Mickey Mantle Card Identification

[Semitar6]

Mickey Mantle Card Help

I recently purchased a Mickey Mantle Card that I've never seen before. It has a number 828 on it and on a plain white back says "Stahl Test Proof". Any information would be helpful...Thanks

[dstudeba]

Unfortunately I believe that is a reprint 1953 Stahl Meyers Mantle. The 828 number is what I believe is a lot number which would mean the card was distributed with hot dogs and therefore is doubtful it is a proof. Plus from your scan it looks like a reprint, as Stahl Meyers have crisper printing. If you search for 1953 Stahl Meyer Mantles you might even be able to find the original it was copied from. Here is an original for comparison.

[Semitar6]

I figured as much, however I was confused about the blank back because I think the original wasnt blank...I just thought it was rather odd..

[Semitar6]

Just f.y.i. for anyone interested. Heritage auctions just emailed me and told me this is with 99 percent certainty, a authentic printers proof of the Mantle. This is what they told me. "Your card is probably 100% authentic and I say that only because I’m going off a scan. There was a find some years ago of Stahl-Meyers cards that we assume came from an employee of the print shop as they were all blank backed, never had the heavy wax applied nor the corners diecut. None of the cards had any type on the reverse Other examples have sold in the past and based on that your card would probably sell in the $700-1,000 range. Definitely a card I would like to include in our next Signature Catalog Auction in the Fall."

[dstudeba]

Very interesting. I stand by my opinion just as much as before and would be interested to hear what others thought.

I would love to see an example that has sold in the past. I have only followed Stahl Meyers for 6-7 years, but have never seen one in that time.

[Leon]

I have no clue on this card but in Heritage's defense they have 2 of the best card guys in the business, imo, on staff. I doubt many folks in the hobby have handled more vintage cards than Derek and Peter....especially combined.

[dstudeba]

Over the years the Mastro/Legendary team has sold a number of "printers proofs" which are easily recognized by having square corners and no wax. Here is a link to the latest group they sold.

http://www.legendaryauctions.com/Lot...x?lotid=116950

Though none of the auctions show the backs, none of the descriptions ever mentioned the cards having blank backs. Many of these square cornered cards are drifting around the hobby and show up a few times a year on eBay and in auction houses. All of the ones I have seen have had normally printed backs. Also none of them have had stamped numbers or show the kind of damage the card above shows.

I do not disagree with Leon that people at Heritage have seen many more cards than I have, however I do follow Stahl Meyers more intently than most. I would be interested if Marty Pritchard or Levi Bleam would purchase this card.

[Leon]

Dan- For the record, with my knowledge of cards, that card in question looks like crap to me too. I just don't know that series well enough to give a good opinion. I take your word for it that you do.
Also, there are several others on Heritage's staff so it might not have been Derek or Peter anyway. regards

[barrysloate]

If there was a find of proofs a few years ago, maybe this card is a copy of one of those proofs. Unless this is just a really bad scan, I can't imagine it's original.

[ls7plus]

It would be interesting to see the print dot pattern under high power magnification, such as 16X or so. I've had pretty good success ID'ng counterfeits this way over the years. At the 2009 National, one dealer had what he claimed to be a different version of the 1914 Baltimore News Ruth for $650. I immediately realized from the price alone that this meant the grading companies wouldn't touch it, but was curious. This card had a blank back. I asked if he would mind if I took a look at it with my loupe, and I did. It had an irregular dot pattern that beyond question indicated it was not original. When he asked what I thought, I just politely told him that it didn't look promising.

I too, have a high regard for Heritage. I've sold some game-used bats through them, and they did a terrific job in the photos and write-ups in their auction catalogue.

Best of luck on this one,

Larry

[dstudeba]

So is this card going to be sold by Heritage, or are there other plans for it?

[fkw]

Wow! I looked at this post earlier and agreed it was a bad fake, but now I go back and reread it, lol

Still looks just like a bad quality homemade fake to me ... in every single way

Low quality rescreen job with washed out colors (Mantles face/neck should jump out from the background), faked diecut corners, fake water stains, fake "Stahl Test Proof" type written note on back.

The stamped lot numbers on a test proof??? Why would they ever need to test that? it was stamped on, not printed....

The colors are so off and washed out I dont know how anyone could say it was printed the same way the authentic cards were or even that lot of 9 so called "proofs" (printer scrapsheet cut cards) were printed. ???