Advice on Collecting

[Iron_man]

Hey guys, looking for a little bit of advice / thoughts on collecting.

So I'm starting to get back into collecting and I'm focused on buying HOF-RC-Graded (PSA) cards. And I know this is a baseball forum but I'm looking at baseball, basketball and football cards.

I'm buying these just for my PC and enjoyment not for investment per se, but with the amount of money you start to spend it does turn into an investment to a degree.

What I'm really, really struggling with is what grade to get. For example a 1981 Montana rookie do you spend $500 on a PSA-9 or $200-300 for a PSA-8? Do you spend $350 for a Bob Gibson-RC PSA-6 or spend $500+ for a PSA-7? Do you spend $300 for a Maris-RC PSA-6 or $500+ for a PSA-7?

So basically long term do you think I will be better off spending the extra money now to get higher grades (nothing too crazy not the PSA 10 that goes for $XX,XXX) but the higher end stuff that is not too crazy expensive or do I just get the upper middle stuff that is still really nice but priced a little more reasonable?

I would just hate to look back 10-20-30 years from now on some of this stuff and wish I had purchased the better grade because it has gone up a lot more than the middle range stuff. Or maybe it all goes up a slow steady X% over time. Or maybe the hobby tanks and this stuff turns out to be almost worthless.

I know I'm posing a question that is almost impossible to answer, but just looking for any opinions or thoughts anyone may have. Again I'm just struggling with this and would like to have a better feel before I really starting buying stuff.

Thanks so much for the help!!

[gs1833]

Nine times out of ten, you will likely better from an investment standpoint if you go with the higher grade cards -- the Montana 9 over the Montana 8, for instance.

That said, for my money I would much rather have the Montana 8 (which will have fantastic eye appeal, pretty sharp corners, etc.) and take the extra money I saved from the 9 and buy rookies of Marino, Elway, and Favre.

[gnpaden]

I buy just for my collection and do not sell at all, so I do not look at the grade, but more importantly, the card. Corners, centering, color, etc. You will see some 6's that look better than 7's and vice versa. Buy the card, not the grade.

[Mark70Z]

Originally Posted by gnpaden

I buy just for my collection and do not sell at all, so I do not look at the grade, but more importantly, the card. Corners, centering, color, etc. You will see some 6's that look better than 7's and vice versa. Buy the card, not the grade.

I'm in agreement with the above. If you're collecting for the enjoyment then don't worry about 10-20-30 years down the road; enjoy the cards for "you" now. Also, if you're collecting HOF RC that are graded you really can't go wrong in the future as far as ROI; there will always, at least in our lifetime, a demand for the cards of HOF'ers in all ranges of condition. I'd personally go for a good looking or ascetically pleasing card and not worry at all about some number that someone declares the card to grade.

Have fun collecting!

[Iron_man]

Thanks guys for the advice, this really helps.

It's like last night I was looking and thinking about buying a 69 Topps-Kareem rookie PSA-6 that was really nice for around $290. But then I started to look at a PSA-7 that was about $500 and I could not decide which direction to go. Now the PSA-8 is easily $2,000+ so I kind of wrote that off, b/c with the volume I plan on buying at it would just be too expensive to start buying like that.

But I could go 6 or 7 and the whole idea of do I go higher or lower came into play and lead to me seeking advice.

Overall I'm looking to buy a LOT of the major stars RC so for example in football (Brady, Manning, Montana, Rice, Elway, Marino, Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Bart Star, Johnny Unitas, etc.) Of course I'll be buying the most in cards in baseball but I think you see where I'm going with this. Major players from current back to the 50's and maybe later.

With that said unless I want to have like 60K invested in cards (which I don't) I'm going to have to be in the less than 1K (maybe mid hundreds) price range for a lot of these. However I will go over 1K for the really elite RC cards (Aaron, Mays, Clemente, Rose, Nolan Ryan, MJ, etc.)

Ok sorry for rambling on, but to the point I'm now leaning towards going with the higher grade versus lower so the Montana 9 versus the 8, the Kareem 7 versus the 6, etc. . Not looking to spend multiple 1,000s on any one card (unless it's one of the very few really elite cards) but working in that range.

I have to say I really love collecting, I don't what it is but I absolutely love the whole process and collecting these cards I dreamed of owning growing up!

[1952boyntoncollector]

also rememeber there are more people out there who can pay 200 dollars on a card and not worry that they could save 10 dollars..versus people having 500 dollars....so maybe bigger value cards you have a chance to make more money but with less possible people to buy it takes longer..

also realize when you buy a card at an auction...you already are the one that was willing to pay top dollar.....if there are several unique bidders above a certain price point..thats the price point in which you can sell it back ..so realize that the more you want a card..the less of a chance someone will want the card as much as you price wise..but again..if its 100 bucks..people can pay that if dont love the card cause its 100 versus 500 ...

[Iron_man]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

also rememeber there are more people out there who can pay 200 dollars on a card and not worry that they could save 10 dollars..versus people having 500 dollars....so maybe bigger value cards you have a chance to make more money but with less possible people to buy it takes longer..

also realize when you buy a card at an auction...you already are the one that was willing to pay top dollar.....if there are several unique bidders above a certain price point..thats the price point in which you can sell it back ..so realize that the more you want a card..the less of a chance someone will want the card as much as you price wise..but again..if its 100 bucks..people can pay that if dont love the card cause its 100 versus 500 ...

Another great point, I've had this general thought before as well. Statistically speaking the fat part of the bell curve is probably around the mid range price, whereas the higher prices are in the tails of the curve. Basically you have a much larger population that can afford a lower price and as you go up the population declines. A very good point to consider and I think if you look at something like a Montana PSA-10 that goes for like $12,000 you are talking about a pretty small population that would actually be able and willing to drop that kind of money on one card. It's almost like outliers so to speak.

But overall a good thought, I don't want to get over zealous and over buy on grade when I could be perfectly happy and safe in the happy medium.

Thanks

[pawpawdiv9]

1. Collect what you love
2. Buy the card, not the holder(grade)

I started with Mantle, and changed my focus over to RC's. As mentioned, you can find better cards in lower grades with better centering. (you can ask MattyC, as he is our so-called resident for finding centered cards- as hes been really hot on the subject)
There are people with $$$, spending it so freely to maintain a top registry grade.
You gotta find what kind of collector you are and stick with it, whether its a set builder or team/player collector and etc.

[jb67]

Originally Posted by Iron_man

Thanks guys for the advice, this really helps.

It's like last night I was looking and thinking about buying a 69 Topps-Kareem rookie PSA-6 that was really nice for around $290. But then I started to look at a PSA-7 that was about $500 and I could not decide which direction to go. Now the PSA-8 is easily $2,000+ so I kind of wrote that off, b/c with the volume I plan on buying at it would just be too expensive to start buying like that.

But I could go 6 or 7 and the whole idea of do I go higher or lower came into play and lead to me seeking advice.

Overall I'm looking to buy a LOT of the major stars RC so for example in football (Brady, Manning, Montana, Rice, Elway, Marino, Sanders, Walter Payton, Jim Brown, Bart Star, Johnny Unitas, etc.) Of course I'll be buying the most in cards in baseball but I think you see where I'm going with this. Major players from current back to the 50's and maybe later.

With that said unless I want to have like 60K invested in cards (which I don't) I'm going to have to be in the less than 1K (maybe mid hundreds) price range for a lot of these. However I will go over 1K for the really elite RC cards (Aaron, Mays, Clemente, Rose, Nolan Ryan, MJ, etc.)

Ok sorry for rambling on, but to the point I'm now leaning towards going with the higher grade versus lower so the Montana 9 versus the 8, the Kareem 7 versus the 6, etc. . Not looking to spend multiple 1,000s on any one card (unless it's one of the very few really elite cards) but working in that range.

I have to say I really love collecting, I don't what it is but I absolutely love the whole process and collecting these cards I dreamed of owning growing up!

Iron_Man,
In regards to you buying a PSA 6 Alcindor/Jabbar rookie compared to a PSA 7. I jumped back into collecting earlier this year and initially went with the PSA 7. I remember reading somewhere to buy the highest grade you can afford. Just like you I was not willing to shell out 2k plus for PSA 8 Jabbar rookie and settled for the 7. Then one day I realized that my 7 did not look near as good as this PSA 6 that I was looking at. I eventually sold my 7 and purchased the 6 because it was more appealing to my eye.

I would suggest that you do your homework before buying any of your mid to high-end rookies. Look at the VCP data. If you have not joined I would suggest that you do. I have used it and it has paid for itself already. Don't just look at the prices on VCP but look at images that have sold. The image can tell you a lot about why that PSA 7 went for the price it did (centering, sharp corners, etc..) If you are patient you can get some good buys which means you will be able to potentially resell without taking a big hit. I was able to resell my PSA 7 and break about even (adding in Ebay fees). It is safe to say that what you think you really like today can and most likely will change at some point. This has been my experience. Take it for what is worth. One persons opinion. Good luck and most importantly enjoy the journey.

[Bestdj777]

Personally, I'm a quantity over quality guy. I'd rather have 10 HOf rookies in PSA 2, which can be very aesthetically pleasing to me, than 1 PSA 8. Down the line, they may not appreciate in value much but I think there are always more people that can afford a low grade Mantle rookie compares to a high grade.

At the end of the day, buy cards you like at prices you are comfortable with and you can't lose.

[Ab]

hi iron man .Am starting to colect with the same exact thoughts thet you had in this psot from 2014. I as well have been calculating to spend 65k on rookie hog cards mainly baseball with some football too. will be concentratingn in mid range price . I was wondering how has it been going for you? Are you having fun? I am having a fit on the universal theme of being an investor versus a collector . let me know your thoughts.

[Neal]

1) Make a list of players/cards that you would like to get
2) Stick to that list as best you can
3) Sell cards that no longer have a spot in your personal collection
4) You may stray the course, which is okay
5) Enjoy

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Neal

1) Make a list of players/cards that you would like to get
2) Stick to that list as best you can
3) Sell cards that no longer have a spot in your personal collection
4) You may stray the course, which is okay
5) Enjoy

And you should take your own advice on 3.

[Neal]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

And you should take your own advice on 3.

sometimes the spot is secured, sometimes it isn't ..... the card prolly should be close to Bahston

[OlderTheBetter]

1. Buy what you like
2. Buy the card not the slab/grade
3. Emphasize eye appeal since you'll want to actually look at your cards
4. Vintage rookie cards are often butt-ugly so give them no quarter see #3
5. Don't listen too much to anyone in this forum since you have to determine
your own priorities. See #1

[jchcollins]

I think the answers to a lot of these questions depend on if you are collecting for investment or for the pure joy of it. Just me personally, but I always had a hard time actually enjoying the cards when I knew I was eventually going to try to turn a profit on something. I would become obsessed by the nuances of professional grading, and spend time fretting over corners under magnification and that sort of thing. Since I gave all that up, the cards I collect anymore always have to fit into my budget - which for what I collect (1960's and older) generally means mid-to-lower grade. Yeah, the cards aren't likely to be museum showpieces anytime soon, but they remind me of the older cards I collected as a kid and make me happy. My new philosophy means that I rarely if ever have to sell anything, because I don't buy things I can't afford in the long run. That being said, I have a fairly limited budget for old cards - so I have to choose carefully. I can certainly understand those who have a larger budget where buying higher grade and getting involved with things like set registries, etc. would be enjoyable. I just don't have the time or budget for all that. Each unto his own. On the whole though if you like that cards because of their connection to baseball and history, there should be (in my opinion anyway) a goal of getting personal enjoyment out of the cards first and foremost. Some may require PSA 8 level cards to do that; I don't. Good luck!


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[S_GERACE]

Originally Posted by gs1833

Nine times out of ten, you will likely better from an investment standpoint if you go with the higher grade cards -- the Montana 9 over the Montana 8, for instance.

That said, for my money I would much rather have the Montana 8 (which will have fantastic eye appeal, pretty sharp corners, etc.) and take the extra money I saved from the 9 and buy rookies of Marino, Elway, and Favre.

I agree with this type of logic. I have a PSA 8 Montana. It looks like a 9 and I only paid $80 for it two years ago. It hasn't risen in value at the same rate that a 9 has but I don't care. It's still a nice card with great eye appeal and I spent the difference picking up other cards that I wanted in great but not perfect shape.

[OlderTheBetter]

Originally Posted by S_GERACE

I agree with this type of logic. I have a PSA 8 Montana. It looks like a 9 and I only paid $80 for it two years ago. It hasn't risen in value at the same rate that a 9 has but I don't care. It's still a nice card with great eye appeal and I spent the difference picking up other cards that I wanted in great but not perfect shape.

And I agree with your logic as well. I have a few PSA 6, 6.5 with better centering and eye appeal than some of my 7s and 8s. Eye appeal is my biggest priority.

[drcy]

That was a great and practical point that a card may be worth a lot in book value, but since most collectors won't be able to afford it it can be hard to find a buyer.

In past years, I not only never had trouble selling a grade poor 1933 Goudey Babe Ruth (as example), but I often got far more than book value for it. Why? Because lots of normal collectors want that card, but usually can't afford it. So when a low grade example comes up, then is their chance to finally get one and you get lots of interest/bidding.

[Neal]

Ruth, Mantle, Gehrig, Williams, etc will ALWAYS sell .....