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Richmond, TX
Posts: 5,240
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
Let me slip in a positive word for my LCS, Burbank Sportscards. They don't deserve to be lumped in with the PWCCs and Probsteins of the world: Rob and crew are as nice and honest as you could hope for. Their pricing can be high but they cater to people who want the card quickly and are willing to pay for the infrastructure to deliver it.
I agree with Darren on this. I can't speak for him but, for me, it's not a matter of their honesty, it's the fact that they use (or at least used to) stock photos for many of their cards. Stock photos SUCK!
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 07-17-2019, 08:51 AM
packs packs is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 5,485
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snapolit1 View Post
Because for many collectors there is a rush having something that the best available, 1 of 1 or 1 or 2. Makes it seem extra amazing. Not limited to cards at all. Talk to a comic book collector or someone who collects beany babies, humells, or anything else.

People like to make comparisons across other hobbies but there isn't a comparison. Baseball card collecting is an area where low grade is not considered worthless or undesirable. How many times has the board echoed the mantra "buy the card not the holder"?
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:01 AM
Yankees1964 Yankees1964 is offline
John D.
member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Northeastern PA
Posts: 45
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbsports View Post
Listen guys, I understand how you all feel and you have every right to be down about this hobby. This is still a great hobby and just because there are a few real bad apples that have committed fraud, should we punish all the honest dealers in this hobby? Absolutely not! I have doing cards for 55 years, 40 of them as a dealer, and I am always careful of what I purchase whether it is privately or on line because I resell to the general public. If I get hurt, the customer gets hurt. People still go to baseball games, even though some players try to get an "edge" by taking drugs. Well, you don't ban collecting cards and going to card shows because some of these cheaters that are hurting the hobby. Hopefully the ones that have been cheating for years, most will get caught & this pass by. However it will take time. Don't give up on this great hobby yet.
Bill, this will make me support guys like you Don and others even more. I can't give up on this hobby, I am too old and need something to keep my mind off of reality . I am just going to concentrate all my buying from guys I know at Philly and White Plains and auction houses I trust (LOTG, Sterling).
__________________
Successful Net 54 purchases from: Don's Cards, Eggoman, Vintagetoppsguy, Johnny630, HOFAUTOS, cparker94, ramram, EYECOLLECTVINTAGE, trambo, PiratesWS1979 and many more.
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:02 AM
Donscards Donscards is offline
Don Hontz
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Portland, Maine
Posts: 1,304
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbsports View Post
Listen guys, I understand how you all feel and you have every right to be down about this hobby. This is still a great hobby and just because there are a few real bad apples that have committed fraud, should we punish all the honest dealers in this hobby? Absolutely not! I have doing cards for 55 years, 40 of them as a dealer, and I am always careful of what I purchase whether it is privately or on line because I resell to the general public. If I get hurt, the customer gets hurt. People still go to baseball games, even though some players try to get an "edge" by taking drugs. Well, you don't ban collecting cards and going to card shows because some of these cheaters that are hurting the hobby. Hopefully the ones that have been cheating for years, most will get caught & this pass by. However it will take time. Don't give up on this great hobby yet.
Well said---I agree with you on the hobby and business. With all the graded cards in this hobby, it is a very small percentage of altered cards out there. Yes, it is bad what these guys have done and there are a lot more people doing this than we have mentioned. But I also have been selling cards for a long time and look forward to a Great National. I still am buying cards strong and if anybody wants to sell me cards, just let me know.
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:06 AM
sportscardpete's Avatar
sportscardpete sportscardpete is offline
Pete
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 744
Default

Every hobby has their issues. Just have to be careful. Saying you are done collecting because of this fraud is your loss. Plenty of cards out there that are still good.

I think the board did a great job of reporting and analyzing the issues presented. But, in the grand scheme of things it is a subset of cards in the vintage universe. I feel like some people have automatically dismissed the entire hobby and in my opinion that is just being ridiculous.
__________________
always looking for e104-3 nadjas & 15 CJ Jackson
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:15 AM
Snapolit1's Avatar
Snapolit1 Snapolit1 is offline
Ste.ve Na.polit.ano
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,006
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
People like to make comparisons across other hobbies but there isn't a comparison. Baseball card collecting is an area where low grade is not considered worthless or undesirable. How many times has the board echoed the mantra "buy the card not the holder"?
Who said low grade was worthless or undesirable? Just pointing out why for some collectors there is a tremendous allure of high end scarcities. Not all but some. Same reason people pay a shit ton of money for limited edition cars and watches.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:33 AM
ejharrington ejharrington is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 298
Default

It has decreased, but not eliminated, my enthusiasm for vintage cards. I honestly don't know if my enthusiasm will ever fully come back. It's not only this scandal, but the fake signed card scandal (which had no impact on me directly) and other frauds have left me questioning everything.
__________________
Contact me if you have any Dave Kingman cards / memorabilia for sale.
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 07-17-2019, 09:57 AM
packs packs is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 5,485
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snapolit1 View Post
Who said low grade was worthless or undesirable? Just pointing out why for some collectors there is a tremendous allure of high end scarcities. Not all but some. Same reason people pay a shit ton of money for limited edition cars and watches.
To each their own as always, but it seems as though the difference between an authentic altered card and these high end scarcities gets smaller and smaller every day. If that makes collecting more exciting, more power to you. You could probably get the same card at a fraction of the price if you bought it trimmed, especially if it's trimmed anyway.

Last edited by packs; 07-17-2019 at 09:58 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:02 AM
KingFisk's Avatar
KingFisk KingFisk is offline
C@rl P@rk
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 613
Default

As stated/posted in other threads (post war and elsewhere here). I have solely been speculating on Alec Bohm prospect cards. Possibly foolish but a lot of fun getting behind a player I am genuinely excited about.

Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:17 AM
barrysloate barrysloate is offline
Barry Sloate
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 8,241
Default

For those who are disgusted by what has happened with third party grading, but still want to collect, why not consider some other kinds of baseball collectibles? There are many interesting areas other than cards, and it's just a matter of finding something that you find appealing.

Not for everyone, but something to think about.
Reply With Quote
  #61  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:18 AM
Johnny630 Johnny630 is offline
Johnny Ma$sili
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,658
Default

In the spirit of Warren Buffett....When people get nervous I look for buying opportunities.....
or Ex Chicago Mayor, Never let a crisis go to waste....when blood is in the water and the prices drop that will be the time to pounce... Pricing hasn't been effected yet.....
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:29 AM
Baseball Bob Baseball Bob is offline
Eric S.
member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Houston Swamp
Posts: 81
Default

To me, it all goes into the old adage “if it seems to be too good to be true, it is”. PWCC getting 30-40% more than any other auction house always seemed very suspicious to me, so I steered clear of them for the most part. If I later find that I was shilled and lost some money then shame on me.

I also always despised PSA because their grading was IMO terribly inconsistent. I always stuck with SGC, whose grading was way more predictable and consistent. Not perfect, mind you, but seemed more honest to me.

I still love collecting but I guard against fraud at every turn. People being people, and with the current mindset in this country being grab for whatever you can get no matter what the collateral damage to other people, other countries, the environment, etc, I am extraordinarily careful.
__________________
"Baseball Bob"

Successful transactions with ecRich, HTBB, MPeich, Pencil1974, JLoewke, Darkhorse9, Therajah, eb548, Cards 2121, etc.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:50 AM
vintagetoppsguy's Avatar
vintagetoppsguy vintagetoppsguy is online now
D@v!d J@m3s
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Richmond, TX
Posts: 5,240
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
For those who are disgusted by what has happened with third party grading, but still want to collect, why not consider some other kinds of baseball collectibles? There are many interesting areas other than cards, and it's just a matter of finding something that you find appealing.

Not for everyone, but something to think about.
I agree with this. In fact, I did just this a few months ago, prior to this scandal. My reasons had nothing to do with a bad sentiment towards the hobby, I had just gotten bored with what I was collecting. For me, I dove into signed checks (pretty hard to fake although it can be done), press photos and high grade HOF miscut cards. Since my passion is cards, I've had the most fun with the miscut cards. I buy what most people don't want and can usually pick them up very cheap. Here's a few that I've picked up so far. I don't think I paid more than $30 for any of these. The more miscut the better - I prefer to see part of another card - but it does have to be in otherwise very high grade condition. (If you have some for sale, hit me up )
Attached Images
File Type: jpg attachment.jpg (76.9 KB, 308 views)
File Type: jpg attachment2.jpg (63.9 KB, 313 views)
File Type: jpg attachment3.jpg (76.9 KB, 306 views)
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 07-17-2019, 11:16 AM
Bicem's Avatar
Bicem Bicem is offline
Jeff 'Prize-ner'
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Seattle
Posts: 3,423
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
For those who are disgusted by what has happened with third party grading, but still want to collect, why not consider some other kinds of baseball collectibles? There are many interesting areas other than cards, and it's just a matter of finding something that you find appealing.

Not for everyone, but something to think about.
Exactly, and I bet cards will seem much more ordinary (including high grade) after discovering other aspects of baseball collecting. At least it did for me.

Probably not trimmed...

__________________
Please donate & help save a life...
https://www.humanesociety.org/
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 07-17-2019, 12:58 PM
lowpopper's Avatar
lowpopper lowpopper is offline
Greg C
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: LONG ISLAND, NY
Posts: 316
Default public service announcement

Take the knowledge you gathered from the scandal
and use it to your benefit. Don’t get flustered or
discouraged. Do what you love and become sharper
through knowledge gained.
__________________
EBAY STORE: ROOKIE-PARADE
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 07-17-2019, 01:23 PM
Danny Smith Danny Smith is online now
Danny Smith
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 466
Default

I sold out of pretty much everything a few months ago. I still collect e105s and kept a few sentimental items. I really enjoyed the hunt but going forward i'm having fun collecting raw cards of players that I like to watch. I doubt I will ever get back into vintage like i was before.
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 07-17-2019, 01:44 PM
sb1 sb1 is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,796
Default

Buying as much or more for the sets I collect, as well as lots of high grade slabbed/raw material from reputable sources.

I will be at the National and buying pre-war & post-war cards, singles, sets, collections. Anyone wanting to cash in come to table #713, there will be buyers for many genre's at the table, all well capitalized.

Or if you prefer to auction your collection, that can be arranged as well.

Scott
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 07-17-2019, 02:09 PM
Snapolit1's Avatar
Snapolit1 Snapolit1 is offline
Ste.ve Na.polit.ano
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 3,006
Default

"PWCC getting 30-40% more than any other auction house" ?

I must have missed that. Sure, there are many instance on PWCC where stuff seems run up very oddly, but on high end stuff I never saw them getting consistently any higher prices than REA or Heritage or even Goldin. In many many cases I've watched over the years PWCC is lower. The slick catalogs and write ups clearly drive lots of people to these top tier AHs who ordinarily might not be speculating in cards. One spot for Goldin on CNBC Power Lunch probably equates to 100 new rich guy bidders on Wall Street. If one has a real high end vintage card, you'd be nuts to sell that with PWCC.

PWCC might seem higher of course as they don't tack on a 22-25% vig.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Baseball Bob View Post
To me, it all goes into the old adage “if it seems to be too good to be true, it is”. PWCC getting 30-40% more than any other auction house always seemed very suspicious to me, so I steered clear of them for the most part. If I later find that I was shilled and lost some money then shame on me.

I also always despised PSA because their grading was IMO terribly inconsistent. I always stuck with SGC, whose grading was way more predictable and consistent. Not perfect, mind you, but seemed more honest to me.

I still love collecting but I guard against fraud at every turn. People being people, and with the current mindset in this country being grab for whatever you can get no matter what the collateral damage to other people, other countries, the environment, etc, I am extraordinarily careful.

Last edited by Snapolit1; 07-17-2019 at 02:12 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 07-17-2019, 02:17 PM
1954 topps 1954 topps is offline
member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 10
Default

I'm going to stick out from the normal crowd here when I say I collect exclusively high grade, however, I collect only one set. My collecting goals will not change.

I've bought several cards in my set from PWCC including my Banks rookie and needless to say, I'm confident my cards are unaltered. However, I've also been highly skeptical of a few PWCC cards in the past. Example, I passed on a very nice Mays 8.5 that I felt could have been trimmed. As it turns out, this card WAS listed as being outed by BO. When I saw it was outed I wasn't shocked but it was horribly upsetting that I considered bidding.

PSA missed the boat and that's not acceptable. This affects all auction houses and the entire hobby, not just PWCC! Cards turn over several times and I'm not confident Memory Lane, Mile High, REA, Lelands, or others will catch these doctored cards.

Last edited by 1954 topps; 07-17-2019 at 02:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 07-17-2019, 02:21 PM
NYYFan63 NYYFan63 is offline
Ro.b Gui.1fo.y1e
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 241
Default

I started collecting pre-war over a year ago. I purchased about 50 T206's then stopped as I went back to collecting current (Trout, Acuna and a few others), and have now come back to buying T206's again. I am focusing on HOFr's for now mostly in the GD-EX range.
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Old 07-17-2019, 02:40 PM
Bicem's Avatar
Bicem Bicem is offline
Jeff 'Prize-ner'
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Seattle
Posts: 3,423
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1954 topps View Post
I've bought several cards in my set from PWCC including my Banks rookie and needless to say, I'm confident my cards are unaltered.
And exactly what makes you confident?
__________________
Please donate & help save a life...
https://www.humanesociety.org/
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 07-17-2019, 02:53 PM
CurtisFlood CurtisFlood is offline
Bob
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Missouri
Posts: 279
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yankees1964 View Post
I have also stopped. I have not lost interest but instead shifted to working on a 91 Desert Shield set. I never bought from PWCC. I am more of an in person buyer at shows and on Net54 but many times I end up with a card that at one time went through PWCC. I'm actually waiting, maybe dreaming, for when there is a comprehensive list of altered cards that will be out there.
You do know they counterfeited those too don't you? If the pineapple is outside the border the card is quite possibly one of the fakes. Good luck with that set though. I've seen one that was minus the Chipper Jones Rookie, but felt the seller wanted full blown retail so I couldn't make a deal with him.
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:30 PM
1954 topps 1954 topps is offline
member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 10
Default

Precision micrometer for measurements over a extensive sample size, blacklight, and aplanatic-achromatic Loupe. I always check my cards over extensively as soon as I receive them, even commons.
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:49 PM
perezfan's Avatar
perezfan perezfan is offline
M@RK ST€!NBERG
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,398
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1954 topps View Post
Precision micrometer for measurements over a extensive sample size, blacklight, and aplanatic-achromatic Loupe. I always check my cards over extensively as soon as I receive them, even commons.
All of which puts you miles ahead of PSA!
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 07-17-2019, 03:50 PM
AGuinness's Avatar
AGuinness AGuinness is offline
Garth Guibord
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 646
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowpopper View Post
Take the knowledge you gathered from the scandal
and use it to your benefit. Don’t get flustered or
discouraged. Do what you love and become sharper
through knowledge gained.
I agree. Anybody who has found this board has some basic knowledge to work with and the ability to learn more. Part of my enjoyment in collecting is expanding my knowledge and my skills in assessing cards. And there are limitless ways to collect - if these scandals made such an impact that it ruins things, there are opportunities to shift and find other niches.
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 07-17-2019, 05:07 PM
conor912's Avatar
conor912 conor912 is offline
C0nor D0na.hue
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,184
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bicem View Post
And exactly what makes you confident?
I find it funny that everyone is so confident that their collection has escaped this wrath. Almost as funny as those who think no longer buying from PWCC is going to sheild them. This is just now getting out but has been going on for a long time. At this point these cards are all out there being bought and sold by unknowing, honest people other than Brent...even on the BST here. I'm not saying that denial can't help some people sleep at night, but it's delusion nonetheless.

We all unknowingly have altered cards in our collections. All of us.
__________________
Items for sale or trade here UPDATED 3-16-18

Last edited by conor912; 07-17-2019 at 05:08 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 07-17-2019, 05:21 PM
Bicem's Avatar
Bicem Bicem is offline
Jeff 'Prize-ner'
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Seattle
Posts: 3,423
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1954 topps View Post
Precision micrometer for measurements over a extensive sample size, blacklight, and aplanatic-achromatic Loupe. I always check my cards over extensively as soon as I receive them, even commons.
But you can't be sure from just looking at online pics, and most AH's aren't going to accept a return if you deem a card altered using the above when PSA says different without compelling evidence like before and after pics. So then what do you do or what have you done?
__________________
Please donate & help save a life...
https://www.humanesociety.org/
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old 07-17-2019, 05:21 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 19,012
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by conor912 View Post
I find it funny that everyone is so confident that their collection has escaped this wrath. Almost as funny as those who think no longer buying from PWCC is going to sheild them. This is just now getting out but has been going on for a long time. At this point these cards are all out there being bought and sold by unknowing, honest people other than Brent...even on the BST here. I'm not saying that denial can't help some people sleep at night, but it's delusion nonetheless.

We all unknowingly have altered cards in our collections. All of us.
All of us except me.

But on a serious note, yes, the infestation has spread far and wide.
__________________
Stuff trumps all. Even tainted stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #79  
Old 07-17-2019, 05:24 PM
Mark70Z's Avatar
Mark70Z Mark70Z is online now
M@rk Comer
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 1,336
Default Collecting

Quote:
Originally Posted by barrysloate View Post
For those who are disgusted by what has happened with third party grading, but still want to collect, why not consider some other kinds of baseball collectibles? There are many interesting areas other than cards, and it's just a matter of finding something that you find appealing.

Not for everyone, but something to think about.
I think probably most of the people on this board have the collecting gene so your thoughts on collecting other things is probably what some people need especially after this fiasco. I’m sure we’re just scratching the surface as well.

Personally I’m very disgusted, a bit down and disappointed with what’s going on with cards with both the sellers and TPA. When I first started collecting I didn’t take much consideration about the condition of cards. Shoot when I was young I didn’t really even think about “oh no; this card is off center”. Since I’ve been collecting a while now I decided to upgrade some of my cards and purchased some in slabs. It hurts to know I may have some of those cards that are altered that I paid a premium. I haven’t given up completely like some, but I stopped purchasing graded cards completely at this point.
Reply With Quote
  #80  
Old 07-17-2019, 05:27 PM
Goudey77 Goudey77 is offline
Martin
Martin L.ee
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Northwest
Posts: 217
Default

I think a lot of the lull people are experiencing is typical during the summer months. We get busy with other projects, Vacations, events, etc.
It's when the cold weather hits and cabin fever kicks in.

I bet it'll be business as usual for most by the winter season?
Especially if there are opportunities for good deals!
Reply With Quote
  #81  
Old 07-17-2019, 05:52 PM
seattlerainiers's Avatar
seattlerainiers seattlerainiers is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 316
Default What a Rube

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bicem View Post
Exactly, and I bet cards will seem much more ordinary (including high grade) after discovering other aspects of baseball collecting. At least it did for me.

Probably not trimmed...

What a silly-looking card Jeff. Who would want to own one of those?
Reply With Quote
  #82  
Old 07-17-2019, 06:00 PM
Aquarian Sports Cards Aquarian Sports Cards is offline
Scott Russell
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 3,292
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by conor912 View Post
I find it funny that everyone is so confident that their collection has escaped this wrath. Almost as funny as those who think no longer buying from PWCC is going to sheild them. This is just now getting out but has been going on for a long time. At this point these cards are all out there being bought and sold by unknowing, honest people other than Brent...even on the BST here. I'm not saying that denial can't help some people sleep at night, but it's delusion nonetheless.

We all unknowingly have altered cards in our collections. All of us.
I think, with a lot of us, we don't believe that not buying from PWCC is going to shield us. It's more about not rewarding a company that has done so much harm to the hobby we purport to love.
__________________
Great experience buying from edjs and mybuddyinc. Check out my ebay store, weird, eclectic, accurate, and reasonable! http://stores.ebay.com/Aquarian-Sports-Cards Also check out http://www.birminghamauctioneers.com
Reply With Quote
  #83  
Old 07-17-2019, 06:47 PM
tedzan tedzan is online now
Ted Zanidakis
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pennsylvania & Maine
Posts: 7,588
Default

Before I make my comments on this subject, here is where I'm coming from. Displayed here are my first two BB cards (I am not sure
which one of these was my very 1st). The 1947 picture from my Yankee Stadium Team Photo pack or the 1947 BOND BREAD BB card.
Why Johnny Lindell ? Well, as an 8-year old, I was really impressed with Johnny's performance in the 1947 World Series (Yankees vs
Dodgers). I listened to the entire 7-game Series on my Radio.
Lindell's 1947 World Series stats (6 games)....AB = 18, BAvg = .500, SLG = .778, Hits = 9, RBI = 7, BB = 5, K = 2.
Plus 4 diving catches in LF which ultimately saved each of the games those particular days.


OK, this is the 73rd year (excluding 4 years in the Air Force and first 7 years of marriage) since I started collecting anything related to
BB. And, I will continue collecting BB cards (and Sports related memorabilia) until it's time to pass my stuff onto my Grandson.

Upon reading the posts in this thread, all I can say is that I feel sorry for many of you who are allowing some "bad guys" in this hobby
destroy your passion for collecting Sportscards. I can understand that some of you have invested a lot into graded cards and you have
become very "pi$$ed". Eventually, this "storm" will have passed, and here's hoping you return to this great hobby.

I am probably the oldest "dude" on this forum; however, spending many hours going thru my BB card collection.....researching certain
aspects of these cards (or sets)…..wheeling-and-dealing with some of you guys....and first and foremost of all, establishing friendships
which last a lifetime...have kept me young at heart.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
Reply With Quote
  #84  
Old 07-17-2019, 07:05 PM
wondo wondo is offline
John Wondowski
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 739
Default

I’m buying more than I ever have. Having a ball!
__________________
T207 - 122/206 (gots a ways to go)
Reply With Quote
  #85  
Old 07-17-2019, 07:17 PM
Exhibitman's Avatar
Exhibitman Exhibitman is offline
Ad@m W@r$h@w
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Beautiful Downtown Burbank
Posts: 7,390
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy View Post
Since my passion is cards, I've had the most fun with the miscut cards. I buy what most people don't want and can usually pick them up very cheap. Here's a few that I've picked up so far. I don't think I paid more than $30 for any of these. The more miscut the better - I prefer to see part of another card - but it does have to be in otherwise very high grade condition. (If you have some for sale, hit me up )
I've been interested in miscuts for years. Some of my favorites:










__________________
Please visit my web site: www.americasgreatboxingcards.com
Judge a man by how he treats someone who can do nothing for him--Nick Charles
10% off any BIN in my eBay store (user name: exhibitman) for N54 members buying direct from me through this site instead, just PM me.
Reply With Quote
  #86  
Old 07-17-2019, 08:00 PM
oldjudge's Avatar
oldjudge oldjudge is offline
j'a'y mi.ll.e.r
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The Bronx
Posts: 4,130
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tedzan View Post
Before I make my comments on this subject, here is where I'm coming from. Displayed here are my first two BB cards (I am not sure
which one of these was my very 1st). The 1947 picture from my Yankee Stadium Team Photo pack or the 1947 BOND BREAD BB card.
Why Johnny Lindell ? Well, as an 8-year old, I was really impressed with Johnny's performance in the 1947 World Series (Yankees vs
Dodgers). I listened to the entire 7-game Series on my Radio.
Lindell's 1947 World Series stats (6 games)....AB = 18, BAvg = .500, SLG = .778, Hits = 9, RBI = 7, BB = 5, K = 2.
Plus 4 diving catches in LF which ultimately saved each of the games those particular days.


OK, this is the 73rd year (excluding 4 years in the Air Force and first 7 years of marriage) since I started collecting anything related to
BB. And, I will continue collecting BB cards (and Sports related memorabilia) until it's time to pass my stuff onto my Grandson.

Upon reading the posts in this thread, all I can say is that I feel sorry for many of you who are allowing some "bad guys" in this hobby
destroy your passion for collecting Sportscards. I can understand that some of you have invested a lot into graded cards and you have
become very "pi$$ed". Eventually, this "storm" will have passed, and here's hoping you return to this great hobby.

I am probably the oldest "dude" on this forum; however, spending many hours going thru my BB card collection.....researching certain
aspects of these cards (or sets)…..wheeling-and-dealing with some of you guys....and first and foremost of all, establishing friendships
which last a lifetime...have kept me young at heart.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
Well said Ted!
Reply With Quote
  #87  
Old 07-17-2019, 08:03 PM
Yoda Yoda is offline
Joh.n Spen.cer
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 637
Default

PWCC must be a full blown money-making machine. I am sure their cash flow covers overheads easily and leaves a tidy profit for the owners. But poor Bret. Think of the agro.
Reply With Quote
  #88  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:00 AM
tedzan tedzan is online now
Ted Zanidakis
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pennsylvania & Maine
Posts: 7,588
Default

Thank you, Jay. I appreciate the compliment.

As I recall, you are a Yankees fan. But, too young to have seen the 1947 World Series. In my opinion this World Series was
one of the most exciting ever played. Plus, it was Jackie Robinson's first Series. I have seen most of the World Series since
1949 (when my folks purchased our first TV).
Check-it-out, if you haven't seen it.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.
Reply With Quote
  #89  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:22 AM
Fuddjcal Fuddjcal is offline
Chuck Tapia
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,433
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SAllen2556 View Post
I always figured there were mistakes made on graded cards, but I now believe the percentage is MUCH higher than the 1 or 2% I used to assume.

And to make it worse, I'm now questioning the cards I already own that are in PSA holders. This card is a PSA 4. I admit, I bought the 4 not the card. I was at the National, saw it and bought it before I really looked at it. Now I just don't know. It looks funny to me. And now I know I can't trust these guys to catch the most basic card alterations that I foolishly assumed they would pretty much never miss. That's a game changer for me.

So, yes, it has made me even more jaded.

I'm wondering if other people have graded cards that they now look at and wonder.....

Attachment 359651
This Mike Schmidt rookie card has been dipped in bleach and trimmed or I'm not Brent Mastro
Reply With Quote
  #90  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:25 AM
Fuddjcal Fuddjcal is offline
Chuck Tapia
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,433
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AGuinness View Post
I'm curious if anyone who does feel the same way, that recent revelations have ruined things, could go deeper as to what has changed. I ask, in part, because while the revelations are dramatic, trimming, recoloring, etc. are not at all new; these types of scammers and bad actors have had a presence in the hobby for a long, long time.
The revelations are shocking and I am still frustrated that we have to deal with card doctors and this type of bad behavior. But perhaps what is even more frustrating is how PWCC has not seemed to lose much business despite the revelations. It's like a restaurant that people discover is serving rat meat instead of hamburgers, all while adding RoundUp and spitting on them before giving them to people. And yet customers still line up...
Anyway, I'm not going to let a few bad actors ruin my fun in the hobby. But my collecting goals are modest (to say the least) and my philosophy with buying any card is that I will make the purchase if I am ok with it losing all it's value and I can still enjoy it.
What's new for me is the PWCC business plan from the start. To shill bid, bleach and trim every card for the taking, re holster a sell for a huge profit.

I'm just not interested in a hobby that allows that bullshit for 15 years, sorry.
Reply With Quote
  #91  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:26 AM
todeen todeen is offline
Tim Odeen
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 92
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MULLINS5 View Post
Opposite for me. Since the scandal I've ditched graded, gone raw, and have a lot more fun (and money). Bought a bunch of unikeep binders and pages.
I never got into graded cards. Bought raw, still by raw. I did kind of follow authenticated autographs. But for 10 years I have heard that fraud is rampant in this sector. I followed the hall of shame blog. Best advice has always been buy from your trusted local dealer. So the news to me hasn't been earth shattering.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
__________________
Collecting '61 Topps, Tris Speaker, 1930-45 Cincinnati Reds
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:40 AM
dabigyankeeman dabigyankeeman is offline
Arnie
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: florida, used to be New York
Posts: 541
Default

Over the years I have bought a lot of graded cards mainly to verify that they are authentic and not counterfeits, and then popped them out of their slabs and put them raw into sheets in albums. The last couple of years I have left them in their slabs again mainly for authenticity in case I want to sell them down the road. I dont get into the super-expensive stuff, and for me I am not going to let this scandal take away the fantastic enjoyment I get out of collecting. I think that except for a small bunch of really intense collectors, this whole thing in time will blow over anyway.
__________________
Its so great to love all the New York teams in all sports, particularly the YANKEES.
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:29 AM
AGuinness's Avatar
AGuinness AGuinness is offline
Garth Guibord
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 646
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldjudge View Post
Well said Ted!
Ted hits it on the head.

Also, it's good to note that while the doctors and scam artists are out there, the modern age of the hobby includes tools to catch and identify them (not to mention the dedicated people out there willing to spend the time to do so).
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:41 AM
Fuddjcal Fuddjcal is offline
Chuck Tapia
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,433
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1954 topps View Post
I'm going to stick out from the normal crowd here when I say I collect exclusively high grade, however, I collect only one set. My collecting goals will not change.

I've bought several cards in my set from PWCC including my Banks rookie and needless to say, I'm confident my cards are unaltered. However, I've also been highly skeptical of a few PWCC cards in the past. Example, I passed on a very nice Mays 8.5 that I felt could have been trimmed. As it turns out, this card WAS listed as being outed by BO. When I saw it was outed I wasn't shocked but it was horribly upsetting that I considered bidding.

PSA missed the boat and that's not acceptable. This affects all auction houses and the entire hobby, not just PWCC! Cards turn over several times and I'm not confident Memory Lane, Mile High, REA, Lelands, or others will catch these doctored cards.
If you don't think that Banks Rookie is doctored, I have a bridge to sell you LOLOLOL.
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:42 AM
ullmandds's Avatar
ullmandds ullmandds is offline
pete ullman
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: saint paul, mn
Posts: 8,948
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AGuinness View Post
Ted hits it on the head.

Also, it's good to note that while the doctors and scam artists are out there, the modern age of the hobby includes tools to catch and identify them (not to mention the dedicated people out there willing to spend the time to do so).
seriously? you mean like PSA?
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 07-18-2019, 12:05 PM
perezfan's Avatar
perezfan perezfan is offline
M@RK ST€!NBERG
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,398
Default

If PWCC comes away from all of this unscathed, and if there aren't some strong ramifications/changes in store for PSA (i.e. the way they grade + conduct business), then Brent's Tenets will inevitably become the Hobby norm.

At that point (if nothing ultimately happens, and Brent's views on "conservation" are deemed valid), then I am out completely. I am still hanging on by a thread, and finding some nice raw cards via Greg Morris and others. But my continued participation in the hobby pretty much rests on what specific punishment is in store for the Doctors, Corrupt Dealers and TPGs (whether negligent, incompetent or complicit).
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 07-18-2019, 01:01 PM
AGuinness's Avatar
AGuinness AGuinness is offline
Garth Guibord
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 646
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ullmandds View Post
seriously? you mean like PSA?
I was referring more to Worthpoint, etc. that helps with the before and after photos. The better tools are the online records of previous sales and accompanying photos, not to mention bidding history and other ways to ferret out shilling (if we expand to other scandals).
But yes, PSA and TPGs are also tools that can be used. I don't believe, nor ever have believed, that any TPG is infallible, but I also don't believe they are co-conspirators with the other parties involved in the doctoring scandals (jury remains out on Beckett with that former employee getting black labels). They offer an opinion that should be taken with a grain of salt, and I'm not going to cast out every slabbed card because a number of them got through the grading process after being altered.
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:24 PM
LEHR's Avatar
LEHR LEHR is offline
Paul Lehr
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Salt Lake City
Posts: 195
Default

After 30+ years of card collecting and owning thousands of PSA cards over the years, I can now hold all my graded cards in two hands.
Thankfully I became disenchanted with card collecting long before the latest fiasco.
I'm still an avid collector, but I've definitely moved on from cards, and truthfully, I don't miss it.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Not sure how I should feel about this? Fballguy Net54baseball Sports (Primarily) Vintage Memorabilia Forum incl. Game Used 17 08-05-2017 11:44 AM
I feel sorry... HOF Auto Rookies Autograph Forum- Primarily Sports 37 09-26-2014 08:35 PM
I feel it's my duty. Phillies*phan Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 14 07-10-2013 01:06 AM
Well If I Ever Feel the Need to Own the Best.... Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 20 04-14-2005 07:12 AM
Do you feel like we do..... Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 6 12-11-2003 09:16 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:44 PM.


ebay GSB