Congratulations!

[Archive]

Posted By: Matt Goebel

It was long overdue

[Archive]

Posted By: Ryan Christoff

What, exactly, does that have to do with Ted Simmons being better than Gary Carter?

-Ryan

[Archive]

Posted By: Chad

Carter had Torriente's power but Simmons had his speed?

What would be really cool is to see cards of all the 7 enshrinees that have them. I wish i could post my Ray Brown and Willard Brown, but I'm at work, and my versions are crappy anyway. But I have 'em! The Denia Ray Brown would be excellent to see!

--Chad

[Archive]

Posted By: Chad

How cool is it that he's in the HOF and Jeff Heath isn't. Pretty cool, I think.

--Chad

[Archive]

Posted By: warshawlaw

Brown went to the majors in 1947. He did not have a bat. He took a discarded bat of Heath's (the knob had broken off) and used it. He homered, the first by a black in the AL. When he returned to the bench, the racist P.O.S. Heath took back "his" bat and shattered it against the dugout wall.

[Archive]

Posted By: Brad

WOW! that just.....

[Archive]

Posted By: Mark

Heath's in the Canadian Baseball HOF.

[Archive]

Posted By: howard

I guess there are so few outstanding players born in Canada that they can't afford to have a morals requirement for election. Next to Larry Walker I think Heath is about the best hitter they have (to my surprise even Jacgues Fournier was born in the U.S.).

[Archive]

Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Willard Brown was one of the greatest home run hitters of all time, which made it only fitting that he was the first black man to homer in the American League. Ironically, it was an inside-the-park home run.

Still, I fail to see what this has to do with whether or not Kirby Puckett got 2,000 hits in his first 10 years. Stay focused people, please! There's already been 6 or 7 posts in this thread and no one has whined about Effa Manley getting in or Buck O'Neil not getting in.

-Ryan

P.S. I didn't know there was a Canadian Baseball Hall of F**kers.

[Archive]

Posted By: Elliot

Oh sure, now pick on Canadians...how prejudiced is that? What does Heath's nationality have to do with anything?

[Archive]

Posted By: Mark

I sense a lot of prejudice in this thread. It's precisely this type of thinking that's lead to the Cooperstown's underrepresentation of Canucks.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bob

Gee Ryan, hate to see you disappointed. How's this: Effa Manley's selection is a joke, Buck O'Neill's non-selection is a travesty. OK, now you feel better, huh?

[Archive]

Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

Ryan, do you know why Willard Brown only lasted a few months in the majors? According to baseballreference.com he was only 32 when he made his debut.

[Archive]

Posted By: howard

Willard Brown was frustrated by what he thought was a losing attitude on the Browns and was scornful of their lack of talent. This combined with the racism he faced and his own poor play caused him to leave the majors. Apparantly it was his decision. There was also a question as to his real age although after leaving the Browns he proved that he was still a quality ball player.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

[Archive]

Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Gee tbob,

Thanks for helping. I do feel better. But humor me for a moment and tell me about Effa Manley. What have you discovered about her in your research? I happen to agree with you the Manley shouldn't have gotten in and Buck O'Neil should have. I also feel that all of the players that got in are more Hall-worthy than Buck. So are Dick Redding, John Beckwith, Grant Johnson, and several other players who DID NOT get in. Buck should have gotten in. AFTER the rest of the candidates that are more deserving.

Buck O'Neil may literally be the nicest man the game of baseball has ever seen. That's not hyperbole, either. Truly humble, kind, warm, intelligent, and incredibly charming. In my opinion, those are not reasons why he should be in the Hall of Fame. He should be in for the totality of his baseball life: player, manager, coach, scout, ambassador. Add those up and he is a HOFer to me. Still, there are many others that are more deserving.

Sentimentality shouldn't be the criteria used in casting a vote for the Hall. I applaud the members of the committee for resisting that temptation and taking their vote seriously. It shows me that this election process was not tainted by the political b.s. that so many of the old veteran's committees were ruined by and which wound up electing most of the current HOFers that many consider unworthy.

Here are a few questions for you which will be ignored and remain unanswered:

1. Why is Andy Cooper more deserving than Dick Redding? If he's not, please explain why you're not outraged. Or do you need Keith Olbermann to give you the green light?

2. Why is Cum Posey more deserving than Gus Greenlee? If he's not, please explain why you're not outraged.

3. Why is Ben Taylor more deserving than John Beckwith? If he's not, please explain why you're not outraged.

4. Why is Jose Mendez more deserving than George Stovey? If he's not, please explain why you're not outraged.

5. Why is Raymond Brown more deserving than John Donaldson? If he's not, please explain why you're not outraged.

6. Which inductees are less deserving than Buck O'Neil. Manley is one. Who else?

7. Please rank the 39 candidates in order from most deserving to least deserving. I'll post my list after you post yours. I'll be happy to answer any questions you have about why I ranked them the way I did.

Now I guess I'll hold my breath and wait for you to answer.

-Ryan

[Archive]

Posted By: identify7

Maybe born too late for a Negro League team, but I vote for Curt Flood over all of them. Eventhough I realize that Pete Rose will be enshrined before him. Or actually, it will be a tie for never.

Not "Truly humble, kind, warm, intelligent, and incredibly charming", but very effective, confident, capable and right.

[Archive]

Posted By: Chad

The big picture being that Ray Brown, Cristobal Torriente, Jud Wilson, Pete Hill, Biz Mackey, Louis Santop and so on are LEGITIMATE HOFers by any standard and now they are. The selections at the back end of the ballot are iffy, and yeah, maybe Lip Pike and Tony Mullane and George Van Haltren and Dummy Hoy (a personal favorite of mine because I have a deaf brother)should be in. I also have warm fuzzies for Curt Flood and Marvin Miller for sticking it to the man. I can think of a LOT more players/pioneers that could be elected. Ron Santo, Goose Gossage, Minnie Minoso, Joe Gordon, Charlie Finley, Gil Hodges, Lave Cross etc etc/ But now there are a few LESS players that need to be enshrined and a few of the obvious oversights have been fixed. This is a good thing.

Just for kicks, the MLB players I equate some of the inductees with:

Ray Brown: Warren Spahn
Torriente: Reggie Jackson with a glove made of leather instead of iron and a decent pitcher
Jud Wilson: Somewhere between Musial and Ted Williams as a hitter. A barely passable fielder.
Biz Mackey: Gabby Hartnett
Andy Cooper: Tom Glavine
Willard Brown: Andre Dawson with more power (A really close comparison, I think.)

--Chad

[Archive]

Posted By: Ryan Christoff

tbob,

Maybe instead of answering every question you could start with one?

-Ryan