Ebay image dilemma

[chadeast]

Here are two copies of a card that I'm actively looking to purchase, both from high profile ebay sellers that we all know. For me, color and sharpness on this card are as important, or even more important than corners or centering. It's just my thing, on '33 Goudeys especially. And that makes buying such a high dollar card on the internet really tough. For example, is the card on the left really more faded than the card on the right, or is it just scanner differences? Or did one seller use Photoshop to artificially increase color saturation? The flip can give this away sometimes when the scan is clearly "enhanced", but often the differences are subtle enough that I just don't know. I wonder if anyone else struggles with this and has perhaps found ways to work around it.

My current solution to this is that I just take a chance, when the card is not too expensive. But that doesn't work here.

Thanks for any tips you might have.

[cornhusker]

For the money that I suspect they are asking- you could ask for several additional photos under different light. And, simply ask it a filter or any image saturation tweeking occured and express your concern. One would need to trust they are honest w their reply but probably not a good idea to do business w someone anyway if you don't trust their word. -jim hoffer

[JollyElm]

It seems pretty clear to me that the card on the right (for honesty's sake, I will state that I eliminate PWCC from every single ebay search I do) was sharpened in photoshop. Doesn't mean it was reworked, but maybe the tone, brightness, color balance, etc., plus other factors, were adjusted to maximize the look. The card on the left looks more of a 'normal' scan (possibly without a CCD element?), which I'm sure many high-volume sellers use.

If you have a scanner, scan in another 1933 Goudey that you believe has the sharpness that you love, and see if it looks (very) similar to either of the images you've highlighted. That may help tell you what the card on the left 'really' looks like.

[CobbSpikedMe]

The SGC slab looks lighter than a normal SGC slab so I would guess the colors on the actual card are a little brighter than in the scan. But whether or not they are a nice as the other one, well I can't tell.

[Bigdaddy]

Is there anything to be learned by looking at the color of the borders? I'm not familiar enough with these to know how much variance is typical in the colors of the borders, so someone else can chime in.

The borders look a bit red in the scan on the right, at least in comparison to the left scan's borders.

[Pat R]

Here are a couple of scans and a cell phone picture of the SGC 70 from
past sales including a pwcc scan for comparison.


1.jpg

2.jpg

3.jpg


and here's the PSA 4 when it sold in an REA auction

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com...e?itemid=65440

[chadeast]

Borders vary widely in my experience. Some are almost white, while some are quite yellowed. Honestly, the best luck I've had in the past is with looking at the black of the SGC slab. Sometimes its greenish, and often those cards end up looking better in person than in the listing. Any tone or brightness of the black area can indicate similar variations on the card itself.

There may be much to be learned by the red of the PSA label, which should be pretty standardized, but I don't have enough experience there to make any conclusions.

The tough part is that scanners (and cameras) vary widely, and there are big differences in the output of one to another. I agree that asking for additional scans under different light is a good idea. Then again, some sellers don't even take the time to list a description of a 5 figure card!

[chadeast]

Originally Posted by Pat R

Here are a couple of scans and a cell phone picture of the SGC 70 from
past sales including a pwcc scan for comparison.


Attachment 446711

Attachment 446712

Attachment 446713


and here's the PSA 4 when it sold in an REA auction

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com...e?itemid=65440

Thanks! I forgot to mention VCP. It is probably the best tool I've found for high dollar cards, if other sales can be found. There's always Google search as well. Your post highlights the challenge. I think that the SGC card in question is perhaps not being presented as well as I would want it to be if I were the consignor.

[chadeast]

I just had a thought. If I can find the truest green for that SGC label, I can guess which image looks most true to life for the SGC card. I just pulled 4 older style SGC slabs out and looked at the green on the label. I am looking at four different shades of green! So much for that idea.

[Gorditadogg]

I've bought plenty of cards from both of them. I read that PWCC does adjust the settings on their scanner to make the cards more realistic, they used to look filmy.

PWCC will respond to your questions and probably will provide more pictures. I doubt you will hear back from Probstein, I never had any luck getting him to answer questions. He did offer a quick refund to me when I thought a raw Jordan I bought was overgraded.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[perezfan]

To simplify... Just look closely at the 2 flips. As much as I don't care for either dealer, I would go after the SGC copy.

The flip on the PWCC copy is bright and vibrant. And the lettering is crisp and in perfect focus.

The flip on the SCG copy appears faded, darker and out of focus. The lettering is much more blurry than the PSA flip. So it's safe to say that the SCG card is in better condition than the image portrays. The card's color, brightness and focus have all been compromised by the poor photo.

I have tested this theory out a lot with poorly photographed cards bought from eBay. Nothing as valuable as the Goudey Ruth, but when the actual card arrives, it has always been a pleasant surprise.

I don't trust anything that PWCC says or does, but putting all of that aside, I would ask them about visible creases or surface wrinkles. Often surface creases will not show up in scans, or can be edited out. It is very possible the PSA 4 has a crease, whereas the SCG 70 definitely will not.

Hope this is helpful.

[chadeast]

Originally Posted by perezfan

To simplify... Just look closely at the 2 flips. As much as I don't care for either dealer, I would go after the SGC copy.

The flip on the PWCC copy is bright and vibrant. And the lettering is crisp and in perfect focus.

The flip on the SCG copy appears faded, darker and out of focus. The lettering is much more blurry than the PSA flip. So it's safe to say that the SCG card is in better condition than the image portrays. The card's color, brightness and focus have all been compromised by the poor photo.

I have tested this theory out a lot with poorly photographed cards bought from eBay. Nothing as valuable as the Goudey Ruth, but when the actual card arrives, it has always been a pleasant surprise.

I don't trust anything that PWCC says or does, but putting all of that aside, I would ask them about visible creases or surface wrinkles. Often surface creases will not show up in scans, or can be edited out. It is very possible the PSA 4 has a crease, whereas the SCG 70 definitely will not.

Hope this is helpful.

Thanks, I agree with you RE being pleasantly surprised by those cards. What I said about being disappointed as the consignor... scratch that. $35,655.55
Just wow.