selling cards

[mpduq]

why is it when you go to sell a 1950's -1960's psa 8 or 9, the buyer immediately runs to ebay to see what one sold for? why does the last one sold set the market price? what happened to the smr?

[afklin]

If you were the buyer, don't you want to buy the item at the most reasonable price, meaning the most recent market price, rather than an artificially set price such as SMR, which quite often are too high.

[fkw]

eBay is the "real world" value.... ie what it really sells for is what its worth.

SMR is not.

[Exhibitman]

Smr = pos

[novakjr]

SMR for the most part is a fictional fluff piece. It's honestly not much more than just advertising for the grading companies...It's purpose it to basically say "hey...look what your cards could sell for if you get them graded with us." In the long run, most people find these prices completely off. Don't get me wrong, I still pick up an SMR every now and then, there's usually some decent articles, but that's really about all I find it good for.

Now as far as someone checking ebay. That is the market value. Let's say SMR says something is worth $100, but cards in that grade typically sell for $50 on ebay, then that card is only worth $50.

It all boils down to, a card is only worth what people are willing to pay for it, and not what some book says.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by mpduq

why is it when you go to sell a 1950's -1960's psa 8 or 9, the buyer immediately runs to ebay to see what one sold for? why does the last one sold set the market price? what happened to the smr?

If I am selling you a '57 Mantle......and I want $1000 because SMR said it is worth that much in a 6 holder (for example, I don't know the real value or SMR value), but 3 sold on ebay, in 6 holders, in the last month for $650.....are you going to pay me $1000 because the SMR says so?

[hangman62]

As much as I enjoy the Net54 site, selling cards on this site always seems to be a back and forth, point-counterpoint -fight,
Guys are always looking for bargains/steals/ rock bottom prices/etc.. ( Not that I really blame anyone,Id want to buy someting as cheap as possible also)
But it seems it always goes back and forth about.. " wait a minute, I saw that go on ebay for XXX",.. " whoa, thats a price a collector would pay,I need to resell this item",etc.., personally Id rather see a lot more trading then selling on the site.

[k-dog]

Originally Posted by hangman62

personally Id rather see a lot more trading than selling on the site.

That doesn't really work too often either. Unfortunately, I have had several trades fall through for reasons other than the agreed on value/prices of the cards.

[novakjr]

Originally Posted by hangman62

" whoa, thats a price a collector would pay,I need to resell this item"

There's certain items that you're just not gonna be able to flip. Quick flips are few and far between. but they do exist. However, a patient "seller" isn't going to sell to another "seller" at a "sellers" buying price, when there's collectors in the mix looking to buy as well.

When I was growing up, if you wanted to trade or sell a card to a dealer, you'd be lucky to get 1/2 book. But that was really all you could do.

The days of dealers offering lowball prices for buy/trade from collectors is long gone. With the internet and ebay, everyone is a seller. Unfortunately, it's also dropped selling value down to right about what a dealer would give you back in the day.

[hangman62]

Its very rare that you see a good vintage card at an attractive price on the B S T.
I see a large % of stuff that guys are trying to sell at prices that are pretty much book value.... and cards like that can be found easily in other ways .

Most guys on this site are hard core knowledgable collectors,they know deal when they see it.
More times then not..a seller who lists a 55T Killebrew in VGEX for $100 +, doesnt get a single response.

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by novakjr

The days of dealers offering lowball prices for buy/trade from collectors is long gone. With the internet and ebay, everyone is a seller. Unfortunately, it's also dropped selling value down to right about what a dealer would give you back in the day.

The internet has leveled the playing field, and I consider that to be a good thing.

Sellers will always want to sell at the highest price they can get.

Buyers will always want to buy at the lowest price they can get.

It's always been that way, but now the internet gives (both sides) more options, with the seller having far more than they did "back in the day".

I made an offer on an ebay item today for less than 20% of the BIN price, the seller responded with an offer of 25%. I took the deal, and I assume the seller made a profit, if not, oh well, bummer for him.

My point being, it couldn't hurt for both of us to ask for the numbers we started with, and ultimately we made a deal, which we are both (hopefully) happy with.

Doug

[novakjr]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

The internet has leveled the playing field, and I consider that to be a good thing.

I agree. I think it's a damn good thing. As a kid, there was nothing worse than finding a card you wanted at the local shop, then deciding which cards from your collection that you wanted to trade in towards it, only to find that he offers you $6 in trade for a mint card that booked at $40, and then the next time you go in, he's selling it for $35.

Experiences like that, are the kind of thing that drove people away from the industry. Now I think I know why I stopped collecting when I was 13, and then started again 6 years ago when I started buying off the net.

[MilBraves]

If a consumer doesn't shop around for the best price, that person is foolish. If a seller doesn't adjust his prices based on market value, that person is just as foolish(or so wealthy they don't care if their item sells )

[Exhibitman]

When trading I try really hard not to go down the path of "what is it worth?" when discussing the trade with the counterparty. IMHO that is a counter-productive route to take no matter what because someone will inevitably feel shorted.

[hangman62]

I agree its counterproductive when trying to trade,..asking "whats it worth"," or "what did you pay for it". If two collectors are trading cards, an agreed apon price guide should be used,and cards graded and valued properly per guidelines.
There are quite a few internet card trading clubs around ( OBC,VCT,OCT,etc) which only allow trading of cards. True collectors could really enjoy these sites

Regarding selling cards on Net54, again I feel most guys are wasting their time listing cards for sale at the priices they do. All you need to do is go to that section and see how many posts go unanswered..and then " price lowered" or " bumped".and yet still doesnt even get a response

[ChiefBenderForever]

Was smr ever relevant ?

[ALR-bishop]

never to me

[steve B]

First let me say that my comments are not at all against David, and that I agree with some of what he says.

Maybe it's because I spent way too much time hanging out at a dealers, and did some work for a dealer in another hobby, but I'm often surprised by how little many collectors know about how the cards get to them.

For a very long time, dealers could buy the individual cards wholesale. Probably still can for a lot of cards. So if you were willing to spend a lot on a certain card it could be had for very little. Especially if you pre-ordered before the cards arrived. A small order was 20 vending cases, 240,000 cards. Or for a late 80's early 90's set roughly 300 of each. Big wholesalers bought much more, probably hundreds of cases. Even older cards could be ordered by the hundred from a few people who had been around a long time. So for most cards there was no reason a business would pay more than wholesale, no matter what the book value was. Especially if they already had a hundred or so put aside.

And the book value is usually unrealistic. Usually wildly unrealistic. Having tried to sell at flea markets, shows, and Ebay, getting book value just doesn't happen. Maybe on certain "hot" cards, but everything else will sit in inventory for a long time. Unlike regular retail where the concern is how quickly the inventory turns over, hobby retail is more about if it will ever sell. Last time I was at the stamp shop I did some work for I found a couple stamps that I'd priced. In 1985! And all that has to generate enough to keep the lights lit and feed the shopkeeper. It's not an easy job, and that's part of why so many places eventually closed.

One guy I used to go to turned inventory pretty quickly- or so it seemed. He just rotated his display case cards roughly monthly. When I expresed some disappointment that a card I'd considered had sold, he got it out of a drawer under the case. Nearly all of the same cards were there again a year later.
And a year after that he was closed.

The internet has been a great equalizer, and it's really let everyone see just how much of some stuff is out there. Which has killed values as it should have.

We all get down on dealers for the lowball offers, but without them we'd have less to buy. Often a dealer is the only one A) willing to buy an entire collection AND B) Able to buy an entire collection. I'd love to buy collections and deal the duplicates, but I just don't have the money to tie up for that long.

Steve B

Originally Posted by novakjr

I agree. I think it's a damn good thing. As a kid, there was nothing worse than finding a card you wanted at the local shop, then deciding which cards from your collection that you wanted to trade in towards it, only to find that he offers you $6 in trade for a mint card that booked at $40, and then the next time you go in, he's selling it for $35.

Experiences like that, are the kind of thing that drove people away from the industry. Now I think I know why I stopped collecting when I was 13, and then started again 6 years ago when I started buying off the net.

[Doug]

Originally Posted by novakjr

I agree. I think it's a damn good thing. As a kid, there was nothing worse than finding a card you wanted at the local shop, then deciding which cards from your collection that you wanted to trade in towards it, only to find that he offers you $6 in trade for a mint card that booked at $40, and then the next time you go in, he's selling it for $35.

Experiences like that, are the kind of thing that drove people away from the industry. Now I think I know why I stopped collecting when I was 13, and then started again 6 years ago when I started buying off the net.

It sounds like looking at the Buy It Now prices a lot of dealers have on eBay. They can have a $100 card listed with a $150 BIN and most likely they bought it for $50. The same overpriced cards have been on there so long it's starting to look like an online museum instead of a place where you can actually buy anything at a reasonable price.

[Railroad Bill]

Bought the guide to find out book value. It seems like everyone refers to book value on cards. There are 2 prices for each card. I assume that the lowest is what you can sell it for and the highest is what you would pay a dealer. Is that correct?

Also, it doesn't say anything in the book about the grade of the card that is priced. Anyone know what grade the priced cards are?

In my opinion, book isn't done very well.

Thanks,

[novakjr]

Originally Posted by Railroad Bill

Bought the guide to find out book value. It seems like everyone refers to book value on cards. There are 2 prices for each card. I assume that the lowest is what you can sell it for and the highest is what you would pay a dealer. Is that correct?

Also, it doesn't say anything in the book about the grade of the card that is priced. Anyone know what grade the priced cards are?

In my opinion, book isn't done very well.

Thanks,

High book is supposed to be what you could expect to pay at most, low book is what you could expect to find it at it's cheapest. I do know alot of people that treat it how you mentioned though, as far as buying/selling with a dealer. It's all in each individuals perspective.

If you're talking about Beckett, it doesn't refer to any specific grade. There should be a chart at the beginning of the prices section that'll give you percentages based on grade for those prices. It's been a while but modern NM cards should be 100%, different eras will be different though. It really doesn't matter because actual value in most instances is somewhere in the middle.

For older stuff, I'd suggest picking up the SCD Standard Catalog. Their modern prices are hit and miss(that's to be expected with so much crap to price though). I looked up a modern card in it the other day. You'd have a hard time convincing me that the 1990 Donruss Best NL Larry Walker card is only worth 5 cents.

For modern stuff, you are better off with the Beckett, once you figure out how to decipher it.

[HRBAKER]

I would disagree to the extent that I have found several fairly priced cards for sale on the BST over the years. There ususally exists a difference between the pricing on cards from Net54 Members that are regular posters/contributors and those that solely use the site to flip/sell cards. There approach seems to be along the ebay BIN line.

[novakjr]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

I would disagree to the extent that I have found several fairly priced cards for sale on the BST over the years. There ususally exists a difference between the pricing on cards from Net54 Members that are regular posters/contributors and those that solely use the site to flip/sell cards. There approach seems to be along the ebay BIN line.

I've only been on here a month, and from what I've seen, I can completely agree 100%.

[yankeeno7]

Isnt it normal to want to get best price as both buyer and seller? It boils down to a meeting of the minds/wallet. If a person wants more than what an item generally sells for, maybe there is a reason for it but more than likely it will stay in his collection and he is fine with that. The buyer is left looking elsewhere or possibly even over paying.

[FUBAR]

I find guys here are usually more then reasonable with their prices. The ones that aren't usually go unsold. I've missed more cards on the BST because i wasn't fast enough then i ever thought was way over priced!