T206 Wagner in the Mears auction

[Jim VB]

http://www.mearsonlineauctions.com/L...=25&category=2


Maybe I'm the only one who missed this earlier, but does anyone else find it unsettling who was listed as the "owner" in the back-up paperwork for this card?

Now, I realize that they were probably doing it on behalf of the consignor, and weren't the real owners, but it's troubling to me that they would do this, to an extremely valuable card, less than a year ago.


I half expect that this gets done all the time, by individuals. I don't expect that it gets done by one of the big auction houses.

[calvindog]

Egad, I shudder to think of a consignor scummy enough to have Doug Allen use his paper restoration company to alter a card post-auction.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Egad, I shudder to think of a consignor scummy enough to have Doug Allen use his paper restoration company to alter a card post-auction.

It's worse than that Jeff. This card shows two distinct work orders. The first was on 06/30/09. Then it was auctioned on 07/30/09. Then it went back in for even more work on 10/30/09.

Now, it's in Mears, with full disclosure, (which I give them credit for.)


But that means that two different consignors used Legendary to "work" on this card. Surprisingly, it still has the same PSA cert number.


If you look at the two work orders and see what was done, it's shocking.

[Anthony S.]

Took some work, but I finally located the "Before" picture of the card:

[ullmandds]

Nice Anthony! Apparently the landscape for altered high demand cards is changing...there are more than enough people who want THE CARD these days...and would rather have a doctored card with great eye appeal...over a beater! Plank too! What next...33 lajoie?

[calvindog]

Jim, I'm not surprised anymore by these guys. I'd just love to know who purportedly won the card last summer and then had Legendary send it to his butcher. It would have to be someone on the moral level of Doug which pretty much narrows the field down to a few bottom feeders.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Jim, I'm not surprised anymore by these guys. I'd just love to know who purportedly won the card last summer and then had Legendary send it to his butcher. It would have to be someone on the moral level of Doug which pretty much narrows the field down to a few bottom feeders.

You're fooling no one. We all know who won the card last summer. (In fact, I heard a rumor that he owned more than one Wagner, but that may not be true.)

Funny thing is, I don't mind his involvement. He bought the card. It's his to do with as he pleases. I just wish that a big auction house wouldn't facilitate it for him.

[calvindog]

Jim, I don't keep track of every single Wagner that gets sold believe it or not. But if it's the guy that owns 3, I mean 2, I mean 2/5 of a Wagner that he found in his couch cushions I can't say that I'm surprised.

[Peter_Spaeth]

With the full disclosure, I have no issue at all. What concerns me is how many cards in slabs with numbers this company may have worked on, whether for Mastro or others.

[JP]

PSA needs to start leaving room for asterisks on their labels...

[calvindog]

How did it get cracked out, worked on, and then end up with the same cert number?

[JP]

As an altered card does it matter? No matter what you do to it it is still authentic altered, no?

[E93]

After having three border sides added, who cares if additional work was done? I could see some not wanting to alter any card in the first place, but after major restoration like that has already been done, what is the big deal? To my eyes it does not look significantly different than it did last summer when Legendary sold it.

And who cares if the guy that bought it then wants to sell it now? It is his card; he can sell it whenever he wants. It is not a moral issue. Isn't there any real evil in the hobby we can talk about?
JimB

[calvindog]

Jim, honestly there is no evil in this hobby at all. Just stupidity.

[E93]

I think you are right Jeff.
JimB

[calvindog]

In fact there is no evil in this world at all. Just a lot of misunderstood folks trying to get by.

Now let's get back to spending more obscene money on cardboard!

[Peter_Spaeth]

I think there is a ton of evil, but this is not an example of it. Kudos to Mears for the full disclosure.

[T206Collector]

...understand the market for this kind of stuff. But to each his own.

I mean, I guess I would prefer to have this Wagner to no Wagner at all, but it would be hard for me to imagine a Wagner without restoration that I would want to own less -- maybe a blank front Wagner!

[ScottFandango]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I think there is a ton of evil, but this is not an example of it. Kudos to Mears for the full disclosure.

Mears didnt disclose it by choice,
they were forced to when PSA labeled it RESTORED...

PSA could have only labeled it Authentic, then in 5 years, nobody would know the details...Kudos for PSA for putting the word RESTORED on the flip (versus "Authentic" alone which would indicate trimming only)

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by ScottFandango

Mears didnt disclose it by choice,
they were forced to when PSA labeled it RESTORED...

PSA could have only labeled it Authentic, then in 5 years, nobody would know the details...Kudos for PSA for putting the word RESTORED on the flip (versus "Authentic" alone which would indicate trimming only)

Legendary listed it as "Restored" in their live auction last summer. Their description did a pretty good job of explaining what had been done to it. Mears went a step further and showed the actual workseets indicating exactly what had been done in two different trips to the restoration company.

I agree kudos to Mears on this point.

[fkw]

quick flipper

http://cgi.ebay.com/1909-T206-HONUS-...-/230482260203

[Jacklitsch]

Don't think its a flip as the card failed to meet reserve. Possibly the consignor trying his hand at eBay?

Current Bidding (Reserve Not Met)
Minimum Bid: $75,000.00
Final Bid(Includes Buyers Premium): $160,771.00
Number of Bids: 6

[martyogelvie]

Has there ever been a Wagner sell on ebay before? I know there was a big wooptedoo a few years back about a REAL one on ebay but can't remember the details/results of that...

[ChiefBenderForever]

Wow did someone really pay 275k for tht POS ?

[slidekellyslide]

Did you guys know that -

IT'S ALSO THE RAREST CARD ON THE PLANET.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by JohnnyHarmonica

Wow did someone really pay 275k for tht POS ?

Seller ended the listing, but I don't see anywhere that it sold.

[E93]

Originally Posted by martyogelvie

Has there ever been a Wagner sell on ebay before? I know there was a big wooptedoo a few years back about a REAL one on ebay but can't remember the details/results of that...

Officially the PSA 8 was listed on ebay and in the REA catalog simultaneously when it sold for 1.2 million about ten years ago. It did not sell through ebay and would have costed a bit more if it were bid on that way if I remember correctly.
JimB

[Matthew H]

I remember about 9-10 years ago, I think 2001, their was 75% of a Wagner that sold on ebay. It was missing alot of the bottom left side of the card. (not just the corner) I remember the bidding was up to 78,000$ When I saw the card. This auction might have happened more recently. I can't remember. ( IN case someone corrects me.)

Also does any one remember, around the same time, someone auctioned off that PSA 9 1915 Cracker Jack Joe Jackson on Ebay? I never got to see that auction end. Bidding got up to 40,000 last I saw...