Question on Collecting Sealed Packs

[Blunder19]

I am thinking about putting together a collection of all the topps packs from 1951-1975. When collecting sealed packs how do you make sure the pack hasn't been tampered with, if buying raw?

Is there anything I can look for in the scans that may help me to determine if a pack has been opened and resealed? I would really appreciate any help on this subject so I don't get burned while trying to assemble this collection.

Also.. aside from ebay.. does anyone know where is a good place to find sealed packs?

Thanks
Jamie

[vintagecpa]

Based on everything I have read on the topic, it is pretty safe to assume they have all been tampered with. I think Pepis has quite a bit of knowledge on the topic. I guess if you never plan on opening them, you will never know.

[RobertGT]

I wouldn't go far as to say they have all been tampered with. There is still plenty of legit unopened wax out there. The key is to buy from a reputable source. Steve Hart of the Baseball Card Exchange is certainly an authority in this field and a good place to buy from, but expect to pay a premium for his packs. Since you are looking for 1951-1975, you are going to put out some decent cash anyway. Keep in mind even Steve Hart has been duped a few times, and I'm sure the board member Pepis will chime in on this later.

If you want to go it alone, I would recommend buying Mark Murphy's (The Baseball Card Kid's) unopened pack guide before you begin your quest. I think you can still buy them for less than $10 on eBay. Mark Murphy, in my mind, is still the foremost expert when it comes to unopened wax, even though it seems he has almost dropped out of the hobby as of late.

A quick primer:
-Look for tell-tale factory roller seals with wax on the back of all Topps packs. This is a good thing - a sign you have a good pack with factory rolls intact.
-Check corner folds on the back of wax pack. Each should have a factory fold at a 45 degree angle with a tight seal, just like a present. Most reseal jobs are easy to spot just by looking at the sloppy condition of the pack.
-Tears or holes in the corners of the packs. Likely the result of refolding the wrapper. Wrappers are fragile and will break down easily after a couple attempts to refold.
-Beware of signs of excessive heat on the wrapper, i.e. brown "burn" marks. Likely a sign of a fraudster using an iron to reseal the pack.
-Glue on the pack, or pack is to hard to open/tears wax paper when opened. Resealed.
-No gum that you can feel within the pack. Pretty obvious here.
-Rack packs - Notches/fingernail marks that leave an indentation on the top of the card. Someone attempted to pull the top cards back through the pack to reveal which are underneath.
-Some racks and cellos can also be sequentially searched depending on which player is on the top or bottom. Nothing you can do about this. Pack is still legit, just may not contain any stars or RCs.

Hope this helps and good luck.

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Originally Posted by RobertGT

I wouldn't go far as to say they have all been tampered with. There is still plenty of legit unopened wax out there. The key is to buy from a reputable source. Steve Hart of the Baseball Card Exchange is certainly an authority in this field and a good place to buy from, but expect to pay a premium for his packs. Since you are looking for 1951-1975, you are going to put out some decent cash anyway. Keep in mind even Steve Hart has been duped a few times, and I'm sure the board member Pepis will chime in on this later.

If you want to go it alone, I would recommend buying Mark Murphy's (The Baseball Card Kid's) unopened pack guide before you begin your quest. I think you can still buy them for less than $10 on eBay. Mark Murphy, in my mind, is still the foremost expert when it comes to unopened wax, even though it seems he has almost dropped out of the hobby as of late.

A quick primer:
-Look for tell-tale factory roller seals with wax on the back of all Topps wax. This is a good thing - a sign you have a good pack with factory rolls intact.
-Check corner folds on the back of wax pack. Each should have a factory fold at a 45 degree angle with a tight seal, just like a present. Most reseal jobs are easy to spot just by looking at the sloppy condition of the pack.
-Tears or holes in the corners or the packs. Likely the result of refolding the wrapper. Wrappers are fragile and will break down easily after a couple attempts to refold.
-Beware of signs of excessive heat on the wrapper, i.e. brown "burn" marks. Likely a sign of a fraudster using an iron to reseal the pack.
-Glue on the pack, or pack is to hard to open/tears wax paper when opened. Resealed.
-No gum that you can feel within the pack. Pretty obvious here.
-Rack packs - Notches/fingernail marks that leave an indentation on the top of the card. Someone attempted to pull the top cards back through the pack to reveal which are underneath.
-Some racks and cellos can also be sequentially searched depending on which player is on the top or bottom. Nothing you can do about this. Pack is still legit, just may not contain any stars or RCs.

Hope this helps and good luck.

Very good information there.

Here's my advice. Since it's pretty much been proven that fraud is rampant with "unopened" packs and they are very difficult to authenticate, why not just collect the wrappers from those years and make a nice framed display of those wrappers? You'll save a ton of money, not get defrauded and at the end of the day you're viewing pretty much the same thing.

[Ease]

Originally Posted by WhenItWasAHobby

Here's my advice. Since it's pretty much been proven that fraud is rampant with "unopened" packs and they are very difficult to authenticate, why not just collect the wrappers from those years and make a nice framed display of those wrappers? You'll save a ton of money, not get defrauded and at the end of the day you're viewing pretty much the same thing.

What a fantastic idea!

[ullmandds]

I "3rd" Dan's idea...collecting sealed packs seems like a very risky endeavor to me...with little enjoyment...unless of course you eventually open them!!!?!

[ALR-bishop]

I have done a Topps pack run, 51 to 2013 ( have had to settle for penny packs in 56 and 58, which I think are the toughest) Agree with Robert that reading Murphy's pack guide would be a good primer. I could lend you mine if you can't find one. He may still sell them on his baseball card kid web site

You are looking at a very expensive project

I have done wrappers as well and there are fakes of those too, particularly early 50s. But they would be less expensive, easier to find, and less likely to be counterfeited

[PolarBear]

If I were doing it, I'd stick with graded packs. It may be more pricy but from what I've read on the subject, tampering is a huge problem. I would personally never buy an unopened pack unless it was graded.

I think the wrapper idea was pretty good too.

[tribefan]

Start by buying some late 80's packs and looking at them closely. Try opening them and then immediately folding them back. This will give you an idea at least of an amateurish reseal attempt.

[DHogan]

There is another unopened pack guide from a dealer that called himself the Prince of Cards. (Darren Prince). I have the 3rd edition of the guide. Not as many color photos as Mark Murphy's. But, still had some good information.

[Blunder19]

Just looking to update this thread.. was able to find a happy medium collecting Topps packs... I collected sealed packs from 1970 to present... I collected wrappers for all the 1960 packs and just put 10 modern cards in them.. and folded them back up to look sealed..

for the 1950s I actually just printed out an image of an unfolded wrapper off google.. and put 10 cards in them... and folded it up and taped it shut.. haha it actually looks ok... (the 1951 pack is the only real one from the 1950s-1960s)

My amazing wife was kind enough to get me the display that I asked for... for christmas... and I put the whole thing together... 1950s at the top... each row is a new decade.. present day at the bottom..

I like the way it came out... Hope you guys like it.

[brob28]

Looks great Jamie!

[DHogan]

That's cool.

[tschock]

VERY cool project and display!

[tbob]

Originally Posted by WhenItWasAHobby

Very good information there.

Here's my advice. Since it's pretty much been proven that fraud is rampant with "unopened" packs and they are very difficult to authenticate, why not just collect the wrappers from those years and make a nice framed display of those wrappers? You'll save a ton of money, not get defrauded and at the end of the day you're viewing pretty much the same thing.

+1. I learned the hard way about "öpened" unopened packs of vintage cards (1961 and 1962). The problem is that often you will have purchased them years ago and just now getting a round to getting them graded and discovered that the graders determined they were tampered with, and for the life of you, you can not remember who you purchased the packs from on ebay

[jcmtiger]

I would never venture in this type of collectible, to dangerous in my opinion, second to collecting autographs.

Joe

[Ease]

Sweet display Jamie!