my holy grail! - Crosley Field Flag

[wmullis]

A week ago I didn't even know this existed but as soon as I seen it come up for auction I knew it was something I had to have. Being a Reds collector I don't know of a piece of memorabilia that I could ever own to top this. There are many things that could cost me more but the fact it is one of a kind and the sheer size is certainly going to be the focal point of my collection. I already have a section of Crosley Field seats that will compliment this flag and have decided to dedicate an entire wall of my basement to Crosley Field era memorabilia. The description of the auction is below, I may try to get in touch with the Reds Hall of Fame to see what else they can tell me about this peice.

"Fantastic piece of Cincinnati Reds memorabilia: large Cincinnati pennant flown over Crosley Field as the League Standings flag - NOTE SIZE. This flag actually flew over Crosley Field as you entered the stadium to represent the clubs standings in the Division. It dates to the 1940's to early 1950's and resided in the Cincinnati Reds Hall of Fame until recently. There are several 'team repairs'on the flag and it has been well used. It is however wind tattered and shows signs of use and wear. Size: 106" x 55""

Anybody have a picture of the entrance to Crosley that may show this flag?

[thekingofclout]

Congrats on landing such an important piece for your collection. I love every thing about it too. I mean 106" x 55" WoW! Also love the worn-out look of it. All the repairs and the wind damage just scream Authentic! Really makes you wonder how much history that flag has seen and been a part of. You better post some photos once that puppy hits your wall.

[Jcfowler6]

Really nice item.

I poked around a bit for something with a picture and didn't find anything definite. I did find this cool site though.

http://www.ohiomemory.org/cdm4/resul...7401coll34&t=s

[deebro041]

Great score! Isn't it exciting when something comes up that you just gotta have...almost obsessive! That would look great with your stadium seats!
Dan

[wmullis]

Thanks guys. Going to be able to pick it up tomorrow, can't wait to see it in person. Obviously, the challenge is going to be how to hang it.

If anybody has any ideas I would love to hear them...

[wmullis]

Got the flag tonight and made some room on the wall for it's new home. I threw it up quickly and snapped a quick photo with my phone. It has been taken down and I hope to have a more permanent rig to more adequately display it and keep it safe from any further damage. I think it is even more of an awesome piece now that I see it in all of it's vintage glory, it certainly has a few stories it could tell. I hope to get in touch with the Reds HOF to see what if anything they can tell me about it and potentially the exact years it flew over Crosley.

[GrayGhost]

Damage or no, that is such an awesome piece. wow

[HRBAKER]

I'll second that!
Awesome score!
Congrats!

[mr2686]

I actually think the damage really adds something to this...kinda like a tattered flag during the American Revolution. Great pickup.

[Scott Garner]

Awesome Reds flag!! It looks great over those vintage Crosley seats. A real eye catcher!

[mschwade]

Originally Posted by wmullis

Got the flag tonight and made some room on the wall for it's new home. I threw it up quickly and snapped a quick photo with my phone. It has been taken down and I hope to have a more permanent rig to more adequately display it and keep it safe from any further damage. I think it is even more of an awesome piece now that I see it in all of it's vintage glory, it certainly has a few stories it could tell. I hope to get in touch with the Reds HOF to see what if anything they can tell me about it and potentially the exact years it flew over Crosley.

That does look great! Congrats. Which auction house did you buy that from?

[steve B]

Congrats on picking up a really cool item!

I have a thought about display/care. My wife collects some vintage textiles, and the fragile stuff is often carefully stitched to a linen backing to prevent further damage. I'm thinking that could work well for this flag.

Steve B

[mschwade]

Originally Posted by steve B

Congrats on picking up a really cool item!

I have a thought about display/care. My wife collects some vintage textiles, and the fragile stuff is often carefully stitched to a linen backing to prevent further damage. I'm thinking that could work well for this flag.

Steve B

In your original photo, Cincinnati is spelled correctly, in the one on your basement wall, it looks like there is an I before the T. Maybe it's just the way its hanging.

[redmansam]

For similar banners, I had a local plastic bag mfgr. make a rectangular "pennant sleeve" for me. I got (2) 1x4's, cut them just short of the distance between the two grommets on the spine of the banner, clamped them together and then drilled 1/4" holes approx. 6" apart the length of the boards at 1" below the edge. Then I placed the banner inside the "sleeve", overlapped the plastic at the spine, inserted the enclosed banner between the two boards and clamped the boards together with 1/4" bolts, flat washers on both sides, a lock washer and nut on the back. Then I took two small eyelets, screwed them into the boards approx. 12" from each end. ran framing wire from eyelet to eyelet with slack and hung the banner on the wall.
This way there is no pressure on the body of the banner and since the "sleeve "is not longer than the banner, the bottom can't go anywhere.
Hope this helps and enjoy, Len

[ullmandds]

That's awesome...looks great above the seats!!!! Congrats!

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by redmansam

For similar banners, I had a local plastic bag mfgr. make a rectangular "pennant sleeve" for me. I got (2) 1x4's, cut them just short of the distance between the two grommets on the spine of the banner, clamped them together and then drilled 1/4" holes approx. 6" apart the length of the boards at 1" below the edge. Then I placed the banner inside the "sleeve", overlapped the plastic at the spine, inserted the enclosed banner between the two boards and clamped the boards together with 1/4" bolts, flat washers on both sides, a lock washer and nut on the back. Then I took two small eyelets, screwed them into the boards approx. 12" from each end. ran framing wire from eyelet to eyelet with slack and hung the banner on the wall.
This way there is no pressure on the body of the banner and since the "sleeve "is not longer than the banner, the bottom can't go anywhere.
Hope this helps and enjoy, Len

Len:

You lost me a bit with that description, but sounds like a nifty solution. I guess I'm a more visual person... could you possibly attach a photo of what you did?

[wmullis]

here is the foundation of how I am going to display the flag. My idea was similar to what Len suggested. I am still considering sandwiching the flag between two pieces of plexiglass or something similar. The flag just seems so fragile and having it exposed is beginning to make me nervous. The wood along the top edge should distribute the weight evenly and it doesn't weigh much but I am still concerned.

[perezfan]

Nice solution! It looks great and displays even better that way. You can now clearly read the word "Cincinnati". Plus, the even distribution of weight will help to avoid any further tearing.

As for sandwiching between plastic sheets... there are pros and cons...

Pro:
It would further protect the flag.
Not sure what material it's made of (or if moths might be an issue). But I feel lots better when my pennants are framed/protected/immobilized

Con:
You might lose the soft/tactile qualities intrinsic to the flag.
This thing was made to wave and flap in the wind. You can really grasp that feeling better when it's draped on the wall (as opposed to sandwiched between plastic).

I like the solution you pictured, but if protection/preservation is your primary concern, then you should probably encase it. All comes down to personal preference.

Either way... a great acquisition!
Mark

[steve B]

Preservation of stuff like this is actually done by stitching it to linen or silk. It's done with very fine thread and a stitch every few inches. That supports the fragile cloth. Attached to a linen backing the flag would still drape right, but would be stabilized enough that the tears etc woldn't get worse.

One supplier of the cloth, there are many others
http://apps.webcreate.com/ecom/catal...goryFullID=175


A description of the process is here
http://www.ischool.utexas.edu/~cochi...-textiles.html

Mounting
Items that are fragile, frequently handled, or destined for display might benefit from lining or mounting before being stored. Due to the fact that this involves sewing the object onto a fabric support, this should only be done with the professional assistance of a textile specialist. Improper mounting can cause significant damage over time due to mechanical stress and weakening of yarns in places where the stitches are made. Fairly detailed instructions are given here to aid in identifying any improper mounts that may be already be present. These should be professionally removed before they cause distortion or damage.

The material chosen for the support fabric should be identical or very similar to the textile material so that it will shrink or expand at the same rate as the piece being supported. The support fabric should also be pre-washed and shrunk before use. Threads may be silk, nylon, mercerized cotton, or a yarn pulled from the same kind of fabric being used for lining. Finer threads are usually preferable. Very thin curved needles are normally used for sewing and have less potential for damaging any yarns of the textile object while sewing.

The stitching can be done in two ways. One method is to sew one-half to three-fourth inch long stitches in rows starting at the center of piece and continuing through the entire piece. This allows for even weight distribution across several yarns for each stitch (King, 1985). The other method is to only sew only around the edge of the piece using stitches that are perpendicular to the object. This method is illustrated in figure 3 of Appendix B and is usually used for small, fragile pieces that are being mounted to a fabric-covered paperboard or hard board. If this method is used, the board should be acid free and non-rubber based glue should be used to attach the cloth on the backside of the board only. Before the cloth is attached to the board, the corners can be mitered to assure a better fit. The cloth should be kept square to the board and attached before the object is sewn on to prevent the stitches from pulling holes in the textile object (Landi, 1998). In both mounting systems, the stitches should be loose enough so that the older textile is not strained, but tight enough so that the mounted textile will not move or abrade on the mounting (Landi, 1998 and King, 1985).

If a textile is so fragile that mounting with a needle and thread could potentially cause damage, the sandwich method of mounting may be used. In this method a backing material is stretched over a frame with the fragile textile placed on top. Then, crepeline-silk or polyester netting is placed over the textile and either sewn to the backing material or attached to the frame (King, 1985). Note that a textile should never be directly mounted in an open frame. Objects framed like this are subject to a great deal of mechanical stress. The will also age unevenly because the parts of the textile that are protected by the frame will not age as quickly as the parts that are open to the air (Landi, 1998).

I've helped my wife conserve a few items this way, and it isn't as hard as it sounds. Time consuming, but not hard. And the results are really nice.

Steve B