Clemente Signature Value

[ruth-gehrig]

Hi,
I'm trying to figure out the potential value of this Clemente (among many others) signed program is if I had it verified by PSA or Spence. I think there is 26 sigs in total but the Clemente is the big one. Thanks!!

[GrayGhost]

Well, its not on a Pirates program, but is still a really sharp sig. Someone may want to make a cut out of it. I think its fine too, genuine .

300.00 ??? Im guessing. Interested in other opinions.

[old13man]

I would pay $300 in a heartbeat for an authentic Clemente. I am thinking more in the upwards of 750-1000 would be the value.

[GrayGhost]

Originally Posted by old13man

I would pay $300 in a heartbeat for an authentic Clemente. I am thinking more in the upwards of 750-1000 would be the value.

wow. I guess Im way off. Good for the seller then. Reminds me I once had a signed 1970 topps of Clemente paid a hundred, sold it for the same, when I was desperate. Wish I had that one back. NO COA , but you could tell it was good.

[travrosty]

it probably has its future as a cut, and i would agree it would be upper hundreds.

[travrosty]

if the main value of the piece is the clemente, then just have the clemente authenticated if you must have authentication for it. because thats the only sig people are going to be gunning for on this piece. don't spend any more on any of the other signatures. best yet just have some experienced people in the hobby give their opinions and skip spence and psa in my opinion.

travis roste

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by travrosty

if the main value of the piece is the clemente, then just have the clemente authenticated if you must have authentication for it. because thats the only sig people are going to be gunning for on this piece. don't spend any more on any of the other signatures. best yet just have some experienced people in the hobby give their opinions and skip spence and psa in my opinion.

travis roste

For starters, you can't just have one signature authenticated on a multi-signed piece.

Secondly, apparently you have never heard of Jim Umbricht.

[HRBAKER]

JMO, that is not going to make a very attractive cut and it would be a shame to cut up that piece.

[travrosty]

Well another reason not to send it in to jsa then. i have seen both psa and other companies "authenticate" multisigned pieces with 30 signatures or more on it even though there is no way they can "authenticate" all the signatures.

Some of the signatures are of players or people that were never famous, either minor league or less, so there are no exemplars to "authenticate" these names or even to know who these people actually are, yet the entire signed program or autograph book gets "authenticated" anyway.

You tell me how that happens?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/OLD-TIMERS-D...item53e2c9b234

here is an example. 54 signatures from an old timers boxing program. ALL the signatures "authenticated" by psa. HOW? I have also seen a PSA "authenticated" piece of Vancouver olympic winter athletes, many obscure but also signed by many paralympic athletes from the paralympic games. I am sure they have exemplars of all the paralympic athletes in their files. Give me a break. They "authenticated" all the signatures on the multisigned piece, but they really didn't "authenticate" them, did they?

As far as this old timers boxing program goes, many are the names of local or regional boxers of NO note. The old and experienced boxing collectors and dealers have NEVER heard of many of these names. No one knows who they are, yet the signatures are "authenticated". It is an inherent problem with the authenticators, giving a blanket authentication to names no one has even heard of.

If it is not about authenticating the signatures, each and every one individually, then what it is about?


I am not saying that in this case all the signatures can't be identified and authenticated, but it doesn't really matter. If they can't find an exemplar for one or two or five, the whole thing with all the signatures gets "authenticated" anyway. Seen it a million times.

If they don't want to authenticate 1 signature on a multisigned piece, ask them why not? And if they don't want to help you, don't patronize their business. Find someone who recognizes a customer for who they are, which is a valuable person who isn't required to shop at any one certain place.

Now please shoot me, the messenger, for bringing this to light.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by travrosty

Some of the signatures are of players or people that were never famous, either minor league or less, so there are no exemplars to "authenticate" these names or even to know who these people actually are, yet the entire signed program or autograph book gets "authenticated" anyway.

.

Hmm, I'm not seeing any non-major leaguers on the piece in question. The scan is not high definition, but all that can be viewed by me were most assuredly major league alumni.

It's probably best to focus on the issue at hand (the Pirates program). Throwing something else into the discussion to further a point of view that seems rooted more in bias and hyperbole than in actual knowledge may not be the best option here. Perhaps a new thread should be started?

[ruth-gehrig]

Thanks JBirkholm! I guess Jim Umbricht sig is pretty difficult. I knew autographs weren't my area. His autograph is just as clear and bold as the Clemente. Yeah I would hate to see the program cut up but once again realize that's possibly how an autograph collector may see it. The man I got this piece from grew up in Denver in the 1960s. His mother worked at the Denver Bears stadium(in the front office I think) and this guy didn't have much of a male influence in his life growing up. One day his mother brought him into the dugout while all the players(Pirates) were on the field practicing. She said come here I want to show you "something". The "something" being all the players. He was 7 years old at the time but all the players signed this program for him. I'm not sure why the other program is a different color. Anyways I appreciate all the info thus far and thought I need to share that bit of information. Thanks Again, Michael

[jt39]

If you really need/want to sell the Clemente as a cut, you could possibly do a high-res scan of the portion being cut and produce a high-quality print to replace it. While it wouldn't be perfect, it would allow you to display the piece in largely complete form.

[ruth-gehrig]

I don't think I would personally cut this piece although that's not to say a future owner of it wouldn't. I believe there's got to be collectors out there that would appreciate it as a whole. But like I said I don't know much about autographs or how collectors prefer to collect them.