2007 East Coast National

[Archive]

Posted By: Patrick McHugh

Is anyone going to this show? Any reports from today? Opinions on the show.

[Archive]

Posted By: mabjae

I think it starts tomorrow. I'll be there tomorrow at about noon and will report on it - if that helps at all.
Don't really know what to expect.

[Archive]

Posted By: Phil Garry

Just got back from the show tonight. Other than all of the major grading companies being there, nothing real exciting for me to report and would not recommend going too far out of your way to attend. I live about 40 minutes and it wasn't worth the trip for me.

[Archive]

Posted By: Joe Pelaez

?

[Archive]

Posted By: mabjae

Thanks Phil. Any vintage stuff? Cards, photos, memorabilia?

[Archive]

Posted By: Danny Grimes

i'll be there saturday.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

primarily to drop off some grading submissions
not usually alot of vintage, but it serves its purpose as being a destination to get my son excited...

anybody from here set up as a dealer?

Joe P - it's the White Plains show at the Westchester County Center

[Archive]

Posted By: Danny Grimes

phil, just curious why didnt you like it? ive been there before and by far its the best around for me in my area. What i noticed though, to many vintage dealers shoot for the moon, and alot of newer crap, but im sure thats any show.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay wolt

"What show are we talking about?"

Joe - White Plains, NY.

[Archive]

Posted By: Joe Pelaez

I couldn't figure out what show you were talking about.

Does Gloria still run that show, or someone else?

[Archive]

Posted By: jay wolt

Didn't Gloria Rothstein die a year or so ago?

[Archive]

Posted By: Joe Pelaez

I didn't know about Gloria's passing,RIP.
That was a good show for quite a few years.

[Archive]

Posted By: bruce Dorskind

We attended the East Coast National which opened at 5:00 PM on Thursday evening
August 16.

We have attended this show for many, many years. Thursday evening usually traditionally
drew large crowds.

There were less than 200 attendees at the show.

With the exception of "auction preview" booths - Memory Lane and Huggins and Scott
there was not a single ultra high grade N C, D, E or R card for sale.

We saw about 150 cracker jacks (at three different tables)- not one was graded above a 5
(rather pathetic for that set). The T 206's were generally ungraded with a plethora of
3,4,5's.

The Goudeys(90% 1933) were 6 and below.

There were some leftovers from The (real) Natonal in the E category-but these cards
could be described as "beaters" at best.

We would suggest that anyone wishing to have an item graded attend because the PSA,
SGC and Spence booths were empty.

It was a disappointing experience indeed. We did not make purchases. In fact, we never
found a single item that we even would have added to our collection if it were priced at a dollar.

Clearly the days of the regional show have passed. Rare, ultra high grade material
can only be found at auctions or via private transactions between long-time collectors.


Bruce Dorskind
America's Toughest Want List

[Archive]

Posted By: Pcelli60

Don't you guys get tired of complaining about the same thing every year? Honest to God you're like a bunch of card collecting old ladies.

[Archive]

Posted By: rob

Agreed that there is not a huge inventory at the ECN for vintage-philes,but is is well-run with some good dealers there.
Jimmy Ryan runs the show now. Having met him numerous times in the past (not to mention he bought a huge amount of my vintage from me...sets,singles,packs,etc...when I sold out a few years back for a very fair price.....),I can attest to the fact that he is a true gentleman (he also has an extensive vintage collection and good prices...a lot of vintage he himself sets up with at the show.
He usually has good autograph guests and tries his best to run a good show.
It's definitely the best show in the area for vintage;second best would be the Hofstra University shows.
Still,neither of these venues are mostly vintage by any means...lots of the shiny stuff.
Rob Brooklyn,NY

[Archive]

Posted By: Joe D.

dropping off some submissions to PSA (my first time with PSA).


usually the show is not that great. hopefully it is better this year.

[Archive]

Posted By: boxingbaseballgolf33

Was going to setup at the show but decided to go with my local show instead -the Boston show in November is the better show in the East Coast and Reading(Philly) should be improved from last year I am hoping. I had a plan even just to attend, but got caught up doing too much in one weekend. The two guys that run the show are Brain and Jimmy I believe and have been trying to get the show back on track.

Jimmy

[Archive]

Posted By: Joe D.

I always enjoy a weekend in Boston.

is there a lot of vintage at the show (november)?

better than philly?

vintage golf?

sorry for the rapid-fire questions

If I can make it.... I may head up there

[Archive]

Posted By: Jimmy

Joe,

I would say just like every show it has gone down in interest a bit, but a lot of the larger dealers come to the show - I would say the majority of the dealers at Philly come to the Boston show every year. The show is a bit smaller than Philly, but you are close to Boston and there is a lot to do other than going to the show. I work with one of the dealers at both shows and last years Boston show was better than the two Reading shows. They both have vintage dealers more than the East Coast National, even though there are new cards and dealers selling boxes and other items that is with every show now. I would say if you are 3-6 hours away it would be worth the trip, but I have seen less pre-war each year. The first year I went which was about 6 years ago - it was one of the best shows on the East Coast - maybe it still is – for the past few years I cut down on the shows I do but Philly and Boston are still on the list. I will have golf items and there was another dealer with just golf from Cape Cod - first week in Nov.


Jimmy

[Archive]

Posted By: Phil Garry

I remember there was one dealer named Chuck set up right around the center of the room and he has some nice vintage stuff with a lot of American Caramel Cards from the 1920's, etc.

[Archive]

Posted By: Joe D.

chuck is a great guy

with a very nice selection of vintage stuff.


I would always recommend N54ers who head to the East Coast National or the Philly show to check out his table.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay

Bruce are exactly right. The show used to be good and now it is horrible. It's a pity that the major show in the New York area cannot attract major dealers.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jimmy

Chuck is a great guy to work with, lots of SGC cards and pre-war

Jimmy

[Archive]

Posted By: Steve f

I'm up for adoption. Where does one go to meet elderly women collecting prewar?

[Archive]

Posted By: Jimmy

I know the Rockford Peaches setup in Boston every year, maybe they can give you a kiss - they have a hugh display of "A League of Their Own" Memorabilia

Jimmy

[Archive]

Posted By: Steve Murray

"Bruce are exactly right."

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

sets up where in White Plains? last name? any signs or identifiers?
If not, I'll just look.

and if I recall, there has been a guy who sets up right in front who had quite a bit of vintage stuff on display...anyone know who that is?

[Archive]

Posted By: boxingbaseballgolf33

Name is Chuck Blue, and he has about 6 or more cases mostly SGC stuff, he should be there because he is from Conn. so it maybe close for him.

Good luck

Jimmy

[Archive]

Posted By: Tim Newcomb

Not a single ultra-high-grade vintage card to be found! That is, indeed, truly pathetic. I'm surprised you still waste your time going to this or any show, since all of the material worth collecting is now found in the big auctions.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jon Canfield

Chuck Blue is a good guy - I've dealt with him many times in the past and bought some various cards from him (I rememebr an E95 Plank, etc). He's usually there with his friend, Tom (I think that's his name). If you get a chance to stop by his table, strike up a conversation and wait and see what Chuck will bring out to show you from his own collection... He always has amazing stuff behind the table. Last time I was there, he brought out a beautiful PSA/DNA 9 Matty check.

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Tim- I still haven't figured out the difference between high grade and ultra high grade. I know at the gas station it means higher octane, but the baseball card difference escapes me.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

"ultra high grade" takes into account how many similar cards there are in the highest grades, as opposed to "high grade", which simply refers to the high grades (7,8,9 and 10) themselves.

And just for the record, all of my cards are unleaded, and I do keep them under vapor-proof displays, so as to retard the evaporative processes that often plague a collection of minimal importance such as mine.
(Can you tell it's Friday after a choppy week in the market?)

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Choppy market is putting it mildly. It's been a tsunami!

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

do you go to shows anymore, since you hung up your collecting hat, so to speak?...maybe just to do market reconaissance? (spelling?)

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Haven't been to a show in ten years, and likely will never go to another one. They once were fun, then they started to get depressing. Can't explain exactly why, but I would always have a bad feeling walking around and just decided to stop. It's some kind of phobia, I guess.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

I tend to have an increased level of buyer's remorse at shows...it is far easier to buy things remotely. Unfortunately, the advent of Ebay has been killing off the "social" and "event" aspects of the hobby, while providing benefits such as access, liquidity, and more accurate pricing (generally).

And I would be willing to bet that is a part of why the dealers/sellers at shows mark up their items so high at shows - to avoid feeling seller's remorse and the fear of letting an item go in a much smaller subset of the market with far less perfect pricing information.

You combine the two and basically what you now have at a show are a group of people behind the tables who are reluctant to sell and a group of customers in front of the tables who are more reluctant to buy. Hence...the shows are dying. a shame.

Add to this the practice of dealers not having prices on their inventory, and I don't even want to START a conversation...because if you find a talbe with twenty things you like, what are you gonna do, stand there and quiz him about each item, hoping to remember them all>???!!! Stupid. Put out the prices as reference points and let's start going to town!

anyway, enough of the Friday ramble...

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Other than the social aspect, I'm not even sure why shows still exist. There are far better business models as you pointed out. I would think shows are among the worst, with prices consistently higher than in any other venue.

But nobody consulted with me about it, so if people like shows, more power to them.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jimmy

I tend to do fewer shows, but I try to be very fair at shows that I can get to. The New York show would have been too expensive for me at this time to setup, but I do plan to get out more and do some of the better shows. I really only attend Boston and Philly when I can and a few local shows. I feel sometimes it can be depressing at these shows, that is way I spent more time doing listings and research on the internet.

Jimmy

[Archive]

Posted By: peter chao

Barry,

You hit it on the nose, it is really the social aspects which make shows worth going to. Also many of us still prefer to see the card and buy directly from dealers we trust.

Peter C.

[Archive]

Posted By: Alan

Barry -

I agree. I really loved the recent National in Cleveland, mainly for the social aspects since I can't afford much anyway.

Alan

[Archive]

Posted By: Danny Grimes

nothing perosnal by all means, but Chuck and I knocked heads a few times and i think hes a total stiff, but he does have a nice selection if his prices come back down to earth.

[Archive]

Posted By: peter chao

Guys,

Do you think pricing at shows are comparable to the internet? I think prices are higher at shows, but dealers more readily give people a discount so the prices end up being pretty close.

Peter C.

[Archive]

Posted By: Danny Grimes

nothing beats the wheeling and dealing here on Net54 but i think the internet has better prices than shows, but there again there might be that one dealer.

[Archive]

Posted By: Joseph

This is a sad show, a shadow of its past. I went religiously in the 80s into the 90s. Then came the
'Net and Gloria Rothstein's yielding the show to her son. Eventually she sold the show to new promoters.

It is not worth a trip unless you're in the area. Really, don't waste your time.

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave Hornish

I think the East Coast National moniker is misleading. The show sounds like it the same as Jim's other shows in Westchester, which are essentially what once were thought of as large local shows. They are good shows and he is indeed a good guy but they do not have the depth of material you see at EPSCC or, obviously the National. It is maybe a little better than the 2 big Hofstra shows but you get a lot of the same dealers and crowd at both locations.

It's more for the post WW2 crowd as well and in that vein it's above average in these parts. For pre war vintage it obviously is not as deep. What we need is a pre 1975 show like the one that used to be (Still is?) in Albany but on a larger scale. Bag the shiny stuff, eliminate dealers selling Webkinz, kill the Dan Marino autographed football plaques and you might have a shot at a deent show.

[Archive]

Posted By: Alan

What there needs to be is a NATIONAL pre-war baseball card show (nothing post-war) in the same type of thing they had called a National vintage sports memorabilia & equipment show in the Baltimore & Washington, DC area in the mid & late 1990's. It was fantastic !!! Even though, there were only about 50-70 dealers, it had ONLY vintage memorabilia, uniforms, equipment, etc,... !!!

Alan

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay

Well, I take back every bad thing I said about the show. I went today and I picked up an incredibly rare group of 27 M101-1s. These are not the more common National Copperplate images but the actual pieces that were issued with the Newspaper. I have included a representative front and back scan. In the group was the very rare Chesbro card; what I believe to be his first representation in a cataloged card set.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay

Edited to remove duplicate posts

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay

Edit

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

for superior service at the show.

I attended on Sunday morning and one of my goals was to bring in my ungraded pre-war cards for submission to SGC, with whom I had never yet done business. Michael Goldberg (SGC's service mgr) was extremely helpful, reviewed my cards, set expectations, and helped me complete the submission forms appropriately. I even learned a few things about the cards I had brought in.

So, SGC currently has a sizable chunk of my collection, and indeed, all of my cousins' cards, so I am looking forward to getting them all back in crystal clear SGC holders! I hope others have had similar good service.

Thanks for the help, Michael.
PS - my son thanks you for the free rubber bands (which he used to tie together his Starting Lineup figures, for some unknown reason!)