NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-21-2011, 03:32 PM
sreader3 sreader3 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,222
Default Underappreciated Rarities

The rarities among the major tobacco issues (e.g., T205, T206, T207) are pretty well documented. But there are a lot of difficult cards in other prewar sets that seem to fly under the radar. I thought there would be some value in a thread where collectors of less heralded prewar issues share their knowledge about scarcities they have discovered while set building, as well as any speculation as to why the identified cards are so difficult. I am thinking along the lines of ...

Subject: E121-120 George Whitted (Brooklyn)
Reason: Trade from Pirates to Dodgers on 3/14/22, near the end of production

Subject: M101-4 Oscar Stanage (Portrait from Waist) #168
Reason: Photo swap (Todd S. can surely provide a more complete analysis!!!)

Subject: F50 Harrington's/Tharp's/Yuengling's Earl Smith #48
Reason: Chase card for ice cream redemption

Anyone else wanna play?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-21-2011, 03:55 PM
benchod benchod is offline
Craig
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 526
Default

Good topic
Are you positive about the Earl Smith?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-21-2011, 04:13 PM
rhettyeakley's Avatar
rhettyeakley rhettyeakley is offline
Rhett Yeakley
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 2,650
Default

Only the Harrington's Smith is the "green" one. Many have speculated it is because that was the chase card but I have my doubts. Also, we know from the backs of some of these "ice cream sets" that Ruth was in fact the premium card as he got you free ice cream. I'm with you on the E121 Whitted Brooklyn--that card is pretty tough (as far as E121 Series of 120 cards are concerned), I'd love to upgrade mine but I may have to wait a while.

__________________
Check out my YouTube Videos highlighting VINTAGE CARDS https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbE..._as=subscriber

ebay store: kryvintage-->https://www.ebay.com/sch/kryvintage/...p2047675.l2562
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-21-2011, 08:40 PM
sreader3 sreader3 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,222
Default

I am not positive about Smith, BUT ...

*There have been 435 Yuengling's cards graded by PSA to date, an average of 7.25 for each of the 60 cards in the set.

*At least two examples of every subject except Smith have been graded, with as many as 18 examples of some commons having been graded.

*The pop on Smith is ... ZERO.

While these pop data don't by any means conclusively prove Smith was a chase card, they are suggestive. At the very least, Smith seems to be considerably more difficult than the rest.

EDITED TO ADD: In the PSA pop reports, Smith doesn't seem as difficult with Tharp's--just Harrington's and Yuengling's. (And in the interest of full disclosure I have never owned a Smith with any of these three backs.)

Last edited by sreader3; 01-21-2011 at 09:07 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-22-2011, 07:56 AM
scmavl's Avatar
scmavl scmavl is offline
J@RR0D
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: NC
Posts: 2,139
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhettyeakley View Post
Also, we know from the backs of some of these "ice cream sets" that Ruth was in fact the premium card as he got you free ice cream.
I'd hate to know that my grandfather traded off a Babe Ruth card for some ice cream...
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-22-2011, 09:13 AM
Leon's Avatar
Leon Leon is offline
Leon
peasant/forum owner
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: near Dallas
Posts: 34,200
Default smallest set known!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sreader3 View Post

Subject: F50 Harrington's/Tharp's/Yuengling's Earl Smith #48
Reason: Chase card for ice cream redemption

Anyone else wanna play?
Something that is a bit strange, if I may, is that this Greiners Bread card is one of two known, from the whole series, in the hobby. Ironically the only other card is also a Harris!!! Since the redemption on back was for bread I classify it as D-Unc., not F50. I wonder what dear old Mr. Burdick would have classified it as? Also shown, since we are here, are a few odds and ends. For those interested I don't think quality control was job one in the manufacture of these little gems. best regards and happy collecting.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg pdunc1928greinersbread.jpg (80.8 KB, 1081 views)
File Type: jpg pf50groupx5.jpg (76.2 KB, 1079 views)
File Type: jpg pf50yeunglingsmiscutfront.jpg (73.1 KB, 1073 views)
File Type: jpg pf50yeunglingsharrismiscut.jpg (75.4 KB, 1074 views)
__________________
Leon Luckey
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-22-2011, 10:36 AM
sreader3 sreader3 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,222
Default Greiners

Leon,

Thanks for the pics. I have never heard of Greiners Bread before.

I think Burdick would have called it D384 or some such.

Since only two are known and both are Harris, maybe they were samples presented to Greiners and the company pulled the plug before production?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-22-2011, 01:02 PM
FrankWakefield FrankWakefield is offline
Frank Wakefield
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Franklin KY
Posts: 2,718
Default

I'd think that the cards were actually produced. A salesman could have shown a sample of some other card, Harrington's, or something. It would be a bit of a hassle to just print up a sample. And if making a sample, I'd have thought that there would be different players on the printing sheet... so it seems odd that there would be 2 Harris samples. But maybe you're right. Great cards, Leon.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-22-2011, 01:47 PM
Bob Lemke's Avatar
Bob Lemke Bob Lemke is offline
Bob Lemke
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Iola, Wis.
Posts: 646
Default I'm surprised . . .

that the E121/120 George Whitted, Brooklyn, is not in the 2010 or 2011 Standard Catalog. I don't have access to earlier editions; was it ever listed?
__________________
My (usually) vintage baseball/football card blog: http://boblemke.blogspot.com

Link to my custom cards gallery:
http://tinyurl.com/customcards
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-22-2011, 02:18 PM
rhettyeakley's Avatar
rhettyeakley rhettyeakley is offline
Rhett Yeakley
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Idaho
Posts: 2,650
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Lemke View Post
that the E121/120 George Whitted, Brooklyn, is not in the 2010 or 2011 Standard Catalog. I don't have access to earlier editions; was it ever listed?
Bob, yes it was listed in earlier editions but there was a belief for a while on this forum that it was among the cards from that set that didn't in fact exist (like the Charles O'Leary, Charles Deal, etc. that were all rightfully delisted from the set) until Bob P. produced one from his Brooklyn collection. It should be RE-included in the next SCD as it does in fact exist. It is probably the toughest card in that set--as the E121 Series of 120 isn't particularly difficult to get near completion (The Rawlings "Utl." is also extremely tough--I don't have that one yet).

-Rhett
__________________
Check out my YouTube Videos highlighting VINTAGE CARDS https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbE..._as=subscriber

ebay store: kryvintage-->https://www.ebay.com/sch/kryvintage/...p2047675.l2562
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-22-2011, 04:43 PM
sreader3 sreader3 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,222
Default

Bob,

The most recent Catalog I have is 2006. That version does not include two other E121 variations that have been discussed on this forum over the last couple of years. I will summarize here just in case you haven't already added them.

1. E121-80 Hooper (Small Projection). Rhett discovered this variation, in which due to a smaller projection image a house is visible on the left border. In the more common E121-80 Hooper (Large Projection), the house is pretty much cropped out.

2. E121-120 Torporcer (Correct Spelling). In this variation, the player's last name is spelled correctly, whereas in its counterpart the player's name is misspelled "Toporcer". Not clear to me which version is more common.

(If somebody has additional or different information, please chime in!)
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-22-2011, 04:46 PM
sreader3 sreader3 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,222
Default

Frank,

Your points are well taken. I'd be interested in hearing other theories.

Scot
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-23-2011, 10:24 AM
edhans's Avatar
edhans edhans is offline
Ed Hans
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Buffalo, N.Y.
Posts: 1,222
Default Re: Underappreciated Rarities

Leon,
The other known Greiner's is a Traynor.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-23-2011, 10:41 AM
Leon's Avatar
Leon Leon is offline
Leon
peasant/forum owner
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: near Dallas
Posts: 34,200
Default then....

Quote:
Originally Posted by edhans View Post
Leon,
The other known Greiner's is a Traynor.
Hi Ed
Then I stand corrected. I could have sworn the other owner told me it was the same player, but maybe not. regards
__________________
Leon Luckey
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-23-2011, 01:35 PM
Eggoman's Avatar
Eggoman Eggoman is offline
Greg Z@y@tz
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Lockport
Posts: 951
Default

I have Greiner's Bread cards of McGraw and Speaker, too. See PSA's Pop Report. I had a chance at a Near set years ago, but we couldn't agree on price because we couldn't find the cards in a guide!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 04-23-2011, 01:57 PM
bcbgcbrcb bcbgcbrcb is offline
Phil Garry
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 6,817
Default

I would have to nominate all items in my collection........

Last edited by bcbgcbrcb; 04-23-2011 at 02:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 04-23-2011, 02:51 PM
Cat's Avatar
Cat Cat is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 444
Default

It looks like it is a left/right shift and a croping/projection issue. Although you can see the house on the left you lose some image on the right. These are both series 80.


Last edited by Cat; 04-23-2011 at 03:05 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 04-23-2011, 04:18 PM
FrankWakefield FrankWakefield is offline
Frank Wakefield
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Franklin KY
Posts: 2,718
Default

Thanks for posting those two, Cat.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 04-23-2011, 11:10 PM
Brian Van Horn Brian Van Horn is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 6,029
Default

.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1921 E121 (eighty) Sallee [Front].jpg (28.9 KB, 396 views)
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 04-23-2011, 11:46 PM
ls7plus ls7plus is offline
Larry
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Southfield, Michigan
Posts: 1,765
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sreader3 View Post
The rarities among the major tobacco issues (e.g., T205, T206, T207) are pretty well documented. But there are a lot of difficult cards in other prewar sets that seem to fly under the radar. I thought there would be some value in a thread where collectors of less heralded prewar issues share their knowledge about scarcities they have discovered while set building, as well as any speculation as to why the identified cards are so difficult. I am thinking along the lines of ...

Anyone else wanna play?
1939 Salutations Exhibit Gehrig--almost certainly pulled after just a few month's issuance after his fatal illness was announced in May, 1939. The Exhibit Supply Company would not have wanted to be seen as attempting to profit from the misfortune of a doomed man.

Larry
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 04-24-2011, 12:01 AM
Leon's Avatar
Leon Leon is offline
Leon
peasant/forum owner
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: near Dallas
Posts: 34,200
Default would love to see them...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eggoman View Post
I have Greiner's Bread cards of McGraw and Speaker, too. See PSA's Pop Report. I had a chance at a Near set years ago, but we couldn't agree on price because we couldn't find the cards in a guide!
Since I have only heard of a few in total, before these, I would love to see scans to compare any printing differences. No doubt most rare card sets will have more cards turn up as time goes by. It could make the things that don't have "finds" of them even more valuable. I guess these other Greiner Bread cards aren't on the registry as I don't seem them listed. I don't have a membership to see the pop report. That's pretty neat there was/is a near set. I wonder when/if it will come out of the wood work? regards
__________________
Leon Luckey

Last edited by Leon; 04-24-2011 at 12:06 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 04-24-2011, 02:24 PM
Exhibitman's Avatar
Exhibitman Exhibitman is offline
Ad@m W@r$h@w
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Beautiful Downtown Burbank
Posts: 13,044
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ls7plus View Post
1939 Salutations Exhibit Gehrig--almost certainly pulled after just a few month's issuance after his fatal illness was announced in May, 1939. The Exhibit Supply Company would not have wanted to be seen as attempting to profit from the misfortune of a doomed man.

Larry
Gehrig is difficult; Rizzo is darn near impossible. Kreevich wasn't a picnic either



Other unsung heroes:

Silhouette BG PC Back Exhibits



Coupon back 1927 Exhibits



Exhibit advertising sample cards

__________________
Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true.

https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/

Or not...
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 04-24-2011, 05:31 PM
fkw's Avatar
fkw fkw is offline
Frank Kealoha Ward
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Kea'au HI
Posts: 1,149
Default

A card that I would call very underrated...

the 1925 Holland Ice Cream #16 Roger Peckinpaugh. I "discovered" it back in 1999 (before that the checklist always had #16 as "unknown")
As far as I know there is still only 1 card known. Its in the G/VG range (see below). I sold it about 8 years ago for $3K, yet the SCD has always listed it at $2500 NRMT.
Why so low, when a similar extremely shortprinted (also 1 known) chase card from another Canadian set, the V117 Maple Crispette #15 Stengel is $18K NRMT.


Only known #16 Peckinpaugh

Last edited by fkw; 04-24-2011 at 05:32 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 04-24-2011, 09:02 PM
ValKehl's Avatar
ValKehl ValKehl is offline
Val Kehl
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Manassas, VA (DC suburb)
Posts: 3,525
Default

Hi Frank,

Thanks for reminding me of my biggest card-collecting regret - not pulling the trigger to buy the Holland Peckinpaugh card from you when I had the opportunity!
Best,
Val
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 04-24-2011, 09:08 PM
ls7plus ls7plus is offline
Larry
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Southfield, Michigan
Posts: 1,765
Default

[QUOTE=Exhibitman;889238]Gehrig is difficult; Rizzo is darn near impossible. Kreevich wasn't a picnic either

Ah, but Gehrig is Gehrig, while Rizzo is still Rizzo. The difference in perspective between a set collector and a hall-of-famer collector! Always appreciate hearing from Adam on Exhibits--very interesting cards. Adam, I am definitely waiting on the book--I guarantee I am a buyer!

Best wishes,

Larry

Last edited by ls7plus; 04-24-2011 at 09:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 04-25-2011, 09:27 AM
Touch'EmAll Touch'EmAll is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,034
Default under valued/appreciated

I have been looking a long time for 1931 W502's - no go.

The 1928 W502's, yes - but the 1931's - ouch tough
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 04-25-2011, 09:47 PM
Brian Van Horn Brian Van Horn is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 6,029
Default

100backstroke,

I'll admit the 1931 W502s are harder to come by, but they are out there. Here are recent pickups from the set for viewing only:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Scan10342.jpg (76.6 KB, 226 views)
File Type: jpg Scan10343.jpg (74.4 KB, 226 views)
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 04-25-2011, 10:55 PM
fkw's Avatar
fkw fkw is offline
Frank Kealoha Ward
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Kea'au HI
Posts: 1,149
Default

I agree on the 1931 W502's, very scarce overall, but Ive seen them a few times in larger groups on eBay, but not in a while.

PS. Funny how PSA puts "handcut" on what looks like obviously machine cut cards, just because they have a "W" name. Never seen a strip of them myself let alone a handcut one, ....Id think they are most likely a candy or ice cream issue like the related issues from a couple years earlier.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 04-26-2011, 08:01 AM
birdman42's Avatar
birdman42 birdman42 is offline
Bill T.
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Merlin, west of Bawtymore
Posts: 392
Default '31 W502s?

How do you tell the difference between the '28 and the '31 W502s?

Bill
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 04-26-2011, 10:37 AM
E93's Avatar
E93 E93 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 2,202
Default

The ones I am aware of are not yet in my collection, so I cannot say.
JimB
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 04-26-2011, 10:46 AM
HRBAKER's Avatar
HRBAKER HRBAKER is offline
Jeff
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 5,255
Default So are these '31 W502s or W-UNC?

__________________
Check out my aging Sell/Trade Album on my Profile page

HOF Type Collector + Philly A's, E/M/W cards, M101-6, Exhibits, Postcards, 30's Premiums & HOF Photos

"Assembling an unfocused collection for nearly 50 years."

Last edited by HRBAKER; 04-26-2011 at 10:47 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 04-26-2011, 11:07 AM
Brian Van Horn Brian Van Horn is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 6,029
Default

In my opinion, W502. I think the reason they were W-Unc is that when they were originally graded they couldn't be assigned to the W502s because the numbers for the 1928 set had different players in the first twenty cards.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
E121 Series of 120 rarities survey Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 24 05-17-2011 07:57 AM
Your most underappreciated cards (to outsiders) Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 47 03-15-2009 09:25 PM
My Fascination with Great Rarities Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 41 04-12-2007 03:11 PM
Which So-Called Rarities are Overrated? Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 90 02-14-2007 07:52 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:16 PM.


ebay GSB