M116 300 Subjects back scarcity

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Posted By: barrysloate

I'm sure this has been discussed before, but are all M116 with the "300 subjects" backs from the scarce high number series? If so, how much tougher are they than the lower series cards?

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Posted By: Mark

In my opinion you do see less of the OVER 300 Subjects and they are from the scarce series. I have seen a few Eddie Collins and Mathewson, Cobb with the scarce back but most are listed with PSA as SS commons in the SMR price. A few cards are only from the SS and not with any other back that are seldom seen. The cards listed as SS get double the price of other backs. hope that helps.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Thanks Mark. The card I picked up was in fact Eddie Collins.

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Posted By: Tim Newcomb

Hi Barry,

Bob M. and I are "working" on a long-awaited (by us, anyway) article on M116 which I hope will explain fully the anomalous 300 Subjects cards (like Collins). Suffice to say for now that they are very scarce compared to the other backs of those players, despite not being in the "high series". And all the high-series cards are vastly more scarce than the lower ones. Any other questions, contact me directly

Best wishes,
Tim

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Posted By: barrysloate

I would gladly contact you directly Tim, but board discussion is always useful (unless you are saving all your secrets for the article). When I looked up the Collins I noticed the minor league series, and assumed they are tougher too. Also, what was disappointing is neither Beckett nor Krause lists the M116 by series- one does it alphabetically and the other by team. Why not list them the way they were issued?

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Posted By: scott brockelman

Barry,

There are many of the cards not in the high series that can be found with the 300 series back, Cobb and Collins are few regularly found that way, as to how many were printed later I am not sure, I am sure Tim can expound on that.

As to the cataloguing, I am fairly certain that the publishers may not know exactly who is in each series. Existing lists are incorrect. Tim and I went over this a couple of years ago by using the large ad premiums which list the teams by series, BUT, there are also changes on the glassine envelopes that indicate some differences as well.

Scott

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Posted By: barrysloate

Thanks Scott- I guess Tim and Bob will reveal some of these mysteries. So what I am gathering is a Collins with a 300 back is no rarer than any other card in the set? I actually won the Mastro lot that also had the Matty and the Plank, and each of the three has a different ad. I also know some can be found in either blue or black print.

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Posted By: Richard Masson

For some reason, I was compelled to buy a large group of series envelopes from a Lipset auction years ago. The players are listed on the envelope for each series.

The cards (or certain cards) were also issued together as team sets, so rarity may not be as straightforward as older series cards all being more rare than lower series ones. Certain low number series cards may have been left out of team sets, for example.

Certain stars or series may have been double printed to fill demand and player team changes were made late in runs (MCQuillen, Seymour, etc.).
A comprehensive study of the set and its distribution would be fascinating, if that is what Tim is working on. When will your article be ready?

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Posted By: Mark L

Tim,
I have a few of these cards and am wondering when you will be publishing the results of your research.

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Posted By: Tim Newcomb

Mark,
It will be a little while as Bob and I have been engaged in some other projects (like moving house, making a living, etc.). If you'd like to email me, we can share some information--

Best,
Tim

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Posted By: Patrick McMenemy

Here's my lone example of a Sporting Life M116 300 Subjects back.



Patrick