Is it worth the trouble to build vintage sets?

[avalanche2006]

I like to spend the time to make sure I get high grade cards for my sets.
I build these sets card by card and often catch myself upgrading if I see a corner I don't like, etc.
However, I see that a lot of people don't like collecting sets because, as they say, "A set is only as good as the sum of it's parts."
What if each card really is nrmt?
Any thoughts?

[pingman59]

In my opinion, collecting a vintage set is worth the trouble when you keep the condition consistent for each card in the set. For example, Near Mint with no worse than 65/35 centering. You'll probably spend more than what you would if you just bought the set, but it's hard to find a high grade set that's consistent from card #1 all the way through anyway. They rarely show up for sale or at auction. Most nice sets that do make it for sale or at auction have some percentage of "problem" cards that need upgrading.

[kvnkvnkvn]

For my answer, you can see my EBAY STORE...Where my 52-79 Topps set run is listed. Got to be too much chasing all those commons around...

[mintacular]

I think you will almost always lose, which is why I don't do it anymore. I think someone on here had a break down of some sets and the overall set value was like 60-70% of the singles listed i.e. if the '72 BB set books $2500 if you added it up card by card from book the number was much higher like 3K+(you get the idea). So even if you carefully pick up the cards 1 by 1 until completion you are already 30-40% in the hole when trying to resell if selling the whole set in one transaction.

I think the only way you could get someone to pay a handsome amt on a whole set is if the raw mantle clemente etc. were drop dead gorgeous, and what are the chances you will be able to finish a raw set with a 7+ quality of Mantle?

[ALR-bishop]

I have collected all Topps, Bowman and Fleer sets plus variations, all ungraded. But I have never had the expectation of selling them at a profit or viewed them as an investment. Just an expensive hobby that will be a windfall to some folks when I am gone.

[darkhorse9]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

I have collected all Topps, Bowman and Fleer sets plus variations, all ungraded. But I have never had the expectation of selling them at a profit or viewed them as an investment. Just an expensive hobby that will be a windfall to some folks when I am gone.

I agree 100%. I collect for enjoyment, not investment.

When I die the enjoyment dies with me. I've already instructed my son that when I'm gone the cards are all his and he is to immediately sell them for whatever he can (it's all 100% profit for him) and spend it on something memorable and enjoyable for him.

That way three people get something out of the collection (myself, my son, the person he sells them to). Hard to see a downside there.

If your hobby is about how much money you can make from it, that's not a hobby.

[Volod]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

I have collected all Topps, Bowman and Fleer sets plus variations, all ungraded. But I have never had the expectation of selling them at a profit or viewed them as an investment. Just an expensive hobby that will be a windfall to some folks when I am gone.

Same here, minus the Fleer.

[rsdill2]

Here's the analysis I did using Beckett high values:

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=183323

To build a set card by card will always be a losing proposition from a financial standpoint. The whole is cheaper than the sum of its parts.

However, we're all collectors here and enjoy the thrill of the chase. If you enjoy building a set card by card, then do it. But understand it's probably costing you a little money.

I think the '72 set is a perfect example. You can buy a decent mid grade set for a little less than $1k. There's 130 high numbers in a '72 set that will each run you $3-5...some slightly more so just the highs will cost around $600. Then you've still got 656 more cards to chase including Mays, Ryan, Clemente, Aaron, Rose, etc.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by rsdill2

Here's the analysis I did using Beckett high values:

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=183323

To build a set card by card will always be a losing proposition from a financial standpoint. The whole is cheaper than the sum of its parts.

However, we're all collectors here and enjoy the thrill of the chase. If you enjoy building a set card by card, then do it. But understand it's probably costing you a little money.

I think the '72 set is a perfect example. You can buy a decent mid grade set for a little less than $1k. There's 130 high numbers in a '72 set that will each run you $3-5...some slightly more so just the highs will cost around $600. Then you've still got 656 more cards to chase including Mays, Ryan, Clemente, Aaron, Rose, etc.

^^Great price break down in the other thread^^
Buying it already completed is way cheaper. Not only do you pay way more for just the cards you have to add in all that shipping.

I am almost done with a 55 Bowman. I received at least 1/3 of the cards for free including most of the star players. With what I have into the rest of the set including shipping I could have bought a complete set in better condition.

I will say the experience of putting a set together is well worth the price.

[jason.1969]

I have to wait till the money wouldn't be needed for more important things, but I would so much love to collect a complete set of 1934-36 Diamond Stars or 1957 Topps someday--maybe 1953 Bowman. First things first though.

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[bbcard1]

Building sets a card at a time is a great hobby but a lousy investment. When it's time to sell, you are probably better off breaking them up.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by bbcard1

Building sets a card at a time is a great hobby but a lousy investment. When it's time to sell, you are probably better off breaking them up.

I agree, I am almost 90% of the way on a 52 Topps graded set. Out of the many nongraded/graded sets I have built, this is the only set I can remember not starting with a "starter lot". However, maybe only a third of the cards in the set have been purchased as a stand alone purchase. Throughout the 12+ years of building this set, I have tried to acquire cards in small lots as well as buy multiple cards from a seller to save on s/h.

Since ebay bucks came out years ago, I have used those to fund this set. I have also used all of my work CC "points" to apply to my purchases for this set....while it has been a lot of fun building this set, I hope it to also be a sound investment.

[MikeGarcia]

Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes

I agree, I am almost 90% of the way on a 52 Topps graded set. Out of the many nongraded/graded sets I have built, this is the only set I can remember not starting with a "starter lot". However, maybe only a third of the cards in the set have been purchased as a stand alone purchase. Throughout the 12+ years of building this set, I have tried to acquire cards in small lots as well as buy multiple cards from a seller to save on s/h.

Since ebay bucks came out years ago, I have used those to fund this set. I have also used all of my work CC "points" to apply to my purchases for this set....while it has been a lot of fun building this set, I hope it to also be a sound investment.

This is a very intelligent approach . 90% in 12 years , all graded '52 Topps.....few of us would have that kind of focus . Do you have a wantlist of the absent 10% ? Must they all be a particular TPG ? The good ole BST here might help you out ? Good hunting.

..

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by MikeGarcia

This is a very intelligent approach . 90% in 12 years , all graded '52 Topps.....few of us would have that kind of focus . Do you have a wantlist of the absent 10% ? Must they all be a particular TPG ? The good ole BST here might help you out ? Good hunting.

..

Thank you, but more than anything it has been fun building. I wish I could say I was focused on this set for 12 years straight. To be perfectly honest, there were some years in there I did not focus on this set at all, however, after completing whatever set distracted me, my focus would return back to the 52s.

The set is all PSA and appears on the registry, link below. Over the past few years, I have picked up a good number of cards for this set off of our BST. My wantlist consists of just high numbers....while most of the needed cards are readily available, my funds to acquire these needed cards are not readily available. Based on the costs needed to complete this set, I have a 4 year goal to finish. I am in no hurry, it is about the hunt.

https://www.psacard.com/psasetregist...blishedset/100

[bbcard1]

I have two...low grade 55 bowman and 69 Topps that I am finishing a second set on. I am sure I won’t be able to sell them profitably but maybe someone will have something I can trade for.

[vintagebaseballcardguy]

Hope no one minds me bumping this thread after a couple of months. I truly enjoyed reading it! I recently finished a '66 Topps football set and bought a '65 Topps tall boy football set. I am at 121/198 on a '65 Philly football set but starting to get restless. Also, I am anticipating pitchers and catchers reporting in about two weeks. I am kicking around the idea of starting a '61 Topps set...mostly raw (except for a few of the bigger ones probably) in crease-free mid-grade. I sold a '65 Topps set about 2/3 complete last summer and have recently regretted it. I have really been missing baseball, especially 60s Topps.

Like Al and others mentioned, this for me is a fun hobby...albeit a pricey one at times. I know it would be quicker and perhaps more cost effective to buy whole sets or large lots, but I like having control over each and every card. I am somewhat OCD . I might buy 50-75 cards at a time with a favorite seller and when I do, I get prices that I can really live with.

Anyway, great thread. Just wanted to chime in.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Well don't discount bulk purchases to cherry pick the ones you want and resell the ones you don't. I once put together a 1971 Topps baseball this way for under $200 net dollars in EX/MT. You can't be in a rush, but it can be very cost effective!

[wdwfan]

This is the most frustrating thing about putting sets together. I am the type that wants this to be a spring and not a marathon, but I don't have the money to nor do I want to buy a set. I want to put them together piece by piece. But by buying a few lots, it gives me very few cards to trade. Plus, no one seems to want to trade around here with me.

I've got about 50 different from 1963, 1959 and 1961, so kicking around the idea of starting those sets. But I've got about 625 different '74s, 400+ different '71s and nearly 200 different '62s. So that would be 6 sets in progress if I decide to add 3 more. I have completely sold out of my modern stuff since moving into vintage in August. But I sure do love the vintage stuff.

Here's my question. For those of you putting sets together, do you wait until you have a certain amount of the set before putting them into pages and into a notebook? Or do you even use a notebook? Or do you just sleeve them and put them into a box? I have a friend that puts all of his baseball sets in toploaders and into a filing cabinet. He then puts all of his football sets into pages. I personally prefer to have my cards in pages so I can more easily look through them. But it's harder to price them in pages since you can't put the cards into sleeves and into the pages. I want to put prices on individual cards so my wife would have an idea of where to start should something happen to me.

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

You can't be in a rush, but it can be very cost effective!

[vintagebaseballcardguy]

Originally Posted by wdwfan

This is the most frustrating thing about putting sets together. I am the type that wants this to be a spring and not a marathon, but I don't have the money to nor do I want to buy a set. I want to put them together piece by piece. But by buying a few lots, it gives me very few cards to trade. Plus, no one seems to want to trade around here with me.

I've got about 50 different from 1963, 1959 and 1961, so kicking around the idea of starting those sets. But I've got about 625 different '74s, 400+ different '71s and nearly 200 different '62s. So that would be 6 sets in progress if I decide to add 3 more. I have completely sold out of my modern stuff since moving into vintage in August. But I sure do love the vintage stuff.

Here's my question. For those of you putting sets together, do you wait until you have a certain amount of the set before putting them into pages and into a notebook? Or do you even use a notebook? Or do you just sleeve them and put them into a box? I have a friend that puts all of his baseball sets in toploaders and into a filing cabinet. He then puts all of his football sets into pages. I personally prefer to have my cards in pages so I can more easily look through them. But it's harder to price them in pages since you can't put the cards into sleeves and into the pages. I want to put prices on individual cards so my wife would have an idea of where to start should something happen to me.

Well, I can relate to some of what you are saying. I really wouldn't want to buy a set in most cases. I have before, but it is more fun to build one. Besides, like you, I couldn't afford one most of the time anyway, so that takes the pressure off. I tend to end up trying to build them piece by piece. Partly this is because it is easier for me financially to bite a little off at a time, and also because I just tend to like doing it that way. Inevitably, I lose interest and start on something else. What I have improved upon, however, is that I no longer sell off what I started on and then stopped. I just put it up and then eventually come back to it when my interest swings back that way. This "formula" has actually been working for me.

As to your question about cards and pages, if you want to have a little extra protection and/or the ability to price/display them in binders, toploaderbinder.com makes a good product. These allow you to place the card in the toploader and into the binder. They are somewhat pricey, but do a decent job. You can also buy some unikeep enclosed binders (3 for $20 I think) and some 4 pocket ultra pro pages and put your cards in toploaders or cardsavers or whatever and organize them that way, too. Neither is a perfect system but might help you. Good luck!

[JLange]

Originally Posted by wdwfan

Here's my question. For those of you putting sets together, do you wait until you have a certain amount of the set before putting them into pages and into a notebook? Or do you even use a notebook? Or do you just sleeve them and put them into a box? I have a friend that puts all of his baseball sets in toploaders and into a filing cabinet. He then puts all of his football sets into pages. I personally prefer to have my cards in pages so I can more easily look through them. But it's harder to price them in pages since you can't put the cards into sleeves and into the pages. I want to put prices on individual cards so my wife would have an idea of where to start should something happen to me.

I’m a big fan of using cardsaver 1’s in 4-pocket pages as mentioned by another poster, especially when condition is important to you. The cards can be priced or identified with labels on the front or back and you can take and move them around with ease if you don’t like leaving holes in your pages as you build. I’ve also had inclinations to re-organize sets by teams or group subsets like rookie all-stars cards or multiplayer cards together at times so it makes a re-org quite easy as well. One drawback is a full album of 4-pocket pages can hold only about 248-252 cards,so you are looking at multiple albums to complete a typical Topps set.

[vintagebaseballcardguy]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Well don't discount bulk purchases to cherry pick the ones you want and resell the ones you don't. I once put together a 1971 Topps baseball this way for under $200 net dollars in EX/MT. You can't be in a rush, but it can be very cost effective!

You care to elaborate a little on this? Not sure I am understanding everything here...

[Vintagevault13]

IMO, there are certain sets that I think justify the extra cost of building one card at a time. These are the sets that are prone to specific issues. A perfect example is the 1975 Topps Baseball Set. I just finished it in EX condition. One of my pet peeves are the “fish eyes” that are quite common on these cards. Personally, I can’t stand them. Many sellers don’t take these into account when determining condition. I probably spent $100 -$150 more than I would have if I bought the complete set or several large lots. I felt it was worth it because probably 50% of the cards would have had the fish eyes and I would have been faced with massive upgrades. I guess it all just depends on personal preference.


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[avalanche2006]

Originally Posted by Vintagevault13

IMO, there are certain sets that I think justify the extra cost of building one card at a time. These are the sets that are prone to specific issues. A perfect example is the 1975 Topps Baseball Set. I just finished it in EX condition. One of my pet peeves are the “fish eyes” that are quite common on these cards. Personally, I can’t stand them. Many sellers don’t take these into account when determining condition. I probably spent $100 -$150 more than I would have if I bought the complete set or several large lots. I felt it was worth it because probably 50% of the cards would have had the fish eyes and I would have been faced with massive upgrades. I guess it all just depends on personal preference.


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That's how I feel about the 3 sets that I am doing.
1958,59, and 60. All known to have centering issues.
All of my sets are perfectly centered with sharp corners.
This took many upgrades to achieve, but it's worth it to look through a set and be satisfied with every card.
That's my goal anyway, being as picky as I am.

[ZiggerZagger]

I suppose it matters how much the thrill of the chase appeals to you. In my case, not very much.

My method has been to buy very nice complete sets to begin with, often waiting for quite a while for one to pop up.
Sadly, I have the centering sickness, so I've tended to wait for collector-assembled sets to pop up where it's been clear they've cared about centering and eye-appeal.
From there, I've probably upgraded 10-30% of the cards for perfect centering and condition, depending on the set.
By the time I get to the last few cards, I'm usually getting a bit frustrated, so the thrill of completing things is really more of a relief to me.

It's worked well for me, though, having just completed the last set in my 1953 - 1979 Topps run recently. Took about 6 years or so. Condition is consistent within a given set, and ranges from EXMT to NM/MT depending on year.
I'm sure that buying complete sets to start has cut the final cost of finishing each set dramatically.

I do really enjoy having those sets to leaf through though, and they look amazing when assembled consistently.

I respect and envy folks who are able to just focus on individual examples of cards without feeling the need to be completist about collecting. I would love to get to that state of mind, and feel like I'm getting closer to it as the years go by.

[PowderedH2O]

I love to collect sets, but my budget won't allow for me to complete sets from Pre-War (for the most part), so I am restricting it to 1948-present. I don't exactly collect like the rest of you. I can't focus on one set at a time. I get annoyed with it. Literally, I can be all in on a set one day, and a day later I don't even want to look at it. So, I set up a plan about 3 years ago. I listed all of the sets I wanted to complete, and decided to do it on a 10 year plan. I would make sure that each year I am at the 10% more mark each year. This year, my goal is to be at 30% or higher for each set by my birthday in August. I am only a few cards away from that goal, so I am right on schedule. I also assign a points value to each set, so I make sure that I am also picking up a fair amount of star cards for each set as well, so I am not stuck at the end with all of the toughies.
Doing it this way seems illogical. But, it keeps me interested and always relaxed and enjoying it. I have also finished quite a few sets in the last three years already, so those no longer are in play. I am not a Mint freak. I just like good looking cards. For the 60's, I am happy with Excellentish cards. For the early 50's cards, vg/vg-ex works just fine. I am working one 1940's set, and one 1930's set. Vg is just fine for those.

[ALR-bishop]

Sounds like a great collecting plan, Sam

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by PowderedH2O

I love to collect sets, but my budget won't allow for me to complete sets from Pre-War (for the most part), so I am restricting it to 1948-present. I don't exactly collect like the rest of you. I can't focus on one set at a time. I get annoyed with it. Literally, I can be all in on a set one day, and a day later I don't even want to look at it. So, I set up a plan about 3 years ago. I listed all of the sets I wanted to complete, and decided to do it on a 10 year plan. I would make sure that each year I am at the 10% more mark each year. This year, my goal is to be at 30% or higher for each set by my birthday in August. I am only a few cards away from that goal, so I am right on schedule. I also assign a points value to each set, so I make sure that I am also picking up a fair amount of star cards for each set as well, so I am not stuck at the end with all of the toughies.
Doing it this way seems illogical. But, it keeps me interested and always relaxed and enjoying it. I have also finished quite a few sets in the last three years already, so those no longer are in play. I am not a Mint freak. I just like good looking cards. For the 60's, I am happy with Excellentish cards. For the early 50's cards, vg/vg-ex works just fine. I am working one 1940's set, and one 1930's set. Vg is just fine for those.

I agree with Al, that seems like a great plan. I need to greatly downsize my collection or I would pick a few sets I have been considering and do it exactly like you described.